Like, jungle is literally the single most important role now that the game is centralized around damage and snowballing your team.
I'm seeing noobs go 0-2 IN THEIR OWN JUNGLE
Like how the heck does that even happen? They don't even ward properly lol
PhearBunny6 votesIts because S tier junglers are the only viable junglers atm. If you play anything less, and get matched vs a S tier jungler, youre going to be behind 3+ levels, die in your jungle repeatably, and lose every objective+scuttle
RekSai CoffeeCo4 votesIts because S tier junglers are the only viable junglers atm. If you play anything less, and get matched vs a S tier jungler, youre going to be behind 3+ levels, die in your jungle repeatably, and lose every objective+scuttle
Yet there are people defending this jungle/scuttle crab meta as good/fun/balanced and it shows there is no diversity in it to be truly had.
Hyquiem1 votesExcept it would be right to go make an opposite clear for the first crabs but the second one however would take its time,
Marshbouy1 votesSeriously. If you don't play something that isn't S tier then you get invaded super early on by someone who is 1 level above you and probably at mostly full HP. It's ridiculous and painful to deal with.
Azadethe2 votesNot even close to true. I can keep pace with Tier 1 junglers with all of these, many of whom are not junglers:
I can level 6 shortly after Mid does every single game on all of these, and most of them are very anti invadeable.
KRUGS ARE MORE IMPORTANT THAN SCUTTLES.
PhearBunny2 votesNot even close to true. I can keep pace with Tier 1 junglers with all of these, many of whom are not junglers:
I can level 6 shortly after Mid does every single game on all of these, and most of them are very anti invadeable.
KRUGS ARE MORE IMPORTANT THAN SCUTTLES.
vs reasonably competent players, no you cannot.
Azadethe1 votesI am Diamond II. Yes. I can. All these champs have ways to 1) out compete meta junglers on camps without using smite and 2) can Outduel Meta jungler kits if they hit their skill shots/cc.
I have never successfully been invaded on Pyke or Zyra. The only one that can successfully invade Poppy is Udyr. Ornn cannot be successfully invaded. Leona can outduel meta junglers, or CC until she can reach safety. Morgana pure up outduels and prevents invades from being successful.
Ahri is probably the only outlier. She can win duels But she's vulnerable to camps a little bit as a jungler. I can do her, but I take more damage on her than any of the others. I only end her jungle path with about 60% HP.
Zyra takes no damage in jungle at all.
GripaAviara1 votesI'm curious how the hell you keep pace with Ahri jungler vs a good kha
Azadethe1 votesWell for one thing that's a trick question. Kha is a horrible clear before he has 
. His primary early game gold is ganking other junglers on low HP.
In other words.... Wards. Have Charm ready. Don't use it on monsters. Keep flash ready and have a wall you're ready to flash over.
Her clear isn't that bad because she has a low CD on Q and W. And since the first jungle item for mages is now 
, she gets a chunk of AP and CDR in the same shebang. And it's actually a pretty strong jungle item when completed now..... because it's 80 AP, not 60 AP, and a lot cheaper than the 3200 g Equivalent.
After you have Ult you just save it to jump away from Kha when he leaps.
(I just had a joker who I blocked because he int fed in one of my games and fed again last night..... win the spot as my opposing jungler in a game about an hour ago. Dude knew exactly where to invade to catch me off guard as 
when I play . He knew I go Red > Krugs..... so he went directly Krugs after blue and boxed me in lol... I got out with a flash over his Pillar but by the time I was in turret I was so low that I had a choice to either keep running or kill him under turret.
He got FB, but I took him with me with Q.
He proceeded to invade me and counter ward all my friggin buffs, so I kept just farming around him, saving E. This continued until I had about level 6.... and then his game was over.
I went from like 1/3 to 14/8/14...... At once point I literally Quadra'd their team solo.... because one person tried to duel me..... and then a chain of them kept coming to try to save the person I was dueling... I'd be just close enough to the next person to have a combo ready to eat them lol..
That was hilarious.
Then a bit late in game.... 
tried to ult Me and 2 of my teammates while we chased him..... I pulled him back into his own ult lol. )
Pyke is funny shit when you think through all the tricks...
-Pulling Kindred out of her own ult.
-Eing Camille inside her own ult, and then just turning her arena around on her.... because she can't use her movement skill while inside her ult....
-Pulling bard inside his own ult....
-Pulling 
across his bomb to the other side so he's thrown toward you not away...
-Playing Leap Frog with 
List goes on and on lol.
BigBellBrute1 votesI'm curious how the hell you keep pace with Ahri jungler vs a good kha
I want to see Jungle Morgy out clear a graves, then walk up and pimp stomp him at level 3 in a fight over the rift scuttler.
PhearBunny1 votesI am Diamond II. Yes. I can. All these champs have ways to 1) out compete meta junglers on camps without using smite and 2) can Outduel Meta jungler kits if they hit their skill shots/cc.
I have never successfully been invaded on Pyke or Zyra. The only one that can successfully invade Poppy is Udyr. Ornn cannot be successfully invaded. Leona can outduel meta junglers, or CC until she can reach safety. Morgana pure up outduels and prevents invades from being successful.
Ahri is probably the only outlier. She can win duels But she's vulnerable to camps a little bit as a jungler. I can do her, but I take more damage on her than any of the others. I only end her jungle path with about 60% HP.
Zyra takes no damage in jungle at all.
You are not even ranked on this account. And your last played games were S7, you had a miserable win rate on everything you played. Only one champ over 50%(Minimal amount of games played).
Please direct me to your diamond2 main, where you main jungle Pyke and Zyra, are D2, with a 75% win rate.
Azadethe1 votesI don't disclose my main. And this was never a main lulz. It was played for 3 months.
PhearBunny1 votesI don't disclose my main. And this was never a main lulz. It was played for 3 months.
yeah, that's a convenient lie. Better luck next time.
Azadethe1 votesExcept it's not a lie. Account was created on September 26th in expectation of the October 10th released of Evelynn Rework. Played Season 7 for 1 month. Then stopped operation on December 26th after a couple months of Preseason.
Exactly 3 months.
I wouldn't be caught dead playing ranked in Preseason with my main.
You can believe what you want but you always will look weak if your arguments boil down to attempting to rank shame someone.
PhearBunny1 votesExcept it's not a lie. Account was created on September 26th in expectation of the October 10th released of Evelynn Rework. Played Season 7 for 1 month. Then stopped operation on December 26th after a couple months of Preseason.
Exactly 3 months.
I wouldn't be caught dead playing ranked in Preseason with my main.
You can believe what you want but you always will look weak if your arguments boil down to attempting to rank shame someone.
Difference between Rank shaming, and calling out a liar.
Azadethe1 votesYet I'm not a liar.
BigBellBrute1 votesYet I'm not a liar.
Then post from your main and back up your lofty words.
BigBellBrute1 votesExcept it's not a lie. Account was created on September 26th in expectation of the October 10th released of Evelynn Rework. Played Season 7 for 1 month. Then stopped operation on December 26th after a couple months of Preseason.
Exactly 3 months.
I wouldn't be caught dead playing ranked in Preseason with my main.
You can believe what you want but you always will look weak if your arguments boil down to attempting to rank shame someone.
When someone claims they are D2 and playing tough competition to make an argument, it is not rank shaming to look up you account and see whether your words square with the facts.
Azadethe1 votesD II is nothing like Master/Challenger.
PhDs Nuts3 votesNot even close to true. I can keep pace with Tier 1 junglers with all of these, many of whom are not junglers:
I can level 6 shortly after Mid does every single game on all of these, and most of them are very anti invadeable.
KRUGS ARE MORE IMPORTANT THAN SCUTTLES.
You can keep pace with their farming speed (not on all those champs, a few are straight garbage). Apparently they're not invading your jungle at all or contesting scuttle crabs, because that's where you lose.
Azadethe1 votesActually I win most scuttles because my mages have more pressure. I generally get to scuttles at the same time they do, except I'm level 3 and they are level 2. So I bully them hard, reset the scuttle and try to set up a first blood on them. I also time my smite with the river push part of my grind.
Lotus Bloom1 votesI've found that if you or your teammate play Jungle as a casual you generally have a bad time, and this is especially the case if you don't follow all the patch notes. I've found that if your jungler tends to have zero crab control, you're not likely to have any neutral control. It feels really awful to deal with.
The role used to be way more simple; farm the jungle, and then look at your lane's state. If your top, mid and bot had priority then you could just rotate and make a dragon play. If there was a lane without priority then you could try and determine if a lane was gankable and do that.
Now it's super important to make an effort to pick these crabs because of the gold and EXP value is insaine. Ward the dragons and herald. Look to gank to get your lanes ahead.
Instead of just needing to know how to do a few things, there are several things you need to do to be effective. Which make the bad "I only play one way" junglers even worse. It's truly a coinflip.
Jungle needs a tutorial.
Azadethe2 votesScuttle is not the end of the world and in fact early game is fine to give up. You're better spending your seconds clearing your own jungle so the other jungle doesn't use the large camps to pad his lead.
Scuttle is why Udyr is back. People chase scuttle and get out dueled.
I just had a friggin top FB level 1 at my Blue last night and give him the easiest game of his life. Sad thing is that Udyr had a reputation of going 3/13's etc.... a real feeder. That game.... because of that First Blood.... He went 9/3 and controlled the map.
Lotus Bloom1 votesScuttle is not the end of the world and in fact early game is fine to give up. You're better spending your seconds clearing your own jungle so the other jungle doesn't use the large camps to pad his lead.
Scuttle is why Udyr is back. People chase scuttle and get out dueled.
I just had a friggin top FB level 1 at my Blue last night and give him the easiest game of his life. Sad thing is that Udyr had a reputation of going 3/13's etc.... a real feeder. That game.... because of that First Blood.... He went 9/3 and controlled the map.
I mean, I'm talking about ranked play where your're you should be looking to create advantages lIke a gold and EXP lead for yourself so that you can be stronger. If you ignore every crab you WILL be behind in Experience and Gold.
If you're talking about normal games, or Bronze-Gold, then yes you can likely ignore them and do okay, but that doesn't mean that you should. You're denying youself gold and EXP, not to mention vision to the team that can be used to deter and protect from ganks
Azadethe1 votesI am Diamond II. And I only play ranked. Scuttle is not superior gold until post level 9, and it's not the best XP path until level 7. I will grab it when I can just for the purpose it's a good way to recover HP, and it's relatively easy to kill, but if there's a champ there..... I don't care about risking it.
Krugs by far are the most rewarding camp for most champs. Abuse them, not scuttle.
Lotus Bloom3 votesI am Diamond II. And I only play ranked. Scuttle is not superior gold until post level 9, and it's not the best XP path until level 7. I will grab it when I can just for the purpose it's a good way to recover HP, and it's relatively easy to kill, but if there's a champ there..... I don't care about risking it.
Krugs by far are the most rewarding camp for most champs. Abuse them, not scuttle.
I'm going ahead and say that you can believe what you want, and I will disagree. Really though, Krugs are not a more optimal choice for a decent number of junglers due to the amount of time that it takes to clear them. That's fine, you can clear how you want to.
Might I suggest that if you're going to boast about being D2 you should post from said account, and not the Season 7 Silver account that's sporting a 40% win rate on Eve, and everything else played was a support
Azadethe1 votesKrugs are okay on any champ that starts 
. They buffed the burn, increased the heals, and you get a smite in the middle of them it you are running smiteless red. They offer almost DOUBLE the XP of any other camp, and more starting gold (Krugs like 172, Scuttle 70).
and Lulz. If you actually go back and look at the Eve games.... 1) they were on new rework with old runes.... where Eve couldn't do Drakes/Baron due to no sustain and 2) on one of the games I even went 
to see if I could heal allies with Rylai's + Censer on Stoneborn Pact with Eve's Q effectively enough. It's called a training account honey <3
Vlada Cut1 votesIt's not that the junglers suck, but rather their adaptability to the changes is. At least mages adapted to the mana change ~ oh wait im sorry it's all mid irelia and assasins now.
