Why nerf Reksai?

blfUvZ8Ybu·Jun 29, 2016·4 votes·2,543 views

Meanwhile Sivir is problem since patch 6.2

Rito u be fair.

21 Comments

TrolosaurusJun 29, 20161 votes

Has Rek'sai gotten a lot of play recently? I haven't been on as much cause I got a seven day workweek.

blfUvZ8YbuJun 29, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Has Rek'sai gotten a lot of play recently? I haven't been on as much cause I got a seven day workweek.

Reksai came into meta patch 6.9. But we see Sivir since patch 6.2.

Research topic?

I think Riot's other double standard and their Adc love.

RiotRiot SotereJun 29, 20167 votes

It's a change primarily directed at competitive play, where Rek'sai is arguably the top jungle pick. The Sivir example holds weight, though our impression on where they differ is that Sivir plays into team compositions and brings new champions to the forefront, whereas Rek'Sai doesn't have great synergies but does block out opposing junglers (Eve and Lee Sin come to mind) that otherwise might be picked. Small distinction, and we've been watching Sivir most of the season but she tends to be overshadowed by one Marksman (Lucian up until a few patches ago) or another (Jhin and Ashe seem to be picking up more play in the most recent competitive patch).

SaltyKrackaJun 29, 20163 votes

I really think that nerfing her ult's cooldown is very much the wrong way to go with this. This will not only affect her in competitive play, but also in Ranked play, where she's actually pretty damn balanced.

Go ahead and take another look (heh) at Tremor Sense nerfs, because the one you've currently got there is just...bad.

RiotRiot SotereJun 29, 20163 votes

What's bad about the Tremor Sense nerfs presently on PBE?

SaltyKrackaJun 29, 20162 votes

Nothing. What's bad is the Void Rush nerf that just went up.

You know, the one that adds 30 seconds to its cooldown at all ranks?

RiotRiot SotereJun 29, 20163 votes

Oh. Gotcha. Misread your comment. Thought you might have additional feedback on the Tremor Sense thing.

My impression on the competitive vs. ranked play with Rek'Sai ultimate is that in competitive because kills tend to be a bit slower, it's used even more to just edge out a farming lead. If you feel like it's optimal to continue farming, you use it on cooldown. See a lot more people in ranked play who set it up near objectives and lanes and use it to counter a gank or fight for an objective. I think this is the cool thing it brings to the table. The hope is that if the cooldown was more restricted, pro play would mimic the neater use case and use it less for generic farming advantage.

SaltyKrackaJun 29, 20163 votes

I mean, I can understand the vision for it with that, but 30 seconds at all ranks is a pretty huge nerf.

Add that in to the fact that you're already testing Tremor Sense nerfs, and I think it's just way too much for a champ who isn't even particularly out of line in competitive play.

QuinterroJul 1, 20161 votes

IMO nerf to termor sense is too big. Doubling her termor sense tick rate? It'll be so clunky. As Rek'Sai main I've got a lot of kills by following it and using my burrowed Q to finish my oponent. Now it will be almost impossible.

You should somehow compensate "competetive nerfs" for Ranked players. Maybe buffing her AD Ratios? No one on proffesional scene builds warrior. I had loved Rek'Sai with Warrior before Cinderhulk came. And i think it wouldn't affect competetive play even if they started building Warrior, because you don't gank that much on LCS, LCK etc.

Illâoi Evê SiônJun 29, 20161 votes

If you are going to nerf Rek'Sai to allow Eve and Lee to be picked more easily, can you not also buff Lee Sin? He has a pretty strong presence in ranked at the moment with early game ganks and mid game "assassin" potential (he can shut down one squishy target if he lands a good Q).

GixiaJun 29, 20161 votes

Maybe S@20 just hasn't finished datamining it yet, but I'm not seeing any Tremor Sense nerfs.

That said, something somebody (I think Meddler but maybe someone else) said recently was that nerfing Tremor Sense would give room to add some sort of power satisfaction back into her kit, because while strong, her low damage and lack of things to do in a teamfight leaves her feeling unsatisfying. Any word on that?

DorkunedAurasJun 29, 20161 votes

I'm looking at S@20 and not seeing anything about the tremor sense nerfs.

What are these nerfs?

I really want to know this, as I'm already TERRIFIED for my 260k mastery bae Rek'Sai.

Edit: this just popped up on S@20

I think you underestimate how crippling the iteration time nerfs will be. I believe even nerfing it down to 1 from .75 will be rough.

blfUvZ8YbuJun 29, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Sotere,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QYhke8iO,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2016-06-29T20:10:49.493+0000)

It's a change primarily directed at competitive play, where Rek'sai is arguably the top jungle pick. The Sivir example holds weight, though our impression on where they differ is that Sivir plays into team compositions and brings new champions to the forefront, whereas Rek'Sai doesn't have great synergies but does block out opposing junglers (Eve and Lee Sin come to mind) that otherwise might be picked. Small distinction, and we've been watching Sivir most of the season but she tends to be overshadowed by one Marksman (Lucian up until a few patches ago) or another (Jhin and Ashe seem to be picking up more play in the most recent competitive patch).

Did you see LCK? Sivir is first pick at LCK.Lucian got hard nerfs and Sivir is in meta since patch 6.2

http://lol.gamepedia.com/2016_LCK/Summer_Split/Champion_Statistics

3 big pro scenes

LCK SUMMER SPLİT. Sivir picked and banned in of Games 65%, Reksai 68%.Reksai fourth, Sivir fifth. NA LCS Sivir 45%, Reksai 80% You may be right but Reksai's win rate is very low. EU LCS Sivir 33% Reksai 45%

I do not see much difference.If It's a change primarily directed at competitive play, Sivir is more problem than Reksai.Because Sivir is in meta for five months.

Moreover soloq win rate is important for you.Reksai's soloq win rate 49.5% Sivir's 53%.

blfUvZ8YbuJun 29, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Sotere,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QYhke8iO,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2016-06-29T20:10:49.493+0000)

It's a change primarily directed at competitive play, where Rek'sai is arguably the top jungle pick. The Sivir example holds weight, though our impression on where they differ is that Sivir plays into team compositions and brings new champions to the forefront, whereas Rek'Sai doesn't have great synergies but does block out opposing junglers (Eve and Lee Sin come to mind) that otherwise might be picked. Small distinction, and we've been watching Sivir most of the season but she tends to be overshadowed by one Marksman (Lucian up until a few patches ago) or another (Jhin and Ashe seem to be picking up more play in the most recent competitive patch).

Also I wonder.What do you think about Tristana, Corki and Kalista?

RiotRiot SotereJun 29, 20165 votes

They're some of the lower performing markspersons. Of the three, I feel like Corki is in most need of attention: the other two still have spot play at the competitive level and decent reasons to be picked up. I think Corki brings a lot of unique things to the table (magic damage based, the PACKAGE) but he is undertuned to the point that even if your composition needs those things you're unlikely to pick him.

Noticed your posts in another thread of a similar vein, "why not Sivir." Even in the post-Lucian nerf world, his playrate still dwarfs hers. We do tend to be biased against champions that have oppressive early to mid-games because they make other picks nonviable. Sivir gets a bit more leeway because she doesn't lock other champions out of the marksmen role to the extent Lucian has.

blfUvZ8YbuJun 29, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Sotere,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QYhke8iO,comment-id=0000000100020000,timestamp=2016-06-29T20:32:33.630+0000)

They're some of the lower performing markspersons. Of the three, I feel like Corki is in most need of attention: the other two still have spot play at the competitive level and decent reasons to be picked up. I think Corki brings a lot of unique things to the table (magic damage based, the PACKAGE) but he is undertuned to the point that even if your composition needs those things you're unlikely to pick him.

Noticed your posts in another thread of a similar vein, "why not Sivir." Even in the post-Lucian nerf world, his playrate still dwarfs hers. We do tend to be biased against champions that have oppressive early to mid-games because they make other picks nonviable. Sivir gets a bit more leeway because she doesn't lock other champions out of the marksmen role to the extent Lucian has.

You're right about Corki but Lucian's play rate has always been high so it does not make sense.

I said in general meaning but probably Sivir is more stronger than other Adc's.I believe more LCK

blfUvZ8YbuJun 29, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Sotere,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QYhke8iO,comment-id=0000000100020000,timestamp=2016-06-29T20:32:33.630+0000)

They're some of the lower performing markspersons. Of the three, I feel like Corki is in most need of attention: the other two still have spot play at the competitive level and decent reasons to be picked up. I think Corki brings a lot of unique things to the table (magic damage based, the PACKAGE) but he is undertuned to the point that even if your composition needs those things you're unlikely to pick him.

Noticed your posts in another thread of a similar vein, "why not Sivir." Even in the post-Lucian nerf world, his playrate still dwarfs hers. We do tend to be biased against champions that have oppressive early to mid-games because they make other picks nonviable. Sivir gets a bit more leeway because she doesn't lock other champions out of the marksmen role to the extent Lucian has.

Meanwhile you forgot Tristana your comment.Also I'm sure Riot balance team forgot Tristana.

ProfDrDeathJun 29, 20161 votes

Where do you think should Corki be buffed primarily?

To me, with the (deserved) nerf to his passive, in addition to lowering his Sheen-based burst, he also lost a good amount of his consistent damage. Would it make sense to buff his base AS (not AS growth factor, but the direct base AS) a bit to compensate for this loss in sustained damage?

LankPantsJun 30, 20162 votes

I feel like keeping Lee out of the meta is inherently diversifying the meta. Lee is a shitstain of a champ, when ever he's at the top of the meta the jungle meta boils down to 2-3 viable champs.