They aren't even "support", they are just unhealthy ranged champions with high base damage and low scaling, which makes them extremely strong in the bot lane where no one does damage without items and garbage in mid lane where champions can match your damage and out scale you.
I really want to see traditional supports like 
back in bot lane. And get these disgusting 
out of there.
BTW MYMU is a failure.
agbudar39 votesall three mage supports you mentioned have a 50-52% winrate. thats in no shape or form pushing other supports out of the meta
traditional supports also have a very similar playrate as these mage supports.
and in the case of 54% winrate (higher then any mage support) and a 10% playrate only trumped by zyra with an 11% playrate and a 52% winrate.
so please stop saying that mage supports is the only thing you see now.
Dextix LT13 votesWell, i have to say, he is not wrong.
Winrate as a signle statistic without any context does not mean anything.
Also, you make an invalid comparison that Janna is most played, yes she is, because she is still and will be the best defensive support in the game, this does not mean much however.
The problem is, i have noticed that i see only mages in my games as supports over and over again.
Hell, it is so bad for me, that i am now actually maining Galio support instead of Bard, because that is the only way to deal with that bullshit.
Beleive me, having a 0 item brand almost kill your adc or you in 1 rotation, is not my definition of fun in any way. That is not what supports do.
Velzard of Koz3 votesWinrate as a signle statistic without any context does not mean anything.
He also mentoined the pickrate as literally to show that traditional supports are picked just as much (and winrate to show it is not a thing of OTPs or that by picking them one outclasses theirself). I also see more non-traditional Mages but it is because of my elo, when I watch higher elo players they tend to have traditional supports more.
IcyPepper4 votesThe problem is, i have noticed that i see only mages in my games as supports over and over again.
http://matchhistory.eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUN1/1624350797/36951026?tab=overview Naut and Leona support
http://matchhistory.eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUN1/1624136276/36951026?tab=overview Morgana and Thresh support
http://matchhistory.eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUN1/1624134926/36951026?tab=overview Galio (you) and Karma support
http://matchhistory.eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUN1/1624149233/36951026?tab=overview Zyra and Galio (you) support
http://matchhistory.eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUN1/1596165095/36951026?tab=overview Bard (you) and Braum support
http://matchhistory.eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUN1/1596162586/36951026?tab=overview Thresh and Bard (you) support
.
I think "over and over again" might just be exaggerating, dude. There's nothing wrong with the occasional mage support pick (like Zyra and Karma are the worst offenders in the world), but tanks are being played against you too...
Dextix LT1 votesI was talking more on the grounds of when i am the support, and that happens often. What you showed, (Braum, thresh) For me those are unique times i can play against an actual support.
Bard is my main right? Yet i have to abandon him because mages eat him alive, there is a reason i am taking Galio as a support often.
IcyPepper3 votesThose were your last six games in a row, that doesn't really show "unique times."
You might be doing that thing where you only notice when things are bad, and assume that to be the ordinary. I know there's a term for it, but I can't quite remember it off the top of my head.
If you want to make a more convincing argument, you can try data collecting and presenting it visually. In the games listed, tanks and mages were played alike. You'd have a stronger argument if you said that healers were in short supply, if I'm being honest with you. Mage supports make up only one aspect of bot lane, and are just as likely to be played as the rest depending on the matchup. Even if one mage support was played in most of your games, I can claim that there's usually one tank support played in your games as well.
Show us some data. Your most recent games do not suggest that non-mage supports are "unique."
BALDG1VEN BOOMER3 votesWhy do people keep using winrate as an example of balance? Do you even play bot lane? Because all three of the mentioned Mage supports above can easily out trade the six mentioned above.
There's literally nothing fun playing against Mage supports especially Malzahar support, I had a Malz a couple of games ago who started blue and came into lane Lvl 2 then proceeded to stomp the entire lane, why is this even a thing? Winrate and playrate is just a stat the context of the thread was how unhealthy they currently are for bot lane.
The amount of times I seen a Mage support solo kill an ADC with Eye of the Watches and CDR boots is just plain stupid.
Trias0003 votesWhy do people keep using winrate as an example of balance?
What else do you want to use?
BALDG1VEN BOOMER2 votesWhy don't we look at their toxic kit instead of win rate and play rate
Verdade2 votesToxic kit? Wanna see a toxic kit? Here, take a look: 
BALDG1VEN BOOMER1 votesI'll agree those are toxic too but at least they do no damage low mobility and can be easily bursted.
Zaghyr5 votesSona? Doing no damage? HAHAHAHA
ForgiveColour5 votesI bet you dont even play this game
Privileged Jew25 votesFyi has been in the botlane for years. She has always been a viable support.
Champions like 
become "meta" supports for brief periods before returning to their traditional, underplayed positions in the midlane.
As a main, I wouldn't say her high base damage is unwarranted. In order to land her combo she needs to land her E, which is very slow-traveling for a skillshot, making it sidesteppable by most adcs who are smart enough to rush boots. All of her spells are relatively close range and highly choreographed. The plants don't do a lot of damage on their own until you get a liandry's. Most of Zyra's lethality comes from a lockdown burst EQWR combo and her counter-engage R ruining enemy ganks.
The Deckowner3 votesZyra used to be a viable support that is fair to play and play against, now she is a RNG champion that can miss her skillshot but still have her super strong plants with automatic champion targeting AI do all the long range high base damage harass for her.
Annie support used to be very strong, Rito instantly nerfed her range for it. Zyra Malzahar Brand destroying the game for months but Rito did nothing. IDK what is this bias with rito.
Privileged Jew5 votes[{quoted}](name=The Deckowner,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R5pvbEdy,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2017-02-05T05:58:42.731+0000)
Zyra used to be a viable support that is fair to play and play against, now she is a RNG champion that can miss her skillshot but still have her super strong plants with automatic champion targeting AI do all the long range high base damage harass for her.
Trust me, she was even more "cancerous" when her AOE was in the shape of a circle instead of an Anivia wall, and her passive allowed her to fire a 300-500 true damage projectile when she died. Nothing has changed in the 4 years I have been playing her.
LankPants8 votesTrust me, she was even more "cancerous" when her AOE was in the shape of a circle instead of an Anivia wall, and her passive allowed her to fire a 300-500 true damage projectile when she died.
The rectangle hitbox is far more abusable than the old circle. What you can do with the rectangle is place it so the centre is slightly behind the enemy. If they want to dodge the spell when you do this they have to run forwards. It wasn't possible to do this as well with the old Q, you can try but the enemy can realistically dodge right or left because of the shape of the circle. The rectangle doesn't allow you to dodge in this way.
The passive was also just bad. It had too long of a start up to be usable. Replacing the passive was a good idea, replacing it with RNG was not however.
Nothing has changed in the 4 years I have been playing her.
Mid Zyra died. That's what changed. She's not viable mid anymore. She's suffered every time Riot's nerfed support Zyra without any compensation buffs for Zyra mid.
50000000000000001 votesHer Q range isn't that long. If she's putting Q slightly behind you, she's either putting herself in danger, or it's basically an all in situation.
LankPants2 votesThe only time when you'd actually be scared of the damage off of a support Zyra Q is in the lane phase. In the lane phase Zyra can generally afford to move the extra 50 units to set her Q down behind you compared to centring it on you. We're not talking about placing the Q so far behind the enemy that they can stand still to dodge, we're talking about putting them on the front edge.
Due to the shape of her Q you can only dodge in 3 of the 8 cardinal directions, if you're on the west of the ult you can dodge northwest, west or southwest. Any of these directions involve running at Zyra and making her E very easy to land. This means your choices if a Zyra does this are either eat a Q and plant AAs or eat an E and plant AAs.
Zyra's old Q couldn't do this, she could force you to not run backwards but not force you to run forwards. In the same situation with the circle you could also run north and south to dodge. You could always dodge the circle in at least 5 directions unless you put yourself against the wall.
Aptest2 votesadcs who are smart enough
does not compute
LankPants7 votesAs a
Her base scaling is too high. She gets too much damage from passive means like levels and too little damage from AP. It is a problem when a champion builds absolutely nothing, has no gold and does mage level damage.
SnugglePuggle948 votesThat's what she is- a mage. She does mage level damage. [zombie-brand-facepalm]
And no, she doesn't do mage level damage when she hasn't built anything. That's just the salt coming out of you.
3TWarrior3 votesactually, if you check zyra's base damages at level 6, it's about 500 damage
that's with no items at all
if you add any items at all, it quickly becomes noteworthy and those damages were based without masteries
if we add something such as thunderlords, we get quite a bit tacked on
let's look at the base numbers: 500 from just her kit
then 3% of the opponent's max or current health depending upon when zyra gets to attack them with auto or ability
then 60 damage base from warlords and 10% of ap
then up to 14% bonus damage on top of her own damages but for safety's sake, let's assume it's just 9% due to a lack of the opponent being below 40%
this comes to a decent tally of around 701 magic damage before magic penetration and not including auto attacks
now, let's see if she is surviving on a somewhat gold deprived build (let's say she has a sightstone, her default ap item (which is either coin or spell thief but i'll opt for the latter) with spellthief involved as well, it comes to 731 damage
now let's factor in 2 auto attacks for roughly 100 more damage, that comes to a grand total of 831 damage before involving her penetration stats.
all of this before penetration stat checking and also while having the least powerful AP build possible
let's add in the AP values of her kit at this point assuming she took the masteries to increase AP for higher damage
the total now comes to 858. throw in ignite at this point and that total comes to 1028
this means that one kit rotation from zyra with the least possible amount of items can shred a marksman target for 93% of their hp
93%...
let's factor in damage calculations using highest possible magic pen (roughly equal to base magic resistance for ranged characters) factoring in exhaust
essentially, that is 93% of hp gone with just a spellthief's edge and sightstone
huh, go figure...
it costs both summoner spells, but I think the 300 gold bonus to your ADC is worth it, don't you?
bear in mind this is a complicated setup as y ou would have to spellcast first and then ignite and finish the combo, but essentially within one spell rotation, Zyra has handed her ADC a kill
SnugglePuggle943 votesYeahhh nope. Speaking from experience just one rotation does not take most of the ADC's health. And any Zyra taking ignite to the bot lane is downright STUPID, because she's a squishy ass champion and needs exhaust to survive, or at least give her a few seconds to get away.
"then 3% of the opponent's max or current health depending upon when zyra gets to attack them with auto or ability" Uh where are you getting these stats from? Unless people are putting AD in their runes, Zyra's AA damage isn't worth shit.
"then up to 14% bonus damage on top of her own damages but for safety's sake, let's assume it's just 9% due to a lack of the opponent being below 40%" Assuming you meaning people taking Morello's on her? Otherwise that damage isn't applied. And most Zyra supports don't take that, they go for Liandry's + Rylai's/Void Staff.
"now let's factor in 2 auto attacks for roughly 100 more damage, that comes to a grand total of 831 damage before involving her penetration stats." Nope. I'm a level 7 mastery Zyra and my AA damage is less than 80, and they do even less damage than that so this is completely irrevelant.
You also didn't factor in the opposing ADC's resistances, plus their heal unless the occasional one that took ignite or something, plus their support's exhaust/heals/shields. Sorry but unless their summoners are down + heal/shield is on CD + support possibly out of mana, a Zyra with no items is not dealing that much damage to get their ADC a kill. She has to poke them down then do a rotation to get a kill.
3TWarrior3 votesI included exhaust, yes, I did in fact factor in resistances and showed you the base damage before spell pen and that then a mage can achieve full spell pen for near or neutral damage
also, even with an adc being slightly resistant to attacks, Zyra would still do about 50 damage per auto attack and the 3% bonus damage is a mastery from walking into the bushes...
also, this entire thing is based upon the support's inability to heal. If for instance it was a soraka support, she could heal twice and use her ultimate and heal spell to account for about 30 or 40% of this but nothing is ever perfect
zyra can unleash her entire combo in a matter of seconds and for the majority of that, the opponent will be crowd controlled
for instance, let's say auto attack, ignite, exhaust, and then a full spell rotation, the damage is there. of course, that only accounts for the lower elos, but so long as there is a target (such as if caitlynn were to land a trap) then there is no reason why her full damage would not happen other than player inability
do some research on her stats and the masteries and see what you come up with. Of course an ADC should run magic resist runes to account for their low scaling, but some opt for outright damage
even so, if you account for 30% of the damage with resistances (if they were potentially optimal as i'm not sure what the exact format is but the player could achieve a decent amount by sacrificing early offense), let's say that leaves them with neutral amounts of base magic resistance total as the wikia seems to account for by stating the amount a total of 25 magic resist would account for though if we use their exact formula, 30 magic resistance: 100/130 = 76% of damage is dealt
now, let's apply that to my figures and bear in mind that is their optimal scenario unless they bought items early for hexdrinker
for the sake of saving some typing, i'm goign to include armor in these results (and yes, each auto attack is roughly 52 damage at level 6 from a zyra so with 2 that comes to 104 instead of my 100 estimate)
all of this in mind, it still comes to 846 damage,
with this in mind, it will take roughly one ability and one auto attack on the part of the adc or 2 to three auto attacks to kill the opponent
Soraka can increase that amount, but so long as the opponent is not given optimal circumstances, it is still almost a guaranteed kill with less than 300 hp remaining
corki, ezreal, varus, caitlynn, jinx and any marksman who has abilities to cast within their early game can finish this amount
optimal circumstances
if they have a soraka to heal or a nami to end the fight, then yes, the ADC will survive
blitzcrank can throw this math out the window as any opponent within range long enough is going to die
it's all situational, but yes, a support zira with absolutely attrocious gold income can finish off a marksman that has not specifically dedicated runes to countering such damage
also, within the build I set up, the masteries increase allied damage to the target by 3% , although minor, it can add figures
SnugglePuggle943 votesNo Zyra EVER takes that mastery. That is a JUNGLER mastery or suits the likes of champions that like to hide in the bushes like Teemo. So that is irrevelant.
There is a reason why her full damage isn't always applied -FLASH, and the inability of actually hitting her spells, such as her miss timing her E or the enemy having the awareness to dodge it.
I run MR in my runes as an ADC, and any one that doesn't will just get blown up faster and is stupid in their own right for not doing so. Anyhow, any competent ADC wouldn't let Zyra get close to them to let her AA anyway, so if you take that into account that "extra" damage of 50 per auto is out.
Not everything is guaranteed. I'm sorry but I still don't believe you. Unless the ADC doesn't build defenses and isn't stupid, a Zyra isn't taking them down without poking them a bit first (early game). Sure if she takes most of the HP if she HITS everything, even if she traps them in her ult, if her ADC is competent enough to follow her in then yea it should be a kill unless the enemy support is a healer.
Blitz? I've flashed many times out of his Q engage so he isn't always guaranteed a kill either. Now if he's a good one and manages to E me along with it then yea I'm most likely dead.
Come on bro, you can't obviously say you haven't had any of your ADC's completely ignore your engage, huh? I've had many just sit there while farming totally oblivious that they could have a kill right now. Or they take a long bit before they suddenly realized we both are getting engaged on and heal/flash way too late.
3TWarrior3 votesif you are crowd controlled, you can not move to avoid zyra's range
yes, I can state that I would rather have the mana regeneration, but this build was to show that such damage is possible and at 1100 hp, the maximum damage this adds is 30
yes, I have had ADC's completely ignore my engage before but a proper adc does capitalize
also, I have specifically stated that this build is without gold assistance at such an early level...if I were to play just for explicitly damage (which is boring as all get out unless i'm brand, sona or chogath) I would easily have at least another AP item to add to her damage for an extra hundred or more damage (2.25 ap ratio total from plants and abilities) and the result is still the same only that a mage support is more likely to accidentally claim the kill than to have a perfect setup
SnugglePuggle942 votesSorry don't believe it.
3TWarrior2 votesI direct you to my other comment
someone got me to redo my math and there was indeed a discrepensy, but it was a difference of about 100 damage total for 920/1100
if zyra has a 
instead of sightstone (or any combination to make 40 more ap such as two 
) it comes to 1029 (roughly, I found another error but it was a difference of about 6 damage )
here is the link to the comment: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/R5pvbEdy-i-am-disgusted-by-the-mage-support-meta?comment=000100020000000000010000
I will no longer perform the math as I have written 3 pages of information today and wasted roughly an hour arguing the math that league runs on
Paquay3 votesDude, I don't k ow where you got your math from, but you're so far off the mark I would need an atlas to find you.
3TWarrior4 votesquick summary: kit without , the damage is 920 / 1100
: the total is 1029 / 1100riot's site and the much more accurate wikia...
q = 60 (+ 60% ap) e = 130 ( + 50% ap) r = 180 (+ 70% ap)
throw in plants for 87 (+45% ap if there's only one plant attacking the champ)
that actually comes to a total of 457(not 500 but it was a rough statement)(and she is capable of more if the opponent does not get to crush her plants) + 2.25 x AP value
then there's thunderlords (60 + 10% ap) greenfather's gift (33 damage roughly or less if she can use it though it's just a buff)
if she has only spellthief and masteries to buff her stats, she comes to 12 AP (overall roughly 27 bonus damage)
that comes to a total of 551 magic damage
now let's add in spellthief's 30 damage, 581
that's all magic damage, then let's add 104 from 2 auto attacks
685
then we add in ignite for a total of 855 total
if we then factor in the 9% total damage bonus to spells, using the previous number of 457, 855 + 41 is 896
then let's check the other numbers for bonus damage, for her ignite, it comes to 9% bonus of 15.3
that's 911
the same 9% applies to her auto attacks for another 9 to 920
it's not as high as before with a 43 point cut in damage from the base, but that's still pretty decent considering the opponent will only have 180 hp left, well within the kill zone
if we add in an item that she is capable of having, (though idk why they would have this specifically other than for AP) it adds 100 damage exactly to the previous amount and then a 9 % bonus tacked on top for 109
with this total, if an ADC was not fully buffed against magic damage using runes, the ADC would only have 71 hp left
a single auto attack from a marksman could finish that.
these values also assume that the opponents have not been harassed previously
i'll give you that my math was indeed off, but a support with almost nothing at all can still be very deadly
it's not a 100-0, but then again, the supports don't want to 100-0 unless they're blitzcrank
LankPants2 votesThat's what she is- a mage. She does mage level damage.
And I'd have no problem with that, if she was building mage. What I have a problem with is her building 
and dealing the same damage as a mid lane mage who invests heavily into AP. A 260 AP build should not be high damage for a mage, if it is you probably have too much base damage.
In Zyra's case this is very true, it takes her 760 AP to double the damage on her plants, her main source of damage. Her plants deal 114 damage at 18 before any AP, if you have 760 AP, a very high AP build they deal 228 damage. Nami's W deals 230 damage, if you have the same 760 AP build Nami's W deals 610, almost triple its base. And Zyra is meant to be the mage.
SnugglePuggle943 votesIt's because her plants apply on hit effects, and since hers are AOE she does more damage to more targets.
sheldonbunny16 votesFor the umteenth time, Zyra and Brand have been in bot lane for multiple seasons. This is nothing ground breaking or new. Malzahar was tried last season from the mid season mage update on and off though not as predominantly.
Zyra has been a secondary support from the very beginning, no different than Morgana was at the start. Also of note, all three are not overly difficult to deal with if not outright counter. Karma does an amazing job dealing with Zyra's zoning if you don't go full utility on her and give her some actual teeth to bite back with. Brand's shortcoming is his low movement speed and need to get in far closer than other ap supports to deal damage. As for Malzahar, he's a pain but Zyra was the original ap support lane bully long before he showed up and squashes him flat.
The point being these are just examples. There are plenty of other ways to deal with them. Them being in botlane is nothing new and unless you're new to League, should already be in your knowledge to deal with if you're in the botlane.
Dextix LT3 votesNo, they have not been in these numbers. There was one or two occasionaly, but that is all. Now, all i play against is mages, mages and mages. And believe me, it is hard to counterplay them, when their one Rotation can almost kill you entirely.
How does brands "low range" shortcoming come into play in bot lane in any way? Will a support poke him out, No, supports dont have that kind of damage. And if you are not a tank and come even close, you die. Brand just by standing there is such a big threat that you are even afraid to try to farm, because due to his damage, he could nearly kill you in one rotation.
The problem is how easy it is for them to do damage on bot instead of actually supporting. And how much power they have.
Mages being in botlane is not new, but having to see them there in every goddamn game, is, and i seriously dont want that anymore.
Steel Blossom6 votes still one of the most broken shits in the game, and the worst cancer for anything that has to dive. So I dunno what you're talking about.
SEKAI6 votesBecause here in LoL, we forbid meta shifts, ESPECIALLY in bot lane.
In bot lane,
it has to be a mandatory Marksman and a ward slave. EVERYTHING ELSE MEANS THE GAME IS SHIT, DISGUSTING AND WROOOOOOOOOOOOOONNNNNNNNNGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG
R7 Factor5 votesif you want traditional champs back in support, we have to get rid of autofill
The Deckowner2 votesI don't even think we have a shortage of support player at all, Rito just fucking putting supports in non-support roles and forcing people to autofill to support. I even have games when someone got autofilled to mid which makes no sense because mid is the most populated role.
chipndip16 votesAuto-fill is the way it is now BECAUSE we have a shortage of support primary players. We have people that can play support, or might play it a little. We don't have many support mains.
MorgManBasher5 votesEw, gross. Disgusting Janna and Soraka players. Please get them out of botlane.
CoolKnightST5 votes is an official base disruptor support.
& are recognized as supports.
is a result of a identity issue that currently provide to much disruptor tools to a champion that suppose to be designed as a primary battle mage.
AP supports are fine, they are relatively ballanced. The issue is the meta. If you overnerf these guys you will just see enchanter supports. It won't bring the tanks supports back.
junglerboy165 votesFirst it was "I hate tank supports!"
Then it was "I hate Shield supports!"
Then it was "I hate poke supports!"
Then it was "I hate sustain supports!"
Then it was "I hate burst supports!"
Then it was...
You see, the thing about the meta is that champs cycle in and out of popularity, so just because you don't like a certain style of support doesn't mean it is cancerous or doesn't belong in the game. Maybe you forget, but when etc. were strong, they were also considered overpowered and anti-fun to play against, just like are right now. That's not even mentioning the fact that half those champs at least have been meta within the past year or so
Blitzcrank for instance, considered a classic support by the majority of players, is downright obnoxious to play against. When he is good, he has an overly potent burst combo that leaves him exceptionally safe while hard CCing an enemy champ for multiple seconds while bringing a lone enemy into the waiting arms of his team. He decided team fights on a single hit or miss. This was far less healthy than having a bursty mage-like support (although I gotta say the OG mage "supports" like Morg and Annie are pretty bad too).
The problem with support as a role is that utility has become too prolific within League's cast of champions, in tandem with the ever growing damage creep. "Old school" supports are essentially irrelevant in any iteration of the modern meta because you don't need a pure CC>Heal>Poke bot anymore, you can just find a team with the necessary supplemental abilities. That's why it works to have a support who's main contribution is bursty engage, because you've got multiple sources of DPS, plenty of frontline (for what its worth in the current nuclear war tier damage comps) at least two other champs with hard CC, etc.
Furthermore is the issue of gold. Supports are earning more gold than ever, and this is actually NOT GOOD for "traditional" supports, since their main selling point is not needing gold because of what they bring in utility. As I just stated, their standout utility isn't standout anymore, so being able to function without gold in a role which actually makes plenty of gold now is essentially obsolete. This leads to them either being useless because another champ that uses gold better is more potent throughout the game, or because these champs once given gold are too strong and subsequently nerfed to keep from being oppressive.
TL;DR: Classic supports were only relevant when their function was unique (high function and capability on a minimal budget, unique combination of traits that couldn't be found in other classes) and have at this point become irrelevant, thus leading to the cycle of support types tied to what is meta in the other roles.
SteelMankind4 votesPeople have this weird idea that supports "aren't allowed" to deal damage. That mentality is what leads to Zzz supports like Janna or Soraka, which in turn is what causes people to hate getting autofilled support (they feel like they have to play boring shield/heal champions over fun mages that deal a ton of damage)
Trias0002 votesYes, fuck diversity and varying playstyles! Support should always be ADC's bitch!
The Deckowner4 votesI love how when mages can destroy traditional supports they call it diversity, but when supports are being played in solo lane they call it broken and immediately nerfed to shit.
Ariel the Cruel4 votes
"You shall not leave bot lane." - Nerf
"You shall not leave bot lane." - Nerf
"You shall not leave bot lane." - Nerf
"Why is it still top!?" - Nerf
"F it. We give up." - Gut
1 year later
"We've decided to finally accept Lulu top is a thing," - micro buff to lane Lulu
(>_>)
UhmmHiEveryone2 votesThat's TRUE. As a 
main, seeing mage sups are literally my nightmare even I fully leveled my W first and got all the CDR I can get, also I'm playing with 
+
just to be more efficient on bot lane. But, that mage sups, are literally OPing the bot lane. Please, stop mage supping, it makes lives of us true supps hell.
Notice: I'm not an excellent player, she has a real deep sight, allot of ways to become a hard counter, and I only have a very small portion of this...
VelvetCrotch2 votesI dont play and never really played . But i like the champ, i really do. Dont really see her anymore. Thats sad. 
Finn Teh Human1 votesI totally agree because now it's literally based on how the support plays that decides whether botlane loses or not. There have been so many times where the ADC isn't good at all but the support is a Malzahar so it doesn't fking matter.