Jhin's Ult vs. Xerath Ult

Kivolan··3 votes·1,778 views

I kind of feel like Jhin is the AD version of Xerath, and as someone who plays Xerath quite a bit... it bothers me. Not only does Jhin outrange Xerath's Q with his W, but Curtain Call is far more useful--and deadly--than Xerath's ultimate.

Not sure if Xerath is being looked at for the mage update, but I'd like to see his ult get some of the same treatment that Jhin gets. Namely, refund on the cooldown if all shots aren't fired as well as a slow on impact (though, honestly, I wish they'd just remove the slow on Jhin's ult. It's way more than he needs). Xerath's ult is much more difficult to land, with one less shot, and far less damage at ranks 2 and 3. He really needs some love when his identity is basically being taken by another champion.

3 Comments

Stars Shaper1 votes

Being a Xerath main I can really feel for you. Xerath in this meta simply doesn't have a place, his tools are generally good but his style makes all of the Keystones not worth the effort and you end taking the "less worse".

Right now I'm having a lot of fun playing Jhin for the same reason I started enjoying Xerath, he can being a treath no matter where he is and a well performed play gives you high chance of obliterating the enemies, plus his kit does perform good with Keystones.

What Jhin gains in it should be "countered" by Xerath's being an AoE version of him but yet this doesn't happen. From what I could extrapolate from Rioters Xerath is going to have some minor touches in the mage update (nothing big, probably in terms of Twitch/Lucian size as Riot likes to put it) plus they will look at AP itemization as a whole (again, not as big as the MM update though). Artillery Mages (Lux, Xerath and Ziggs) might be looked at but surely after the Assassin class spot.

Edit: About the ultimate, many asked for a zoom out but I don't agree. Xerath range is a lot more and places him in the center, add to this that aiming with Xerath ultimate is far harder than aiming Jhin's and zoming out would make it a major struggle. About it's effectiveness (and range of explosion) I agree it needs some work because landing 3 hits isn't such a big reward. Plus, it needs a HUGE visual update, I'm tired of seeing soap bubbles.

Kivolan1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Stars Shaper,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PqkFjE2U,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-03-16T09:35:33.950+0000)

Being a Xerath main I can really feel for you. Xerath in this meta simply doesn't have a place, his tools are generally good but his style makes all of the Keystones not worth the effort and you end taking the "less worse".

Right now I'm having a lot of fun playing Jhin for the same reason I started enjoying Xerath, he can being a treath no matter where he is and a well performed play gives you high chance of obliterating the enemies, plus his kit does perform good with Keystones.

What Jhin gains in it should be "countered" by Xerath's being an AoE version of him but yet this doesn't happen. From what I could extrapolate from Rioters Xerath is going to have some minor touches in the mage update (nothing big, probably in terms of Twitch/Lucian size as Riot likes to put it) plus they will look at AP itemization as a whole (again, not as big as the MM update though). Artillery Mages (Lux, Xerath and Ziggs) might be looked at but surely after the Assassin class spot.

Edit: About the ultimate, many asked for a zoom out but I don't agree. Xerath range is a lot more and places him in the center, add to this that aiming with Xerath ultimate is far harder than aiming Jhin's and zoming out would make it a major struggle. About it's effectiveness (and range of explosion) I agree it needs some work because landing 3 hits isn't such a big reward. Plus, it needs a HUGE visual update, I'm tired of seeing soap bubbles.

I take Deathfire Touch on Xerath, simply because if you're decent at skillshots you can end up landing enough to make it much more valuable than Thunderlords.

I agree that landing all three hits isn't much reward at all. Jhin's does major damage for the last shot, whereas Xerath just does a steady amount of damage with no reward for landing anything. I really want that slow, dang it :P

Fawstus1 votes

The range is one factor, but what really makes both ults so different that zooming Xerath's out would be bad is the fact that Xerath can shoot 360 degrees. To cover that and the range at level 3, Xerath would look like a little blue (or Red, or Green, or Yellow or... Pink) dot on the screen, and worse, his targets would be too small too. Also, Jhin's ult is fantastically easier to land. 4 shots? Check. Strike in a line and not a small-medium AoE? Check. Has increasing lethality? Check (Ok, this one makes it no easier to land, whatever). Slows target hard on any shot? Godforsakingcheck.

My 10 cents? It would be time to work on Xerath once more. The Ult`s particles are outdated and so his ult in general. Hard to hit 3 shots even with vision and experience because someone decided that Xerath should have a delay between blasts that allow people just enough time to juke them no matter how much skill (or lack off) they have.

The cooldown? Again, pretty bad right now. Lux, the most dominant long range mage on SR right now, can fire a long range super easy to land and damaging as hell laser every 35 seconds. On extended team fights she can ult in and out on the same fight. She can literally use her ult to clear a wave, go base and come back with just 10 seconds for her ult to come back. And repeat it. You can assume she has her ult all the time. Xerath, on the other hand, has up to 1 minute between opportunities to use his ult to barely kill escaping targets, because God forsake you if you try and use this ult to initiate or do anything resembling utility, like stealing something, since there is a delay between casts and no single shot can actually compete with a skilled Jungler with a smite ready.

Another thing: time to scrap the whole Stays Rooted while Ulting shenanigans. It is a relic from the time Xerath rooted himself to extend the range of all his skills. It is simply not relevant anymore. Instead, Xerath should have an ammo mechanic for his ult and be abe to shoot it on the fly as part of his combo if he wants. It would be simply better. An ultra long range fourth skill with some utility. Wanna start a fight with a shot and save the other two for fleeing survivors. Go ahead. Wanna use 1 or 2 shots to help clear wave and leave the last one for emergencies? Go ahead. Reduce a little the range (not too much. Identity, folks). About the cooldown? Make it small enough for the first charge to be almost always present, like 15 seconds on level 3 with 40% CLDR, but each other charge takes more time to prepare (25 and 35 seconds, adding up to 75 seconds to have all charges up).

There is a lot to improve there.

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