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Ideas on how to nerf Yasou so that he isn't banned nearly every game

Hay5eed··2 votes·659 views

So as you probably know now that the ten ban system is live Yasou is banned nearly every game and Riot recognizes this issue. Even in high elo games he is banned around 50% of the time so Riot will probably tweak his kit to help him make it past banning phase. Below are some things that I think would be good for yasou to make him not so annoying to deal with.

Note that I am not saying that ALL of these ideas should be implemented, just SOME of them, or maybe just one or two.

1.) Remove his double crit passive - There was once another champion that with a similar passive, his name was Azir. And just as he got his extra passive removed maybe so should Yasou. Even though his crits don't do as much damage as a normal crit the fact that two items will give you 100% crit chance plus the fact that one of those items will be an I.E. means that he has a high damage output that is way too easy to get.

2.) When incoming damage procs his shield, have damage apply to his health, not his shield - In extended engagements Yasou would still have a decent advantage over his opponent because of the shield but this change would allow ranged mages to decently poke at him.

3.) Make Q not an auto attack - It's odd that he gets CD on his Q from AS and not CDR. Plus it can crit and applies any on hit effects. I say just make it an ability, with no on hit or crit, with CD scaling with CDR.

4.) Decrease duration on his W - This is a major pain point for a lot of players. It would be nice if it could just be removed but I don't think that this is likely. What abilities he can and cannot block are confusing sometimes and does not have a set consistency to be recognized at first. Overall just decreasing the duration of the wall so that it is not as long. (Btw, I looked it up. Yasou's W has a longer duration at level one than Braums E at level 3...This makes Yasou too safe IMO.

People saying that Yasou is a really hard champ to play, I don't play him at all, in fact Im a support main so I don't even lane against him, but I got him in ARAM. Now I know that ARAM isn't the fairest judgement on how balanced a champion is because there is not real laning phase, but once I got my build together I was two shotting their carries and scored an S, (they had an Ashe and a Jinx i think). It was pretty much easy peasy once I got my two items and I think this is perfect representation of what happens in Summoners Rift. Even if you counter pick him and kill him once or twice in lane he just needs enough gold for two items and he can murder your adc in teamfights easy

16 Comments

Azure Hamster2 votes

There was a time Darius was banned a huge amount. His winrate was 48%. People don't necessarily ban stuff that's OP; they ban stuff they don't like to play against.

Caitlyn

sit kid2 votes

1.) Remove his double crit passive - There was once another champion that with a similar passive, his name was Azir. And just as he got his extra passive removed maybe so should Yasou. Even though his crits don't do as much damage as a normal crit the fact that two items will give you 100% crit chance plus the fact that one of those items will be an I.E. means that he has a high damage output that is way too easy to get.

Azir is still flawed design wise. Didn't solve anything. If Yasuo got his double crit passive removed, he would get compensation buffs and just opt into a triforce-tank build. And that solves everything, right??

2.) When incoming damage procs his shield, have damage apply to his health, not his shield - In extended engagements Yasou would still have a decent advantage over his opponent because of the shield but this change would allow ranged mages to decently poke at him.

Yes, it is definetely an an annoying passive, but is essential for keeping Yasuo alive in bigger teamfights where he otherwise would get bursted down. He already have lower health than other melee champions. Along with Kassadin, he is the only champion to not have scaling MR.

3.) Make Q not an auto attack - It's odd that he gets CD on his Q from AS and not CDR. Plus it can crit and applies any on hit effects. I say just make it an ability, with no on hit or crit, with CD scaling with CDR.

Would be a HUGE nerf and make no sense at all. Would basically dumpster, ruin the whole thing of Yasuo being a crit champ and cut Yasuo's damage in half.

4.) Decrease duration on his W - This is a major pain point for a lot of players. It would be nice if it could just be removed but I don't think that this is likely. What abilities he can and cannot block are confusing sometimes and does not have a set consistency to be recognized at first. Overall just decreasing the duration of the wall so that it is not as long. (Btw, I looked it up. Yasou's W has a longer duration at level one than Braums E at level 3...This makes Yasou too safe IMO.

YOU. CAN. JUST. GO. AROUND. Jesus Christ, what is wrong with people? Fiora parries all damage for 0.75 seconds, Jax dodges autoattacks for multible seconds and Trynd is fucking immortal? It has like a 25 second cooldown and lasts like, what 4 seconds?

Hay5eed1 votes

1.) Azir is still flawed design wise but Azir also has the lowest winrate of pretty much all mid lane champions (underneath old galio even) and when they nerfed Azir, they didn't just nerf him. They fucking brutally gutted the dude. You claim that it doesn't solve anything but it solves one major issue with Yasou's kit. The fact that it is so hard to keep him down. Other champions, you kill them a few times early game, or just flat out don't die to them, and they become pretty weak in the mid and late game. Yasou on the other hand will still be a threat even if you kill him a few times early game because of his kit. Fact is, Yasou can snowball in early game if he gets a kill or two, but even if he doesn't he can still be a threat. Other snowball champions either snowball or are nearly useless. Yas is one of the safest snowball champions.

2.) This change in his passive would still allow Yasou to survive in bigger team fights. This change would have the first instance of champion damage apply directly to his health, and THEN the shield would pop up, blocking further instances of damage. Unless you are so fed or strong that you literally take out all of his health in one auto attack or ability then this wouldn't hurt Yas much in team fights, only laning phase.

3.) Yasou's design concept is NOT being a crit champ. Having crit's it not what defines Yasou. 90% of all damage comes from his Q and auto attacks, and one item gives him everything he needs, Phantom Dancer. This item gives him a great chunk of attack speed, decreasing his Q cd by 25%, 60% crit chance, psuedo tankiness, and movespeed. Removing this insane synergy would force Yasous to diversify their builds into items designed with this in mind. Ghostblade provides AD and CDR, letting him hit harder and use his Q faster, but no crit or tank stats etc. This would also mean that in team fights Yasou wouldn't have his knock up every 3 seconds.

4.) You CAN walk around his wall but that doesn't mean that you want to or that it would be even advantageous to do so. In lane Yasou can drop in windwall and just kite you around it, when you walk around he walks around too, keeping the windwall between you two. In team fights walking around the wall can put you out of position if you are lets say defending a turret. Also think about the positioning. Walking around or through windwall just brings you closer to Yasou, which is exactly what he wants. Yes Fiora can parry, yes Jax dodges auto attacks, yes Trynd can become immortal but do you not see the difference here? In all of your examples the buff affects only the caster. Fiora parries all damage directed to herself but she can't parry damage heading towards someone else and she has to stand still for that parry. Jax only blocks auto attacks and only for himself. Trynd only makes himself invulnerable (which don't get me wrong, i fucking hate that too, but Trynd doesn't have a 94% ban rate) but it's also his ultimate.

Yas on the other hand does NOT sacrifice movement (he still walks during the cast animation) and can protect his entire team with this ability. On top of this, windwall doesn't just intercept projectiles like Braum wall does, it DESTROYS them, meaning that all effects of that projectile disappear. Jinx rocket doesn't explode so no AOE damage occurs, Gragas ult disappears and doesn't displace anything, velkoz knock up doesn't happen etc. Meanwhile Braum, who is meant to be a support saving their adc, negates damage on only the first projectile blocked (then 30% -40% damage), but on hit effects still occur. Ashe ult? Still stunned. Jinx rocket? Still explodes potentially killing someone, Jhin ult? Still slows, Yas tornado still knocks up etc. Yas wall is better than Braum wall in almost every way EXCEPT for the fact that Braum gets movespeed during it (for some strange reason. I always thought that was odd but back to my point). My point is that Yasou, a skirmisher/assassin, has a better defensive tool than a tanky support

Just remember that the main problem here is that one out of ten people hate yasou enough to ban him nearly every game. Is it because he is OP? debatable, but we all know that laning or fighting against a Yas is merely a pain in the ass and that in itself is cause enough for changes

Besides, Riot has already said that they will be tweaking Yas soon to allow him to see play again. What would YOU suggest they do?

sit kid1 votes

Besides, Riot has already said that they will be tweaking Yas soon to allow him to see play again. What would YOU suggest they do?

My personaly problem with Yasuo is that he has TOO much power in lane, where he has too little outside of lane, and it gets annoying to a certain extend. Due to the way Yasuo's kit is put together, he has the potential to win EVERY lane. Yasuo only dies when he fucks up badly.

AND the fact you have to pop both his shield and his windwall. I think maybe buffing his base stats a bit, and make the shield a part of his ultimate. A slowly stacking shield that gives him some needed tankyness when diving in, and not just some annoying thing he has every 10 seconds or so in lane

Maybe some charge stacking on his E, that scales with champion level??

Doesn't have to worry about getting tornadoes in lane All the mobility he wants thanks to your minions

No minions = no relevance when you dont have your teammates

Personally don't have too much trouble against Yasuo. For the most part, they also just end up killing themselves in the teamfights unless they like shitstomp their lane. I'm not wasting my ban on Yasuo these days...

Hay5eed1 votes

So we agree that Yasou has too much power in lane then.

You know WHY he gets this much power?

His passive makes it hard if not impossible to poke down

Double Crit gives him a lot of damage early in the game, making him more likely to kill you

Windwall blocks most of a champions important spells, since Riot likes making powerful abilities skill shots and thus projectiles.

Windwall can stop you from attacking his turret, or from retaliating as he attacks yours

sit kid1 votes

I do agree that his passive shield could use some work, making it more sort of a safety bonus when diving in a teamfight and/or using his ultimate and not die immediatly

I really don't want the double crit to go away. Without it he would (as i said before) just opt in a tanky triforce build, and you don't wanna see that again... Yasuo is balanced around the fact that he has to get offensive crit items early on.

Windwall. I feel like it is in an ok spot. I mean it has like 26 seconds cooldown. Doesnt follow him like Braum shield. You really can just play around its cooldown or around the shield itself. It has 4 seconds uptime... That's 22 seconds where the only defence Yasuo right now has is his passive shield.

I really think his E is the source to why he feels so god damn op to play against. That's basically 6-12 free dashes every 30 seconds in lane. Doesn't count in the jungle, and i think that is a problem.

More and more CC is being added into the game, and it hurts Yasuo's slipperiness

What you're talking about is just plain nerfing Yasuo. That doesn't work. Gutting a champion is never the long term option. I think Riot should remove some power and boost him power when diving straight into the backline. I don't want Yasuo to just be another split push champion like Fiora and Jax. His kit is too good for that.

He probably has one of the coolest ultimates in the game, but it is a shame when you're almost guarenteed to blow up as soon as you've finished channeling your ult.

Hay5eed1 votes

The reason why Yasou is being banned every game is because he is way too strong at the moment.

You nerf yasou and he is not as strong as before and he will be able to see some play.

You nerf Yasou but give him some compensation buffs then he is still going to be strong and will still probably be banned every game (depending on what they buff).

Also note that I am not saying that EVERY one of these ideas needs to be implemented, these are just a few pain points about yas's kit

sit kid1 votes

He's not too strong at the moment. He's just a noobstomper, and people are complaining. I agree that he is annoying, but not a "real" problem.

I think putting the shield passive onto the ult as a passive and then buffing his base stats would be a step in the right direction

Hay5eed1 votes

Sure he is a noob stomper but can you tell me how exactly to shut down a yasou? Like actually shut him down. Like to the point that he is NOT useful come mid or late game? Cause right now, there really isn't.

Its like preventing Nasus from getting stacks, sure you can try to fight it and maybe even delay him getting stacks but there is no way to actually keep him from getting stacks.

You try to shut down a Yasou early but it doesn't work cause all he needs is two items and BOOM he is useful and can two shot your carries.

As a support I'll build Ninja Tabi, frozen heart, and even Randuin's against him but sometimes he is STILL able to kill me and my carry occassionally.

Like I said before, he is the safest snowball champion right now.

sit kid1 votes

Sure he is a noob stomper but can you tell me how exactly to shut down a yasou? Like actually shut him down. Like to the point that he is NOT useful come mid or late game? Cause right now, there really isn't.

Focus him and don't let him engage on your whole team. That's it. He's a melee champion, he is super easy to focus.

Play as a team and focus Yasuo. Yasuo sacrifices ranged safety for being melee and dealing more damage than your regular ADC. Focus him!

Stop wasting your ultimates on his windwall, get some tanks to CC him down and hold him in place until he dies.

You try to shut down a Yasou early but it doesn't work cause all he needs is two items and BOOM he is useful and can two shot your carries.

Come on, it's not anything new. It's what assassins and divers do. It is their only usefullness. Defend your carries and never fight Yasuo alone and in smaller fights (unless you have a big advantage).

Group as 5 and let him kill himself. Really isn't that hard. Just dont stay too much together and deny his 5--man knockup. If he only ults 1 or 2 people, that's basically time the rest of your team can stun him and kill him.

Hay5eed1 votes

1.) Not letting him engage on your whole team isn't that easy. Targeted dashes means that he can straight up dash right through you to your back line 2.) Hard to focus someone that has a dash up all the time plus a whole team to keep him safe.

3.) If Yas deploys windwall, I'm not gonna ult it. (duh) But a yas player doesn't just drop a windwall for no reason. A windwall is deployed in reaction to something else, usually an ultimate.

4.) Yes it is something new, assassins don't get that advantage, If they don't snowball early they won't be able to do much late. That is why assassins are very risky champions to play.

5.) If another champion has a knockup then denying a five man ult can be very hard to do. Yasou and Malphite can be the scariest combo i have ever scene but Other champions have large aoe knockups as well

sit kid1 votes

1.) Not letting him engage on your whole team isn't that easy. Targeted dashes means that he can straight up dash right through you to your back line

It's not like you don't have a frontline to stop him. Picks such as Gragas, Naut, Galio can negate him from ever diving on your team.

Think about it. Gragas E Naut AA Galio E+W

2.) Hard to focus someone that has a dash up all the time plus a whole team to keep him safe.

He's still not procected from non-projectiles

3.) If Yas deploys windwall, I'm not gonna ult it. (duh) But a yas player doesn't just drop a windwall for no reason. A windwall is deployed in reaction to something else, usually an ultimate.

Again, Windwall doesn't make Yasuo invincible. Go around it, wait till it is off cd or let your frontline deal with him in the meantime. It is 4 fucking seconds

4.) Yes it is something new, assassins don't get that advantage, If they don't snowball early they won't be able to do much late. That is why assassins are very risky champions to play.

Lie upon lie. I've played someone like Zed & LB hundreds of times and lost lane. I mean, just go bot and 4 man dive them right? Yasuo's mid game is so shit compared to any other champion. He doesn't have the damage to oneshot, and he doesn't have the survivability to reliably dive the backline. Yasuo needs items. He is strong early, weak mid, and situational late game.

Zed is weak early, ridicuously strong mid, and then falls off late.

5.) If another champion has a knockup then denying a five man ult can be very hard to do. Yasou and Malphite can be the scariest combo i have ever scene but Other champions have large aoe knockups as well

Denying a 5 man ult? Hah, wanna know why Malphite and Yasuo aren't played in LCS right now? Because people spread out so they can deny it. Ever thought about that?

You're bronze 1, no fucking wonder you don't have any idea how to deal with Yasuo. People like you are the worst kind. Crying about something is OP because you can't deal with them while the best advice is: git gud

People who have no idea how to play against Yasuo will get dumpstered. Playing against a Yasuo in lane is so different from any other champion. In bronze 1, people have little to no idea of what they're doing and how they should be adapting to Yasuo being in the game. That's also why Amumu and malphite are strong. Because people don't adapt to them being in the game.

Spead out, don't allow malhpite to hit all of you. But yea, bronze 1 and noone has any idea what's going one. One player knowing it doesnt really solve your teammates minds. When you climb, people get better and Yasuo starts doing statistically worse.

Yasuo has a 53.6% winrate in bronze http://champion.gg/champion/Yasuo/Top?league=bronze

In plat, he has a 49.94, and i would assume it goes even lower in diamond. http://champion.gg/champion/Yasuo/Top?league=platplus

You're in elo hell and that is why yasuo seems so strong to you. Cause NO ONE can really deal with him. And dealing with him with 4 monkeys on your team doesnt really do too much either

Kneelbeforezoth1 votes

removing the double crit wouldnt be a rework it would be the making of a new champ! Might very well happen though cause riot isnt good at making stuff balanced so removing that would be something i can see them doing however if they do that i request that lee sin lose his R so he only has 3 abilities....(well 6 abilites) and only be able to path once every 15 seconds! Also side that i also request since if they did that would only be catering to crybabies and scrubs that if the game reachs 20 mins both teams junglers get perma banned and the ADCs accounts get reset. Thats the prefect way to fix yasuo

Koonta Kintae1 votes

Delete Yasuo, free up a ban for both sides

Maddened King 1 votes

Remind me again why Yas needs nerfs? He doesn't, the reason he is banned is that low ELO players find him annoying to play against or don't want him on the team. It is not the reason of him being overpowered. You seem like the bandwagoner type who just hates whatever everyone else hates.

Hay5eed1 votes

He is banned in low elo 100% of the time.

He is banned in high elo around 50% of the time. That is a pretty high ban rate for high elo.

You know what the sweet part of your comment is? That you are saying that Yas doesn't need nerfs...but guess what? He is getting nerfed. Riot has said so. They noticed that Yas is almost never played because of the new ban system and they finally realize that Yas's kit is just so fucking annoying to play against that at least 10% of the player base bans him every game.

It's gonna happen.

There is nothing you can do.

No matter how hard you cry that Yasou is completely 100% balanced Riot has already made their decision. It's not gonna be a rework. It's not going to be an Azir level nerf (I wouldn't wish that upon anyone) but it IS going to be a tweak to his kit that will be a nerf.

So go ahead, argue with me. This was meant to be a nice discussion thread talking about possibilities and ideas for the future. Realistically none of the above mentioned things will probably happen. Just somethings that Me and a lot of other people find annoying.

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