Why is Ekko getting bonus damage to jungle camps but Nautilus (an actual jungler) gets nothing?

PapaGreg21··194 votes·5,913 views

Ever since his mana nerfs, Nautilus has not been able to clear 4 camps in a row without blue buff. If you are going to gut his shield so he can spam his e for aoe jungle camps, there needs to be either damage being done to those camps or some kind of mana refund so that he can actually use the ability.

Update: Thank you for all the upvote everyone. Hopefully Riot will see this and development a clear plan for Nautilus in the next season other than throwing buffs at his Q (?). Us Nautilus fans just want to see him groomed to be competitive at a role and have the tools to succeed at it instead of being at less than 1% play rate in support and top roles. Riot should lay out a clear plan for Nautilus.

Season 5 had Riot give us a plan for him by writing

"By being the cornerstone to both his offensive AND defensive ability, Titan's Wrath forces Nautilus into a playstyle that is very binary - break the shield and he's harmless, or suffer if you fail to do so. Shifting power into Riptide lets him clear faster and take more actions per teamfight, which are two key areas we thought were weighing him down."

In summary, his shield was gutted so that he could spam riptide on jungle camps to keep up with the new AOE heavy jungle. He can't do that anymore and his shield still stinks. The latest Nautilus "buffs" were to enhance his hook (q) being stronger, which was almost a fake buff to get people to consider him again.

He's never going to be a good top because his kit is too toxic to lane against so he will be nerfed if he becomes commonplace. He is never going to be a good support because everyone knows Nautilus support falls off because he can't tank up like jungle (ha) and top Nautilus who get more gold. The easiest fix would be to give him monster damage buffs to his riptide. Ekko is already more viable than Nautilus in top and midlane yet he is being groomed for a third position which is mind boggling.

133 Comments

Ahris37 votes

Ekko is already strong and riot is buffing him?

DuskDaUmbreon21 votes

I sincerely doubt that buffing his damage to jungle camps of all things will break him in the slightest, given that he's not a meta jungler, and it won't let him clear camps significantly faster than any other jungler.

Ahris4 votes

{quoted}

I sincerely doubt that buffing his damage to jungle camps of all things will break him in the slightest, given that he's not a meta jungler, and it won't let him clear camps significantly faster than any other jungler.

It is buffing his midlane power indirectly when he is already strong there.

DuskDaUmbreon20 votes

How would buffing his damage to monster camps affect his midlane power? By letting him leash a tiny bit faster? By letting him get blue buff from his jungler a tiny bit faster?

You do realize that you pretty much don't bother with monster camps in a lane, right? And by the time you do, that damage bonus doesn't matter for anyone anymore?

Ventra1177 votes

Sorry you might not know this but in elo's above bronze mid laners like to take raptos.

GelsominoKiller9 votes

And I like to walk in their lane and smite the cannon minion while they're watching, in order to establish dominance.

The occasional camp can be done with ease. This buff is evidently aimed at allowing ekko to clear his jungle path.

I overall welcome every addition to the jungle roster, especially if they're AP damage dealers. Ekko is, in my opinion, a natural fit in the jungle.

HalcyonDweller7 votes

Do you read past the 5th word of any title or discussion before responding? Or is it just,

Trump to tv reporter: "What happened in Nevada was a blessin-"

You: "Welp! I've heard all I need to hear, time to jump off the diving board of conclusions!"

Like, holy crap. Keep reading for 5 more seconds and you'll see what it's actually about.

Next Day Edit: That was rude of me, I am sorry. I was grumpy.

Daddy Ants22 votes

On another note why is no one whining about this

Duskblade of Draktharr Lethality increased from 18 to 20

Edge of Night Lethality increased from 18 to 20

Youmuu's Ghostblade Lethality increased from 18 to 20

Serrated Dirk Lethality increased from 10 to 12

Yeah let's make Zed and Talon even stronger. Not like they aren't bullshit to play against already..

RankOneUganda66 votes

{quoted}

On another note why is no one whining about this

Duskblade of Draktharr Lethality increased from 18 to 20

Edge of Night Lethality increased from 18 to 20

Youmuu's Ghostblade Lethality increased from 18 to 20

Serrated Dirk Lethality increased from 10 to 12

Yeah let's make Zed and Talon even stronger. Not like they aren't bullshit to play against already..

you derp they are removing runes you can't get lethality from runes anymore

they did the exact same thing on magic pen items.

BobaFlautist30 votes

Midlaner mages are also getting hp instead of armor as the compensation for losing runes, so ad assassins are gonna be doing some stupid damage on the release of Runes Reforged.

UnboundHades22 votes

you do understand that they are losing over all lethality right?

Penns4 votes

No because sudden impact rune gives more lethality and magic pen than you get from runes right now

but i wont say no to pen buffs hehe

KuroCaliber14 votes

Except masteries are also disappearing, so the hybrid pen mastery is gone too.

Yara02 votes

{quoted}

you derp they are removing runes you can't get lethality from runes anymore

they did the exact same thing on magic pen items.

Rip ap assassins..... :( still get no items to help them and ap paths are so expensive.

NineTailedMystic4 votes

+3 on sorc shoes and +5% on void staff. yippee

SteelMankind2 votes

Sorc shoes and Void Staff were already extremely good items, though.

Imagine how happy Zed or Talon would be if they could purchase Lethality boots. Additionally, Void Staff's pen passive is way stronger than the LW upgrades.

NineTailedMystic4 votes

Zed or Talon get to have defensive boots unlike APs that need sorcs.

SteelMankind2 votes

Defensive boots that they would trade for damage boots in a heartbeat. Since every champ other than Cass buy boots, AP's have an easy, slot-efficient way to itemize penetration.

Voluug133 votes

Because ad assassins get much more lethality variety while mages have sorcs, void and guise and that is it.

Mages could give up sorcs for defensive boots 95% of the time if they had a better magic pen variety to choose from.

MonkeyMadness6 votes

A buff to assassins should be a welcome sight in this meta...it means marksmen will be weaker.

Done254 votes

{quoted}

A buff to assassins should be a welcome sight in this meta...it means marksmen will be weaker.

Nah. They'll just buff marksmen in retaliation.

bbQsauçe2 votes

[deleted]

Blåbæret5 votes

And a nerf is needed because both Zed and Tal are dealing bullshit damage right now.

DaNinad7 votes

its almost like they are assassins or something

BLOODR4G32 votes

{quoted}

its almost like they are assassins or something

fucking this

NineTailedMystic4 votes

Almost like why Assassins can't be balanced.

Dextix LT5 votes

Almost like they are balanced, but bad players need to whine.

Voluug131 votes

I am sorry but that is not true, every time assassins are strong we end up with the most cancer meta of all: assassin meta where no one but how the assassin gets to have fun.

Being instagibbed by a point and click blink the moment Zed gets to level 6 is not fun any midlaner.

Dextix LT1 votes

Everyone gets to have fun in an assasin meta, you jsut have to play smart. Squishies cannot be alone and need to be protected, you know, HOW IT SHOULD BE? That is the point of assasins! They get weaker in teamfights because squishies are protected!

If a dumbass adc/mage goes solo and gets killed that his fault!

There are no actual instagibbs by assasins (Especially now). Their damage is delayed and in some cases even unreliable. Unless you fed them, and that is your fault.

Voluug131 votes

Squishies cannot be alone and need to be protected, you know, HOW IT SHOULD BE?

Tank + mage mid lane new meta.

They get weaker in teamfights because squishies are protected!

There are no teamfights because tanks get bursted by assassins.

If a dumbass adc/mage goes solo and gets killed that his fault!

Again, mage + tank midlane new meta.

Dextix LT1 votes

Have you ever played this game? Assasins are incredibly weak early game, their farming, poking and kill capabilites early game are bad. Mages in LANING phase have the advantage in farming and poking department. Even if they cant kill the assasin, they can safely farm with ranged abilities.

Tanks do not get burst by assasins, they cant do shit to tanks. I think you are remembering some op examples a few years ago instead of looking at the real situation of the class.

It is also extremelly showing how you cherrypicked some of my sentences and just ignored the others. Just shows how you cannot argue properly.

Voluug131 votes

Yeah, right now.

Because its not an assassin meta, which is what I am talking about.

Please read correctly, I am talking about an assassin meta, where no midlane assassin is nowhere near ''weak''.

Dextix LT1 votes

Even in the "assasin meta" these weaknesses existed. Having 1-2 broken assasins does not make the class broken.

If a class in not weak, it does not mean its op. Assasins had clear strenghts and weaknesses, now they are just weak.

I would gladly have assasin meta back because that is when every class is viable and game focuses on macro-play rather than micro-play.

Leetri4 votes

I thought the current circle jerk was that assassins wasn't dealing any damage. Now they're dealing too much damage?

Dealth18 votes

Because Ekko and Nautilus are different champions, believe it or not.

If you want Nautilus buffs that's fine but don't act like he's dependent on Ekko in any way.

DariusDemiurge13 votes

Buff Nautilus

Wukong Airlines13 votes

Why is MonkeyKing who's an actual jungle monkey not getting anything at all?

Favoritism, they buff their fav champs in blink of an eye, but when it comes to other champs "uhhh, we think he needs major work but not in the near future".

Noblewind2 votes

Nautilus "an actual jungler". Swear he was Top/Support no?

PB4UAME18 votes

He was designed as a jungle and until very recently, that has always been his most played role.

Awoof1 votes

Hm, I don't know about "most played", but in terms of most viable, I'd say "very recently" is putting it lightly.

Voluug134 votes

Very recently compared to his life as a champion, of course.

PB4UAME1 votes

Exactly this, gotta remember the dude's been out for years.

Meep Man12 votes

Nautilus was originally a Jungle, but then after the first Tank Meta he got moved out of the jungle due to him/tank jungle items getting nerfed. He never really bounced back into the Jungle after that.

SpecterVonBaren2 votes

It was actually because of the changes to his W and E. Once his E had more of his power and was more spamable he was taken top and then became a top laner and then a support while his jungling fell at the wayside of balance concerns.

AirKingNeo1 votes

Since when was Nautilus a jungler?

ZeichiVos7 votes

Is the guy's most played role support atm? I only rarely see him there these days.

I wonder if they deliberately keep Naut out of jungle. Are his ganks too strong when he can actually clear camps?

PB4UAME6 votes

He was since release, that was his designed role, and was his most played ever since until perhaps very recently due to his over nerfing.

AirKingNeo2 votes

Ok but Vi was released as a top laner and no one cares about Vi top's balance.

YumaS2Astral5 votes

{quoted}

Ok but Vi was released as a top laner and no one cares about Vi top's balance.

I do

actually I like to play certain junglers as top laners or mid laners because I hate going jungle, but I admit, this is pretty difficult to do

SooFr0sty3 votes

He has stayed in the Jungle for most of his life up until the rework that was supposed to better his jungle. Then with Doran ring stacks he became a top lane for which he was nerfed for.

Vi was released and within a patch, became a jungler. Her kit always was more of a jungler than top.

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