Kog's Rework Was A Disaster

Kivolan·Aug 26, 2016·6 votes·945 views

You sit there, press W, and melt everything with on hit effects. No damage items needed. You gave him a W that lasts for 6 seconds instead of 3 autos.

Sitting still makes him an easy target for CC and burst, which is fine, but with a support like or , though, there's pretty much nothing to do. Lifesteal from and on him is absolutely atrocious and if he's not dead instantly, he's not dying at all.

Please tell me he's being addressed soon. Putting 99% of a champion's power in one skill is not good champion design. He needs to revert to his previous niche of a hybrid ADC, or at the very least spread out the power so players are actually leveling Q before there's four points into W.

17 Comments

astralwitAug 26, 20164 votes

I agree and it was completely unnecessary. Kog players weren't asking for it and he wasn't an issue in either SQ or competitive at the time he was reworked.

They turned a versatile and interesting champion into a mindless W bot. He used to be a cool AP Mid and my favorite champion. I feel like they deleted him. What if your main was literally deleted from the game? That's what happened for my playstyle with AP Kog and I find him very boring now. He also just sucks mid tbh. You can make him work but there's no real upside to any other pick.

ReikkenAug 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

He used to be a cool AP Mid and my favorite champion. I feel like they deleted him. What if your main was literally deleted from the game? That's what happened for my playstyle with AP Kog and I find him very boring now.

This is what literally every rework does. Someone's main playstyle gets entirely removed from the game.

astralwitAug 31, 20161 votes

{quoted}

This is what literally every rework does. Someone's main playstyle gets entirely removed from the game.

No, usually the main options are preserved. AP Kog has been around since S1 and was used by 1/3 of Kog players. It's no small thing to shit on, especially for such a boring and mindless rework.

MadraAug 26, 20164 votes

They were so infatuated with the idea of a champion getting 5.0 attack speed, they couldn't wait to build it around a new concept.

KivolanAug 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

They were so infatuated with the idea of a champion getting 5.0 attack speed, they couldn't wait to build it around a new concept.

https://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/53876365.jpg

EvewynnAug 26, 20161 votes

He's not as strong as you say..sure he has insane DPS but if you just let him stand there and melt you then you deserve it.

KivolanAug 26, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Celestial Bodied,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OM0hy2jp,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-08-26T11:52:48.024+0000)

He's not as strong as you say..sure he has insane DPS but if you just let him stand there and melt you then you deserve it.

If you are unable to delete him instantly, you're done.

That's why I mentioned that, by himself, he's manageable. In team fights, there's absolutely nothing that anyone can do. When Kog has a decent support that can put a shield on him or peel for half a second, he will delete everything.

zecastarAug 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

If you are unable to delete him instantly, you're done.

That's why I mentioned that, by himself, he's manageable. In team fights, there's absolutely nothing that anyone can do. When Kog has a decent support that can put a shield on him or peel for half a second, he will delete everything.

The way to play vs Kog is to NOT fight when his W is active. Kite back as a team and then reengage.

But yes, his rework is shit and stupid. I lost my favorite mid champ. It's not like wasa gimmick either. He was a viable mid for 5 seasons.

KivolanAug 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

The way to play vs Kog is to NOT fight when his W is active. Kite back as a team and then reengage.

But yes, his rework is shit and stupid. I lost my favorite mid champ. It's not like wasa gimmick either. He was a viable mid for 5 seasons.

It gives him bonus attack range as well.

Trust me, I've tried to turn around and kite but there's no reengaging when you're already at 25% health just trying to get out of his empowered auto range. It's like a Twitch ult... But better in multiple ways, and on a 7 second cooldown at max rank. Again, not good champion design.

NofeapAug 26, 20161 votes

Kog is strong when he has items and it able to use W freely. Bait the W, stun, cc, nuke him, just dont stand around and let him smack everyone with it. Problem isnt kog so much as it is people not doing anything to take him out of the fight quickly, poor cc, targeting wrong people, etc. If you cant focus the kog dont take the fight. The real pain comes from fighting a braum/kog combo... I main kog and agree the rework was meh, Q is still totally useless.

CppLAug 26, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Celestial Bodied,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OM0hy2jp,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-08-26T11:52:48.024+0000)

He's not as strong as you say..sure he has insane DPS but if you just let him stand there and melt you then you deserve it.

Get support like lulu ,soraka + exhaust ,and there is no way you can kill him.Unless he get brain lag and walks into 5 people.

ErockandrollAug 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Get support like lulu ,soraka + exhaust ,and there is no way you can kill him.Unless he get brain lag and walks into 5 people.

Yeah well, that's Lulu/Raka/Exaust.

Riot probably thinks that Juggermaw, is Niche enough to not be a major balancing issue. Especially since Kog isn't really that good outside of that comp. (Kog might be near unviable without that specific comp.) And yet, we don't see a lot of other hypercarries making use of that same style. Which would suggest that the supports/utility mages arn't breaking the comp either.

The changes to Kog were put in place to in an attempt to make him more distinct from other champs. and in Kog's case they decided (Possibly pulled from out of a hat) to make him the Leagues Giga carry. Which makes him more team reliant on compared to other Hypercarries. But his power is still windowed in the early game. So if you don't take the advantage their, your screwing up.

{quoted}

This is what literally every rework does. Someone's main playstyle gets entirely removed from the game.

That can't have a worse result than what the did to Malz. Instead of Alienating his off build, they rolled it into his main kit. So we end up with something that is only half space aids, and half voidling rush.

As for Kog, I'm not sure why Riot decided not to support his off build. (Given all the mechanics are there.) His AP build is effective a Siege mage. Perhaps Riot simply hate siege mages. (wouldn't be surprised considering Ziggs or Xerath) Or perhaps they decided that he offered no unique niche for them to work with.

Personally, I want to try a Hybrid build with AP and AS, but that might lead to the same problem I mentioned with Malz.

LoLKiruAug 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Yeah well, that's Lulu/Raka/Exaust.

Riot probably thinks that Juggermaw, is Niche enough to not be a major balancing issue. Especially since Kog isn't really that good outside of that comp. (Kog might be near unviable without that specific comp.) And yet, we don't see a lot of other hypercarries making use of that same style. Which would suggest that the supports/utility mages arn't breaking the comp either.

The changes to Kog were put in place to in an attempt to make him more distinct from other champs. and in Kog's case they decided (Possibly pulled from out of a hat) to make him the Leagues Giga carry. Which makes him more team reliant on compared to other Hypercarries. But his power is still windowed in the early game. So if you don't take the advantage their, your screwing up.

That can't have a worse result than what the did to Malz. Instead of Alienating his off build, they rolled it into his main kit. So we end up with something that is only half space aids, and half voidling rush.

As for Kog, I'm not sure why Riot decided not to support his off build. (Given all the mechanics are there.) His AP build is effective a Siege mage. Perhaps Riot simply hate siege mages. (wouldn't be surprised considering Ziggs or Xerath) Or perhaps they decided that he offered no unique niche for them to work with.

Personally, I want to try a Hybrid build with AP and AS, but that might lead to the same problem I mentioned with Malz.

I'd argue its the latter, if only for the fact that Xerath and Zigg's have seen nothing but buffs within the last season and a half, and are both in pretty fantastic spots right now, so they definitely don't seem to have anything against seige mages.

OT: Didn't they make Kog this way so that he's has the highest DPM out of any ADC lategame? I remember the entire issue with old Kog was that, despite always being touted as a lategame hypercarry, his strongest point was always his midgame.

ErockandrollAug 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I'd argue its the latter, if only for the fact that Xerath and Zigg's have seen nothing but buffs within the last season and a half, and are both in pretty fantastic spots right now, so they definitely don't seem to have anything against seige mages.

OT: Didn't they make Kog this way so that he's has the highest DPM out of any ADC lategame? I remember the entire issue with old Kog was that, despite always being touted as a lategame hypercarry, his strongest point was always his midgame.

I don't really think mid game was his strongest point. But he did get a good mid game power spike, because Tri force was pretty much core for him. But with his rework, He works better Just AAing, and Tri force wasn't as effective as Raw AS and on hit effects.

KivolanAug 26, 20161 votes

Yo people that are downvoting me, mind leaving some feedback as to why you think Kog's rework has a good design philosophy behind it? This isn't even about him having that 54% win rate so much as it is asking why his power isn't balanced around multiple skills a bit more.

NofeapAug 26, 20161 votes

I dont mind the idea they had with the rework (making him an AS monster), but leaving Q worthless kinda bums me out. Little too much power put into one skill I think.