nerfed devourer for ranged`s because kindred was coming out ,but...

SiG DxD··3 votes·860 views

kindred goes warrior ,because it does physical and its good all time of the game ,meanwhile kayle who was one of the other users of devourer cant go warrior /cinderhulk and runeglaive is very low base ad ...-5 is now 51 attack at lvl 1 ,on an auto attacker ,nerfed because an item

are you serious having darius or other juggernauts at around 140 ad ,around 99 at lvl 12-14 while kayle at lvl 18 has 99

rip

do you ever revert nerfs when its over?

14 Comments

HaIlMonitor4 votes

I think Kayle is one of the champions that Riot hates. They wont let her be strong for whatever reason.

dunder kill3 votes

Because when she is strong, she is oppressively strong. Kayle was always annoying because she could output a metric ton of ranged hybrid DPS and remain super safe because of her Ult. She was kind of like Tryndamere except shes much safer because shes ranged and much harder to itemize against because its hybrid damage

fééd l0rd4 votes

lol you call her just ''strong''. she could literally 1v3 with some items without any risks.

BiBoX21 votes

Can you give me a (link of) high-level play of such scene?

Why I never see Kayle at Worlds 2015 and 2014, if she is "strong"?

The last time I see Kayle 1v2 was in LCS 2013, probably 2 and a half year ago...

SIayton2 votes

People go warrior on kindred BECAUSE devourer was nerfed. They'd still be going devourer on her if it wasn't nerfed and I personally think its still the better enchant for her.

Zair Umbras2 votes

Kindred's highest winrate and most common builds are still with Devour. Check for yourself. She's not a warrior jungle and Warrior actually is god awful on her considering her AD ratios are pure crap. 20% on Q, 40% on W (That's the highest since it's the only one that attacks often, but it'll spaz the hell out if any walls are around or if you switch targets), and 20% on E. Complete. And. Utter. Garbage ratios. She scales with Attack Speed and that's really it.

Beuhlakor1 votes

Actually building Devourer on her is crap.

Warrior is ten times stronger if you play Kindred with a lot of armor pen. You are right to say her abilities scaling is god awful.

But her passive and her AA are her main source of damages. And building a shitload of armor pen through runes and items (flat and %) on her is ten times stronger than any build with Devourer, in fact, armor pen gives her huge damages against both squishies and tanky targets.

If Devourer had not been nerfed, I would agree with you that Devourer > Warrior on Kindred. Unfortunately, Devourer is now simply garbage for ranged champions.

Zair Umbras3 votes

You.... you don't use Devourer for the extra AA, you use it for the AS. o.o The damage and such is just a bonus, really. Kindred has a base of .625 and gains 42.5% AS by level 18. Considering if you get rid of the Devourer, you only have 40% from BotRK and 10% from Trinity unless you're going to add in some random as heck AS item. Crit is near worthless on her since she's all about her passive's damage, which is why AS is her best stat. Plus her base AD at max is only 86, so PD without an IE is, again, worthless. Honestly, Trinity is almost worthless on her because it only gives a maximum of 172 damage compared to the usual 200+ on every other ADC.

You're best off with a Devourer just because of the AS. Warrior gives 45 AD and 10 ArP, which against a squishy, that's not bad. That's 45 extra damage per AA and then 10 ArP (Which honestly doesn't add much against a big beefy tank and even falls off against squishies unless you stack it with the 19 max from runes). Devourer gives about .3125 extra attacks per sec plus 30 base per AA and at Sated, it gives 50 damage per AA on top of an extra attack every 4th AA. So in 4 attacks with a Warrior, you'll have 1 extra attack via the AS and 1 extra shot of your passive instead with the devourer. So that's 6 passive and BotRK hits as well as 6 shots of the 50 magic damage, totaling (We'll say you only have your base 6 camps) 300 magic damage and 6 shots of 15.5%(7.5% from passive, 8% from BotRK) current health. So in the same time as 4 shots of 15.5% and 180 (4 times 45 AD) physical damage, you'll have done the 300 magic damage, 5 AA's worth of damage and 6 shots of your 15.5%.

I dunno about you, but the DPS boost from a Devourer just seems so much better in every form of the word and I'll prove to you that the ArP is actually worthless.

Say you're attacking a level 9 ADC with your Warrior enchant. We'll say it's Vayne since she's the most common. At level 9, Vayne has about 42 base armor, plus 9 from her runes for a total of 51. 51 is about 33.33% (About a third since the equation is Armor divided by Armor+100, so 51/151, which is about 1/3rd) where as with a Warrior, that 51 is now a 41. 41/141 is about 29%. That's a 4% difference in damage. Almost negligible.

Now, we'll say you're maxed off in levels, you've got your your Warrior, BotRK, LW, and a Trinity Force. Vayne won't have any bonus armor, just for easy stuff. She'll have 77 base with 9 from runes, so 86 armor in total. LW makes you ignore about 40% of that, so you're at about 42 armor. GUESS WHAT? NUMBERS ARE THE SAME AT LEVEL 9 PRE-LW! Hah. Yeah. 4% difference. Seriously. You're pretty much trading DPS that helps with Baron, Dragon, jungling, and against tanks to do 4% more to a squishy. Wanna know what it does to a tank with 200 armor? Well, 40% off of 200 is 120. 120 is about 54.5% and 110 is 52.3%. That's 2.2% difference. I'd rather have an extra attack every 3s and an extra shot of passive and BotRK every 4th hit, which with Devourer and BotRK alone at max level is... 42% from levels, 40% from BotRK, 50% from Devourer, so that's 132% bonus, meaning you do around 1.45 attacks per second, which is around 3 attacks per 2s. In 3s, you'll do 4 attacks for 5 procs of your passive and BotRK whereas with a Warrior enchant, you'll only have 82%, though with a Trinity you could have 92%. That's about 1.19 attacks per sec. It'd take about 5s before that .19 turns into a full attack gained where-as the .45 will be noticed about every 2s.

So... Yeah... Devourer on her is... a ton better. A lot more DPS in comparison to... 4% bonus to squishy... Like... lulz....

Also, Wolf, your W, scales off of 50% of your bonus attack speed... and he's got the same base as you.. So Devourer gives him 25% boosted AS.

Jacht1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Zair Umbras,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RT0JIY2B,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2015-10-24T23:34:05.546+0000)

You.... you don't use Devourer for the extra AA, you use it for the AS. o.o The damage and such is just a bonus, really. Kindred has a base of .625 and gains 42.5% AS by level 18. Considering if you get rid of the Devourer, you only have 40% from BotRK and 10% from Trinity unless you're going to add in some random as heck AS item. Crit is near worthless on her since she's all about her passive's damage, which is why AS is her best stat. Plus her base AD at max is only 86, so PD without an IE is, again, worthless. Honestly, Trinity is almost worthless on her because it only gives a maximum of 172 damage compared to the usual 200+ on every other ADC.

You're best off with a Devourer just because of the AS. Warrior gives 45 AD and 10 ArP, which against a squishy, that's not bad. That's 45 extra damage per AA and then 10 ArP (Which honestly doesn't add much against a big beefy tank and even falls off against squishies unless you stack it with the 19 max from runes). Devourer gives about .3125 extra attacks per sec plus 30 base per AA and at Sated, it gives 50 damage per AA on top of an extra attack every 4th AA. So in 4 attacks with a Warrior, you'll have 1 extra attack via the AS and 1 extra shot of your passive instead with the devourer. So that's 6 passive and BotRK hits as well as 6 shots of the 50 magic damage, totaling (We'll say you only have your base 6 camps) 300 magic damage and 6 shots of 15.5%(7.5% from passive, 8% from BotRK) current health. So in the same time as 4 shots of 15.5% and 180 (4 times 45 AD) physical damage, you'll have done the 300 magic damage, 5 AA's worth of damage and 6 shots of your 15.5%.

I dunno about you, but the DPS boost from a Devourer just seems so much better in every form of the word and I'll prove to you that the ArP is actually worthless.

Say you're attacking a level 9 ADC with your Warrior enchant. We'll say it's Vayne since she's the most common. At level 9, Vayne has about 42 base armor, plus 9 from her runes for a total of 51. 51 is about 33.33% (About a third since the equation is Armor divided by Armor+100, so 51/151, which is about 1/3rd) where as with a Warrior, that 51 is now a 41. 41/141 is about 29%. That's a 4% difference in damage. Almost negligible.

Now, we'll say you're maxed off in levels, you've got your your Warrior, BotRK, LW, and a Trinity Force. Vayne won't have any bonus armor, just for easy stuff. She'll have 77 base with 9 from runes, so 86 armor in total. LW makes you ignore about 40% of that, so you're at about 42 armor. GUESS WHAT? NUMBERS ARE THE SAME AT LEVEL 9 PRE-LW! Hah. Yeah. 4% difference. Seriously. You're pretty much trading DPS that helps with Baron, Dragon, jungling, and against tanks to do 4% more to a squishy. Wanna know what it does to a tank with 200 armor? Well, 40% off of 200 is 120. 120 is about 54.5% and 110 is 52.3%. That's 2.2% difference. I'd rather have an extra attack every 3s and an extra shot of passive and BotRK every 4th hit, which with Devourer and BotRK alone at max level is... 42% from levels, 40% from BotRK, 50% from Devourer, so that's 132% bonus, meaning you do around 1.45 attacks per second, which is around 3 attacks per 2s. In 3s, you'll do 4 attacks for 5 procs of your passive and BotRK whereas with a Warrior enchant, you'll only have 82%, though with a Trinity you could have 92%. That's about 1.19 attacks per sec. It'd take about 5s before that .19 turns into a full attack gained where-as the .45 will be noticed about every 2s.

So... Yeah... Devourer on her is... a ton better. A lot more DPS in comparison to... 4% bonus to squishy... Like... lulz....

Also, Wolf, your W, scales off of 50% of your bonus attack speed... and he's got the same base as you.. So Devourer gives him 25% boosted AS.

That... is tremendously helpful. I can't believe I've never done the math.

I've been building warrior because I like ganking a lot and not stacking, and I do like the CDR. But when you actually do the math... hrm. I have to attempt devourer now.

Zair Umbras1 votes

Just doin' what I do. Enjoying numbers a bit too much.

5 Stacks GG2 votes

they took 5 ad out because they buffed her e and made it useful even when not activated

SiG DxD1 votes

yet ,when E is active its still same E ,just without 5 ad every auto ,after 5 auto you can consider 875 g wasted ,like pickaxe y ? lowish ad is suck`ish

5 Stacks GG1 votes

when active the ap ratio got buffed by .5% ik its not a lot but can make a difference late game

BiBoX21 votes

So it's 100 AP, cost at least 3000 gold to make up for that. Which screw Kayle's early game. Not a buff if you ask me...

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