http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02836/putin_2836730b.jpg
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
https://thetonygrands.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/wpid-michael-jordan-laugh.gif?w=350&h=200&crop=1
Nah really this is a good start, pls keep nerfing this freelo champ
umbraˉ18 votesThese nerfs aren't even close to what he actually needs
Vistha Kai6 votesVlad nerfs are marginal. What puzzles me are Ryze nerfs. What did I miss?
Erockandroll16 votes[{quoted}](name=Vistha Kai,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R1EdwEeX,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-07-10T20:42:31.011+0000)
Vlad nerfs are marginal. What puzzles me are Ryze nerfs. What did I miss?
Arch angel's staff and Rod of ages go buffed this patch. This is probably a compensating nerf.
Neo Cyrus4 votesThat and he wasn't properly nerfed previously which is why he was permabanned even before this patch.
junglerboy163 votesYeah, but with the Galio buffs and the all around fact that Galio counters Ryze hard (he's an MR tank mage who has high early game poke and strong disengage) I don't think he's deserving of top ban. Giants gaming used Galio against Ryze to amazing effect yesterday in the EU LCS, Werlyb went something like 2-2-10 and wrecked in teamfights.
Imotekh Kharn1 votesWhy would you get rod of ages on Vlad?
Erockandroll1 votes[{quoted}](name=Imotekh Kharn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R1EdwEeX,comment-id=000000000001,timestamp=2015-07-11T17:26:31.736+0000)
Why would you get rod of ages on Vlad?
different conversation going on, We were talking about Ryze. some one Brought up the Ryze nerfs, and I mentioned that his core items got buffed.
The Ellimiist1 votesIdk I haven't had too many problems with ryze myself but he is still the top ban apparently.
Paress5 votesThose aren't the nerfs he needs. What he needs is a nerf in his sustaining Q : less ratio on his heal or base healing.
biomaster3 votespardon me if I'm not wrong but isn't his q like his identity? as rito says "yada yada strengths yada yada weakness yada yada diversity." yo know like why they only nerfed atk speed on zed or missile speed on riven's ult. their not gonna touch his "core" ability.
Insomnia1234o00o5 votesNah, people will still get destroyed until they stop being wimps and actually all-in him.
badooga1 votesI like playing 
against him, with a 
to start and some MR from 
he can actually do fairly decent against him
AutoreactiveCD44 votesI thought the putin was a gif, after staring I was sure he was looking back at me plotting my downfall
Simplicate4 votesNerfs? What nerfs?
The Loveless4 votesGood thing I don't own Vlad yet. Meanwhile Ryze is a fucking incurable cancer with spell vamp.
"But Ryze is always banned"
Not when I'm first pick and ban randomly.
stealthfox944 votesPlay Darius against Vlad and dunk his ass.
WutsKraken4 votesVlad, one of the champs doomed to be either super OP or super UP based on current meta and itemization...
Aelvr3 votesI bet the UN wishes it could nerf Vlad.
YumaS2Astral2 votesAnd everyone said that Vlad would be broken with the changes
1011001110004 votesHe is, that's why they're nerfing him?
YumaS2Astral6 votesIf anything, Vlad is the same thing as he was before. All the changes did was make it so that he can sustain better against enemies that stack magic resistance, otherwise he remains the same as before, he as actually been nerfed since he has less sustain against squishies.
1011001110002 votesShat the hell are you talking about, they increased his sustain across the board and buffed all of the items that he generally builds. There is absolutely nothing about Vlad that got nerfed, only buffed. Hence why they're actually nerfing him.
biomaster3 votesuh no, they buffed the hybrid hp/ap vlad, you realize there are people who go full ap vlad that this is actually a nerf for right?
plus there was a trade off for 
. If you read the notes they clearly stated they were nerfing it against squishies (like your standard lane opponent) and buffing it so that it heals you more against characters with higher mr (damage is still reduced as usualy, you just get healed for the total before subtraction) so technically a buff but idk why that earns him nerfs.
I'm not sure what else your talking about when you say "they increased his sustain across the board" in case you havn't noticed is kinda the only sustain item for ap mages that aren't hybrid. As for the items they just balanced it out, honestly before it was pretty tough building those items on vlad because they gave only a fraction of the other ap items most gave and the hp although helpful and synergized well with his passive really didn't cut it.
It would make him this sort of generalist, he was kinda tanky, he kinda hurt, but much like mordekaiser you kinda get left with this lackluster champ that didn't make to much of a splash in the game.
As for freelo I haven't a clue what you're talking about. I don't know he exact number or % but even IK you don't see alot of vlad's on the rift. (almost as if he were a lackluster champ)
I just feel so disappointed the communities knee jerking the ban button again less then a week after the change. WW i got, there were bugs and insane issues with the true dmg, but cmon? Aren't the items working as intended?
FantasySniper4 votesAre you 
so sure 
it wasn't 
a buff?
KONO RUBICK DA4 votes is shit on him
got nerfed
got nerfed
FantasySniper1 votes
Rylai's was buffed WoTA was (ambiguously) buffed (Anything > 91.92 MR w/ VS OR 59.75 MR w/o VS = higher healing) Rabadon's was buffed, making his full build worth 43.485 more AP.
His final build only costs 205 more gold.
KONO RUBICK DA1 voteswota was nerfed, it heals less early game and heal less against minions which is bigger than increasing his heal late game
FantasySniper2 votesHis healing against minions barely matters past laning phase, but being able to sustain tank harder during the fight itself is always considered a buff.
biomaster3 voteshe built those before anyways, well idk which vlad build rabadon's but still, wasn't the whole point of these change to give not burst mages like vlad and swain and other's a bit more viability vs the burst mages the whole point of these changes? Or did they nerf luden and zhonya's for another reason?
I Miss Cannon2 votesOnly bad vlads built Liandries before.
biomaster2 votesidk I felt it went with the whole tank/hybrid he's supposed to be. Plus t kinda became the bread and butter of alot of mages cause the tank meta. Out of curiosity mind telling me what a good vlad builds?
I Miss Cannon1 votesThe only core items on Vladimir are Hextech Revolver, the new Rylais because it's just broken af, Sorcerer Shoes and maybe Zhonyas. Always get Hextech Revolver first and upgrade it later after finishing your second item. After the change you can even consider not upgrading it until the enemy tanks got some MR. Rest should be built according to the situation. Good items are: Abyssal Scepter, Zhonyas, Rabadons, Void Staff, Ludens Echo is also somewhat okay and maybe an early Haunting Guise for the magic pen (sell it later though). I feel like the biggest noob traps are Spirit Visage (the thing offers no offensive stats and you're a mage after all, the 20% healing increase doesn't really make a difference, the 10% CDR isn't worth it, could be good if it was 20% and the HP > AP bonus from his passive is horrible while the AP > HP bonus is really good) and Liandrys (you don't even have real CC and that thing doesn't synergize as good with your kit as other things do, the only champs this item will ever be really good on are Rumble, Swain, Lissandra and maybe Zyra [tell me if i forgot someone]). I mean Liandries is not as horrible as building an Archangels Staff on him or something but there are just items that warrant an item slot more.
biomaster2 votesyeah i find it hard to just pick 6 items on vlad. I personally enjoy the spirit visage plus abyssal sceptre together when their team is high in ap dmg. as for liandries i find that getting it with rylai's gives him the cc he needs to make it a good purhase. Thats said i've never tried building my 2nd item after revolver, thanks for the tip. all in all i've learned alot and am appreciative of the advice
Flagrock2 votesI feel like the biggest noob traps are Spirit Visage (the thing offers no offensive stats and you're a mage after all, the 20% healing increase doesn't really make a difference, the 10% CDR isn't worth it, could be good if it was 20% and the HP > AP bonus from his passive is horrible while the AP > HP bonus is really good) and Liandrys (you don't even have real CC and that thing doesn't synergize as good with your kit as other things do, the only champs this item will ever be really good on are Rumble, Swain, Lissandra and maybe Zyra [tell me if i forgot someone]).
You mean picking up a % hp pen in the TANK META where tanks run with 3-4k hp so you're doing over 100 BONUS DAMAGE just from the % pen and not even counting the 300 hp (which gives you 8 ap admittedly not much but still something) and the 80 AP (which gives you 112 hp which is pretty decent) in stats. So, you get 88 AP 412 hp and 4% hp pen which with someone at 4k hp is an extra 160 dmg, that's pretty huge. Yes, not all teams have tanks so obviously this isn't a "CORE FOREVER" item. However, Vlad's items are pretty match-up based though.
Also, Spirit Visage as a "bad item"... really? So, you are trying to make a mage who has to get into the fights to do damage be completely a glass cannon with almost no tankiness. Really? So let's look at some numbers. Spirit Visage gives 400 hp, 10 ap (Vlad's passive) MR (we're looking at dmg here) 10% CDR and 20% increased healing from all sources. So, you now are healing for 18% of dmg dealt for all your spells instead of the normal 15% (because everyone grabs WotA). Ok, now let's look at the CDR portion. Your Q is a 4 second cd at max ranks, your W is 14 seconds, and E is 4.5 seconds. So, that 10% cdr is giving your Q a CD of 3.6, your W a cd of 12.6, and your E a cd of 4.05. Yes that's not insanely huge, however think about a team fight. You are able to get more rotations of your spells off due to the CDR and being able to SURVIVE through the dmg because you are more tanky. Also, you can HEAL for more so if you come out of that fight lower hp, you get more sustain off of minions through SV, AND you can have your pool up more to get out of sticky situations. Yes, you might get "more dmg" on each cast of your spells with your deathcap but with a .6 and .45 ap ratios are they worth it when your base damages are really good for a mage? I won't lie again, SV is a situational pick-up again, but by no means is it a noob-trap. It is a very good item on Vlad it's just there are so many other good items you have to build according to the team.
So, idk what type of glass cannon vlad build you do, but by nature for Vlad to do damage he has to get a bit close to his targets and is pron to being focused so although you might have a higher upfront dmg build, if you die then how are you going to be doing damage? Also, since vlad is a versatile champion with his builds, sometimes he does have to be a "front-line" for his team so he will have to be tankier. You are underplaying the strength of simply being alive and taking punishment for your team where you should be a threat, but by taking the focus, your ADC (who should be pumping out dps) should be able to delete people as they can sit back and just wreck.
tl;dr: and are good items on Vlad and stating otherwise is stupid. However, they are situational just like every other item that you pick up other than due to the multiple ways to play vlad and to fit into a team comp correctly.
I Miss Cannon1 votesWith troll pool and Zhonyas you are able to get your rotations off and still stay close to the enemy without being bursted down. And i repeat myself, building more AP results in gaining extreme amounts of health due to his passive. You should always take CDR blues on Vladimir expect against pokey AP matchups and that + WotA is all the CDR you need. Capping CDR is honestly overrated by many people on Vladimir, being able to deal 60% of the health of the enemy ADC/any other squishy alone with his ult proc because you built full offensive expect the semi-defensive items like Abyssal and Zhonyas is far better. You most likely won't get more than 2 spell rotations done before the teamfight is over. Why should i get a defensive item on a mage that can withstand focus for a long time and scales so incredibly well into lategame? I just can't understand that. If you need MR so bad because double AP comps or whatever, get an Abyssal Scepter. That thing also gives you HP thanks to Vlads passive. Why should i also act as a tank with a lategame-hypercarry now when my support, my jungle and my top lane if i play him mid are already tanks that soak up tons of damage? Just makes me cry when i see Vladimir players building Randuins and Spirit Visage and occasionally even Warmogs like they're Trinity Force bruisers. And one last thing: Can you please tell me how a build with 100 of each resistances if you've built Abyssal Scepter + Zhonyas and 3-4k HP is "glass cannon"? You seem to forget Vladimir gets defensive stats by building offensive while his passives HP > AP scaling is terrible. And Liandries isn't necessarily a bad item, but there are just thousands of better options that synergize better with him, you already need a Wota, Sorc Shoes, Rylais is also too good since the update, Void Staff outclasses Liandries penetration if the enemy tanks stack MR, Abyssal Scepters aura also help other team members with magic damage, Zhonyas should be bought almost every game, the only thing that matters when to bought it, same for Rabadons.
Flagrock1 votesWith troll pool and Zhonyas you are able to get your rotations off and still stay close to the enemy without being bursted down. And i repeat myself, building more AP results in gaining extreme amounts of health due to his passive. You should always take CDR blues on Vladimir expect against pokey AP matchups and that + WotA is all the CDR you need. Capping CDR is honestly overrated by many people on Vladimir, being able to deal 60% of the health of the enemy ADC/any other squishy alone with his ult proc because you built full offensive expect the semi-defensive items like Abyssal and Zhonyas is far better. You most likely won't get more than 2 spell rotations done before the teamfight is over. Why should i get a defensive item on a mage that can withstand focus for a long time and scales so incredibly well into lategame? I just can't understand that. If you need MR so bad because double AP comps or whatever, get an Abyssal Scepter. That thing also gives you HP thanks to Vlads passive. Why should i also act as a tank with a lategame-hypercarry now when my support, my jungle and my top lane if i play him mid are already tanks that soak up tons of damage? Just makes me cry when i see Vladimir players building Randuins and Spirit Visage and occasionally even Warmogs like they're Trinity Force bruisers. And one last thing: Can you please tell me how a build with 100 of each resistances if you've built Abyssal Scepter + Zhonyas and 3-4k HP is "glass cannon"? You seem to forget Vladimir gets defensive stats by building offensive while his passives HP > AP scaling is terrible. And Liandries isn't necessarily a bad item, but there are just thousands of better options that synergize better with him, you already need a Wota, Sorc Shoes, Rylais is also too good since the update, Void Staff outclasses Liandries penetration if the enemy tanks stack MR, Abyssal Scepters aura also help other team members with magic damage, Zhonyas should be bought almost every game, the only thing that matters when to bought it, same for Rabadons.
First, what Vlad player ever builds 
or even 
. The last time I have ever seen a Vlad build is back in s2 when it gave you 1350 hp and then it was still not a great buy. Also, you fail to realize that Vlad is played in TOP LANE just as he is in mid. I mostly play him top, but when I do play him mid my build is different due to the lane matchups and different summoners I can take since I am not forced into 
to match my enemy. Also, you can't zhonyas/troll pool in stuns or silences. So, if you are going full ap and working simply on your "hp from passive" and "OMG I HAVE LOTS OF RESISTS FROM 2 ITEMS!!!" then you will simply be melted by any AD carry or mage. News flash, 100 armor is almost achievable for most champions simply with runes, masteries, and being lvl 18. It's not much and any AD carry with as many items as you will eat you alive for breakfast, and you have to get close enough to touch that AD carry with no dashes so you're probably going to be walking by Mr. Tank if the AD carry has any brains who will cc you and then you will be shreded because with normal pen your 100 armor is really only 65 armor (thanks LW+masteries). So, you might be able to "kill" an AD carry with 2 rotations but with your build that is 4 seconds to do. Even if you zhonyas or troll pool that's only half the time, so unless the AD carry is off in no man's land they'll be healing via lifesteal. So, maybe full AP vlad can work, but still you have to be adaptive with your play and builds and it seems like you have a cookie-cutter build for every team and that's how you lose games. If you want an example of cookie-cutter builds failing look at the TSM vs GV game. The shout casters kept commenting that TSM really needed to adapt their build paths to the game itself and stop going cookie-cutter builds because it wasn't going to work vs the enemy team and if that had made better decisions in items like AS boots over magic pen on Corki since he needed to AA more since the enemy team was stacking lots of MR they would have done a lot better.
tl;dr: Vlad is amazing because of his adaptive build paths. If you refuse to realize that people play vlad top along with mid and sometimes you have carry tops (Riven) and refuse to adapt your build for each game then you will lose due to ignorance and stubbornness.
I Miss Cannon1 votesYeah, keep up with insulting me, way to good discussions. If you get chain-cced that 500 HP from SV won't help you either, especially when the enemy adc bought Botrk. I always build versatile acccording on how the game is going but SV is honestly just no option. If you don't want to listen to the stubborn stupid ignorant silver player you can ask any high Elo Vladimir main, they will always tell you Abyssal Scepter is the better Mr option.
Flagrock1 votesYeah, keep up with insulting me, way to good discussions. If you get chain-cced that 500 HP from SV won't help you either, especially when the enemy adc bought Botrk. I always build versatile acccording on how the game is going but SV is honestly just no option. If you don't want to listen to the stubborn stupid ignorant silver player you can ask any high Elo Vladimir main, they will always tell you Abyssal Scepter is the better Mr option.
One, if I have insulted you that was not my intent. However, if you really want a good discussion trying to call me a "stupid ignorant sliver player" is not helping it at all. Also, if you're going to try and insult someone about their rank at least take like a minute and learn their rank. So, since you find calling people "stupid ignorant silver players" I actually took the minute to pull up your rank which is silver. Hmm, is it really an insult to me or your low self-esteem that you have to try and insult others. I am not going to state my rank because it does not matter within the discussion, but if you do want to take the minute to find out, you'll know that I'm not insulted when someone like you insults me because I know where I am and it's not in Silver V like you.
However, if we want to get back to the true discussion and actually look at a "high Elo Vlad" player, idk... maybe a pro player in the LCS, because they probably know something right? you find this So, a pro player built and not 
. Hmm... yeah is never picked up by pro players or ever used. Ok, then why did T8's player grab it? As I looked through the NA LCS games, the ONLY player who grabbed was Shiphtur. The other vlad builds consisted of going more of a mage build (mostly coming from Seraph, but to be fair they have only 1 win and that's because of their mid and AD carry not Seraph's build). So, when you state that "any high Elo Vlad" player will say that is better than then wouldn't the pros who play Vlad agree with that, but yet we see that's not true. Well maybe NA pros don't know anything! Ok let's look at other pros.
Well, if we look at odoamne from Europe's H2k who are #3 in Europe atm, he built . But but but it's not an option and any high elo player will tell you not to build it! Huh, the top laner on the #3 team in Europe is wrong about his build? [(http://www.probuilds.net/guide/EUW/2197929780/21001130)]. Maybe even Europe doesn't know how to play so let's go to Korea where they are the best!
Well KT Rolster's top laner Ssumday even built as an item over . [(http://www.probuilds.net/guide/KR/1964093981/1252130)] Even Koreans build as an item, even though it's not an option. So, instead of making wild accusations about high elo people believing this, please look at high elo or pro player builds, because let's face it they know how to optimize champions better than you or me especially with their coaching staff theory-crafting for them and giving them input. So, unless you want to argue with the "high elo Vlad" players who are making a living by playing this game competitively, I'm pretty sure that is actually an ok item on Vlad.
tl;dr: When multiple pros from different regions (examples of Europe, NA, and Korea) build on Vlad they might KNOW what they're doing over someone who isn't a "high elo vlad" player like you or me.
I Miss Cannon1 votesOne, if I have insulted you that was not my intent. However, if you really want a good discussion trying to call me a "stupid ignorant sliver player" is not helping it at all. Also, if you're going to try and insult someone about their rank at least take like a minute and learn their rank. So, since you find calling people "stupid ignorant silver players" I actually took the minute to pull up your rank which is silver. Hmm, is it really an insult to me or your low self-esteem that you have to try and insult others. I am not going to state my rank because it does not matter within the discussion, but if you do want to take the minute to find out, you'll know that I'm not insulted when someone like you insults me because I know where I am and it's not in Silver V like you.
I don't know how you read that i meant you by this. It's pretty obvious i talked about myself in an ironic way......... And i'm pretty sure i'm not gonna take participation in this discussion after this post anymore. In every link you posted the enemy team had so many AP champs and CC that these pro Vladimirs even bought mercury treads and even mid laners and ADCs wouldn't have built wrong if they would have bought Merc Treads and other Sources of MR. You really have to understand the circumstances these items are built in and not only "THESE PRO PLAYERS BOUGHT THIS IN THIS SINGLE MATCH". I don't want to repeat myself thousand times that Vladimirs passive also grants you more than enough HP by building AP while building Liandries gives you 8 AP lol. But yeah, keep being ignorant. Way to go.
junglerboy162 votesRylais buff was pretty big for him, WotA was a huge buff when facing heavy MR but a nerf vs minions and squishies, Liandry's was a buff since it is a good item on him in theory, just not good enough to warrant a slot before the buffs, and Rabadon's is obviously a buff if you built Vlad more with the items that have been buffed.
air tiger1 votesCan anyone link to nerfs?
air tiger1 votes[{quoted}](name=Zair Umbras,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R1EdwEeX,comment-id=000d0000,timestamp=2015-07-11T07:20:15.285+0000)
http://www.surrenderat20.net/p/current-pbe-balance-changes.html#balance
Thank you, Zair
MihaiPeagu1 votes
Krizalid1 votesRiven mains be hating.
48983507DEL11 votesI feel like they are nerfing the wrong thing. He's supposed to be a hypercarry, meaning his late game should be really strong, but they are nerfing the amount of damage he does as he ranks up his abilities.
They are forgetting that he is also a lane bully, and should be putting the nerfs mostly on the early ranks of his abilities to actually make his early game weak.
Yea I suppose he's weak against high burst mages, but those types of champions top lane are bad in an overall team composition. Meanwhile, Vlad get's tanky and has sustained damage to compliment a team comp well.
Even tho i hate the whole "Make it a skillshot!" mentality, targeted, mana-free, ranged sustain shouldn't exist in the game, and makes his kit insanely difficult to balance, as well as making it no fun to play against, especially if you're a melee tank w/out burst.
That being said, any nerf to a broken (gameplay wise) champ is still applauded by me. But please, for the love of God, fix is toxic kit.
Abyssphere1 votesI feel like they are nerfing the wrong thing. He's supposed to be a hypercarry, meaning his late game should be really strong, but they are nerfing the amount of damage he does as he ranks up his abilities.
They are forgetting that he is also a lane bully, and should be putting the nerfs mostly on the early ranks of his abilities to actually make his early game weak.
Yea I suppose he's weak against high burst mages, but those types of champions top lane is bad in an overall team composition. Meanwhile, Vlad get's tanky and has sustained damage to compliment a team comp well.
Even tho i hate the whole "Make it a skillshot!" mentality, targeted, mana-free, ranged sustain shouldn't exist in the game, and makes his kit insanely difficult to balance, as well as making it no fun to play against, especially if you're a melee tank w/out burst.
That being said, any nerf to a broken (gameplay wise) champ is still applauded by me. But please, for the love of God, fix is toxic kit.
The annoying thing about Vlad's Q is that it makes no sense for it to be a skillshot given what he's actually doing with it. He picks a person and drains blood from them. How can that be a skillshot unless he throws a syringe at them?
ArkenStorm1 votesWhat nerfs? I only saw ryze nerfs, nothing on Vlad. Can I has link?
