Can Rammus Get Changes?

Troy242621·May 25, 2015·16 votes·1,625 views

NOT OK.

He does one thing better than other tanks and it's hardly relevant after one of these is built. His Q is pretty unique, maybe do something with that.

Also, most good junglers have 1 skill that is innately powerful and doesn't need to be maxed particularly quickly. Nocturne's E, Rengar's W, Fiddle's E, Nunu's W, Naut's Q and so fouth. Rammus doesn't have that.

All of his skills benefit heavily from being maxed and are weak in the early game, but during end game, he's weaker than ever because of these items. This heavily muddies his power curve and wastes his potential.

Big kicker is that his clears are worse than , his whole purpose is to CC lock people which currently does better and he has all of his CC tied into Q (Good Luck) and E (Useless end game) whereas Nautilus remains a CC machine.

Unless they're an all AD comp and you're a really late pick, he's hard to justify.

49 Comments

MarthianMay 25, 20154 votes

unless he gets further counterplay (along with several other champions) those aren't going away ever.

GunpointMay 25, 20152 votes

{quoted}

unless he gets further counterplay (along with several other champions) those aren't going away ever.

Further counterplay? What... His powerball is so easy to avoid and champs like Malzahar can destroy him.

MarthianMay 25, 20152 votes

if he outspeeds you, you can't.

Troy242621May 25, 20152 votes

A rolling leaf stops his Powerball. Use your creeps, or actually position behind your tank. Rammus avoided.

TotalJerkMay 26, 20153 votes

It's not a Sion charge, he turns on a dime.

Troy242621May 25, 20151 votes

I'm not asking for the items to be removed. I'm saying that when they're built, the one thing making him stand out among other tanks is effectively lost, and he's immediately less useful than his competition.

MarthianMay 26, 20151 votes

Defensive Ball Curl still gives him ridiculous armor and magic resist. He can be extremely hard to kill, and deals a good amount of damage with ult to remain a threat.

The Bearded BardMay 26, 20154 votes

Those items have reeeeally long cooldowns.

Hello I am BirdMay 26, 20152 votes

But... They don't...

HaloMay 26, 20151 votes

Mikaels have a 180 sec cd QSS have 90 sec cd.

Thats long compared to rammus 12 sec cd taunt.

Hello I am BirdMay 26, 20152 votes

Not really. I mean its not like your going to clease every single taunt, but Rammus might taunt twice in one teamfight, and the time between teamfights is enough to recharge it again.

HaloMay 26, 20151 votes

SO you are telling me that 3 minute cd and 1.5 min cd is not long? and its not like you only use it in team fights. The point is that they have REALLY long cds. You cant spam them.

The Bearded BardMay 26, 20151 votes

{quoted}

But... They don't...

Mikael's has a 3 minute cooldown. That's as much as Flash. QSS has 90 seconds, still a lot longer than Rammus's taunt cd lol

HaloMay 26, 20152 votes

It feels like you dont really play rammus allot.

What rammus does reallt good that few other do as good is that he is in the middle of the fight tanking everything while doing dmg. Getting an extra 120 armor and magic resist does allot and with dmg return.

His ultimate is a extremly good teamfight and pushing spell dealing a total of 1540 magic damage.

His E is a 2.25 sec taunt wich is extremly good. Taunt is one of the best types of cc and having one that is 2.25 sec is extremely powerful it also lowers enemies armor by 25. Because of the fact that it have a 12 sec cd you can usually do it 2 times in a teamfight.

His q is a strong ingage ability. Not the strongest but combined with other movement speed boosts it is really strong.

The skill that he doesn't max and is strong level 1 is his Q the boost. It gets lower cd and higher slow and dmg when maxed. Quite similar to fiddles E.

I dont really understand why you say he is weak earlygame as he is a really good ganker and teamfighter early on.

You must understand that rammus is a situational pick and that is what he is. He is a counter to teams with high physical damage. Just because he is situational doesnt mean that he is bad not to speak of the fact that he isnt even that situational as he boosts his mr with his w anyway.

As a sidetone. The skill you dont max on nocturne is his W - spellsield not his E - Fear as having a 2 sec fear instead of 1 is much more valuable than having a lower sec spellshield that gives you 40% atk speed instead of 20%

EDIT: as far as i can see you have played rammus ONCE and that was 16 days ago and your build was questionable at best. You might wanna try to learn him before complaining.

Champion SkinMay 26, 20151 votes

The strongest CC is usually knock ups because they can't be removed by QSS/cleanse and they aren't reduced by tenacity

Though of course taunt is pretty strong especially for rammus which benefit from being auto attack with his W (and if it is a melee champion you can drag them around a little)

HaloMay 26, 20151 votes

literally why i didnt write the best but one of them.

ULTRA RAMOOSEMay 26, 20151 votes

You have 0 games as rammus S4, S5, and 2 games S3, STFU!

HaloMay 26, 20151 votes

just gonna correct you...3 games in s3 you

ULTRA RAMOOSEMay 26, 20151 votes

Seems like you're focusing on the wrong part of the story, you start off with "It feels like you dont really play rammus allot." then spout BS when you've only played the champ 3x a few yrs ago. I stand by my original comment, you're not even qualified to chime in and make up fantasy stats, then come to the conclusion that he's fine.

HaloMay 26, 20151 votes

Ok then but with thought on the amount of games yo have on rammus. What is your opinion about his viability?

ULTRA RAMOOSEJun 22, 20151 votes

Scroll up, letters form words, words make sentences, etc., and so on.

KeitronMay 26, 20152 votes

Used to main rammus. Yeah not anymore....

ULTRA RAMOOSEMay 26, 20152 votes

I love how people chime in and float fantasy stats as fact then say "that's why rammus is just fine or OP" and you come to find that those people never play rammus. I've been playing rammus for 4yrs, was 8th in the world S3 and S5 for rammus games played as well as S4 Plat; Rammus only.

Rammus is in a bad spot, he's barely able to clear jungle, his armor ratio is fucked up now (can't tank full build yi's or vayne anymore), his auto attack was nerfed to hell, his cd's are unnecessarily long, his powerball starts out slow so most champs can outrun you, unless you have a outside boost from a fellow player. A few patches back they nerfed fiddles cc duration because he has several cc's and a drain, then they decided rammus needed to join the cc nerf as well. He's a one and done champ, no real powerful innate moves, he relies heavily on gear to give him some type of definition to his gameplay. He's in a bad spot, but as soon as he gets a quality of life boost, the people gripe and complain in a way I've never seen, then rito drops him back into hell and rescinds the buff.

I hate that he's so gear dependant that as soon as rito tweaks a buff like gromp's poison or how much damage cinderhulk does, he's on his back again, barely able to clear jungle again. He needs a revamp or some kind of tweak, I agree with OP's gripe.

LuggMay 25, 20151 votes

Are you talking about his taunt?

BudupopsMay 25, 20151 votes

not worth ruinng his iderntity

Troy242621May 25, 20151 votes

His identity? His identity is a spiked armadillo that rolls fast and taunts people, then curls into a defensive stance. That can still be his identity. His kit just has some power curve confusion.

BudupopsMay 25, 20151 votes

if your suggesting removing his taunt it aint gonna work

Troy242621May 25, 20152 votes

Where did you get that from?,..I think taunting is part of his identity. I meant do something with his R, or buff his Q in some way.

BudupopsMay 25, 20151 votes

yeah increase the ap ratios sounds like a good idea

Troy242621May 25, 20151 votes

He hardly builds AP when he's playing his intended role, which is a tank.

BudupopsMay 25, 20151 votes

first off he is secretly an assasin. secondly the comparison to nautilus isnt justified, rammus does way more damage than him and has more mobility

Big Bang BobMay 26, 20151 votes

They're both tanks who's main thing is to keep people from moving though.

Big Bang BobMay 26, 20151 votes

I think what Rammus needs is some better clear. I feel as if you either can get off good ganks and be come the monster you were meant to be or you can't and you're going to struggle.

I do agree his skills work awkwardly though. You're suppose to max your taunt, but you need you W for tankiness and clear. Furthermore His Q has a lengthy cooldown unless given some attention.

BudupopsMay 26, 20151 votes

rammus does have the one spell that isnt maxed and is still strong: powerball

IgotlazyMay 26, 20151 votes

{quoted}

rammus does have the one spell that isnt maxed and is still strong: powerball

While I agree he should usually level this last, maxing Powerball actually benefits you quite a bit. It has very high base damage, the more you level it the stronger the slow it applies on impact, and finally the cooldown being so low is makes Rammus a freaking monster.

Rammus is best bros with Sivir, Lulu, Jayce or Zilean. Having any of these guys on your team makes him a freaking force to be reckoned with. It's hard avoiding the tank when he's rolling toward you at 800+ MS.

ULTRA RAMOOSEJun 22, 20151 votes

Powerball is only good on ap rammus, in URF, his cd and speed on pb are so long and drawn out it's not practical to mention this for ranked. Only truly viable in URF

TotalJerkMay 26, 20151 votes

Both those items are good on paper, but underpowered in practice, anyway.

RainbowIceeMay 26, 20151 votes

tbh.. he needs to be reworked, he has some interesting ideas for example his is the only ult that can damage structures however it feels rather lacking and entirely weak to fights if anything it's only good for picking up assists. Not only that but he has to be in melee range practically to taunt someone and it's a dangerous trip that can be easily denied not to mention is Q rolling can put him far from the team at times to catch up to the target and makes him pointless. He needs some reliable method of reaching his target his Q is too easily cock blocked and weak vs cc which all the champions in the game have some form of one.

Chief RollieMay 26, 20151 votes

If your taunt gets cleansed it means you are still in the carry's face with tremors and dbc so you are still generating tons of threat against them even if you aren't setting up zed to murder them. Also cdr in the form of Frozen Heart can greatly reduce this issue.

Only Play DariusMay 26, 20151 votes

Well he just got new icons so a rework is likely a very long way off.

Teridax68May 26, 20151 votes

I think that's more of a problem with summoner 1 -type item actives than with Rammus , since they hard-counter crowd control, but at the same time those effects are the only means of playing against him, seeing how his kit means he's guaranteed to reach you, taunt you and deal a lot of damage against you, especially in the late game. If his abilities were made less reliable (e.g. if his taunt weren't point-and-click), then he would likely have the opportunity to be made less counterable by those items. Even now, though, the cooldown on QSS and Mikael's are a multiple of Puncturing Taunt's, and Rammus has more than enough tools to run away and try again if he fails on the first go.

mjishiMay 26, 20151 votes

just revert the q cd increase, then he will be fine

Meep ManMay 26, 20151 votes

I have always thought Rammus' W should give 30/35/40/45/50% damage reduction against all sources except true damage and give him 10/15/20/25/30 attack damage while active instead of 40/60/80/100/120 armor and magic resist. The damage also buffed to 19/31/43/55/67 to compensate the armor lost during his W. That way part of his kit isn't negated by penetration.

flibitydooMay 26, 20151 votes

What are you talking about cc locking people for days with Rammus?

he's not nautilus. Never has been never will.

he's this massive tank with an insane 100+ resists tank steroid who also does a lot of reflect damage. You pick him into Zed and it's gg. His ganks are insanely good because you can't just spot him with wards because he powerballs into your lane with teleport homeguards.

You really want to change him into Nautilus? That's super dumb. Then we end up having two nautiluses, one of which will always be objectively better than the other because you made them the same. Let Rammus be the anti AD champion and not ruin his indentity.

Troy242621May 26, 20151 votes

That's just not what I said. At all. I compared him to a similar CC-heavy tank.

His tanking isn't the problem, and even still, he's only worth using against a very AD-heavy comp.

His ganks aren't insanely good. They're O.K. (Cwhtididthar?) but really not spectacular. INSANELY good ganks are Vi/Reng/Noc post-6 and Shaco at any given point in time.

I never said this,...I never said change his identity. I like his identity. I'm saying buff him not change him. -_-.

The Bearded BardMay 26, 20151 votes

{quoted}

That's just not what I said. At all. I compared him to a similar CC-heavy tank.

His tanking isn't the problem, and even still, he's only worth using against a very AD-heavy comp.

His ganks aren't insanely good. They're O.K. (Cwhtididthar?) but really not spectacular. INSANELY good ganks are Vi/Reng/Noc post-6 and Shaco at any given point in time.

I never said this,...I never said change his identity. I like his identity. I'm saying buff him not change him. -_-.

Ohreally? So forcing an ap mid to only autoattack a tank for 2.25 seconds is useless? And building QSS on an apc doesn't build into anything, so they most likely won't get it. Just because he gains increased ad from armor doesn't mean he's only good against ad champs. That's like saying Galio is only good against AP when in reality, he fucks nearly every ad champ.

KougaJun 22, 20151 votes

{quoted}

He does one thing better than other tanks and it's hardly relevant after one of these is built.

True of literally any Champion that relies on their CC to be relevant. Hell, even Cleanse would do this, and then they wouldn't even need to build an item. This is not a Rammus-specific issue.

Also, most good junglers have 1 skill that is innately powerful and doesn't need to be maxed particularly quickly. Nocturne's E, Rengar's W, Fiddle's E, Nunu's W, Naut's Q and so fouth. Rammus doesn't have that.

His Q is basically his one-point wonder. Yeah, you get more damage (woo! damage! You're a tank, damage isn't your job) and you get a slightly lower CD but once you've used it once, you've caught up to your target, so you don't need it again right away.

Big kicker is that his clears are worse than , his whole purpose is to CC lock people which currently does better and he has all of his CC tied into Q (Good Luck) and E (Useless end game) whereas Nautilus remains a CC machine.

Even with the occasional QSS, Rammus E is not useless. If anything, by end game it'll be more effective against the ADCs if you can bait out their QSS, because they'll hurt a lot more hitting his Defensive Curl.

Unless they're an all AD comp and you're a really late pick, he's hard to justify.

Its called a niche pick. Lots of Champions fall into situations where they're really good in specific circumstances, but either inefficient or just not good in others.

Rammus versus an AD heavy team? Awesome sauce. Versus mages? Weak. Galio versus an AD heavy team? Gonna have some trouble. Versus mages? Funkytown

Yasuo on a team with 0 knockups vs a team with Malphite top, Wukong jungle, Janna support.. well, you get the idea.

MrSlowDieJun 22, 20151 votes

I played a lot of rammus back then. Until someone picked him in competitive play....

ULTRA RAMOOSEJun 22, 20151 votes

I would truly love to see Steven "Coronach" DeRose be brought in just to redesign Ramoooose! he was the mind behind a lot of the most fun champs in this game and warned that "true damage" will be the downfall of this game.

From lolwiki:

Designed champions

Akali, the Fist of Shadow Brand, the Burning Vengeance Corki, the Daring Bombardier Elise, the Spider Queen (Partly with Meddler) Karma, the Enlightened One Katarina, the Sinister Blade Kayle, the Judicator (remake) LeBlanc, the Deceiver Lee Sin, the Blind Monk Malphite, the Shard of the Monolith Mordekaiser, the Master of Metal Olaf, the Berserker Poppy, the Iron Ambassador Rammus, the Armordillo Shyvana, the Half-Dragon (partly with Ezreal) Swain, the Master Tactician Udyr, the Spirit Walker Veigar, the Tiny Master of Evil Wukong, the Monkey King Yorick, the Gravedigger Zyra, Rise of the Thorns (partly with CertainlyT and Morello)[2][3][4]

Other works

Co-op vs. AI[5]

Steven now works for Respawn Entertainment on the game Titanfall, which I would be playing if it weren't on Origin, hoping it comes out on Steam at some point.