Zed's W + E + Q shouldn't be able to one shot a squishy

ExplodingFist66·Jul 14, 2018·25 votes·5,867 views

One of Zed's most iconic combos can literally kill an ADC 100 to 0. I understand that Zed is in a really good spot right now but to be honest I think he's overloaded with damage. Like when you kill an enemy champion with two shurikens and a shadow slash that's just ridiculous when he doesn't even need to auto you with dusk/stormrazor proc. Pretty much every assassin needs their ultimate to one shot a squishy with their full damage rotation. Examples like: : W + R + Q + Auto : R + Q + E + W + Empowered Q : R + Q + E + Auto

25 Comments

JunkοJul 14, 201813 votes

He has too much damage because Riot insisted on buffing AD assassins every time they nerfed Duskblade as "compensation" (even though most assassins were fine before Duskblade became a thing).

DuskDaUmbreonJul 14, 201810 votes

The bigger problem is that Zed's R just makes it pathetically easy to land his combo, imo. It's basically impossible to miss his combo after pressing R unless you're actually trying to miss it.

EedatJul 14, 20188 votes

One of Zed's most iconic combos can literally kill an ADC 100 to 0

Let's see some proof then. Show me some proof where this happens where Zed isn't stupidly fed

ElohavenJul 14, 20181 votes

Take a Janna with a regular build and a Zed with a regular build

There's your answer

ThefrostyvikingJul 15, 20185 votes

Dude you could just sit down and look at the numbers for literally a minute to realize its actually true if you factor in electrolute and a bit of AD&lethality.

And from a very early point on too.

Now i am too lazy to actually get the specific numbers myself but i do know that the average marksman has like 25-28 base armor and no more than 940 health at lvl 6, often less.

Electrolute does 100 base damage and has a 50% bonus AD scaling, the damage is also adaptive.

At lvl 6 Zed would have 3 points in Q for a 150 base damage+90% bonus AD.

So if he lands both his own Q and the one thrown with his W it would effectively deal 300+.......well assuming that he has item 3134 and 2 item 1036 and some AD from runes&lvls for a total of 60 AD, 108 damage for a total of 408.

Then his E deals 70+80% bonus AD, so given above conditions... 70+48= 118

So at 6 with above mentioned conditions his "iconic" combo would deal 656 damage pre resistances, and this is without being fed and just farming rather casually, this combo of his would thus as we see easily deal about 70% of a targets health no issue´s at all.

Add ulti or ignite and a auto+passive and its sufficient to kill a squishy target, add in some more bonus AD or lethality and he does it for real with only W-Q-E+electrolute.

EedatJul 15, 20184 votes

the average marksman has like 25-28 base armor and no more than 940 health at lvl 6

Well we can start this out by being flat out wrong. At level 6 the average marksmen has ~38-40 armor

So at 6 with above mentioned conditions his "iconic" combo would deal 656 damage pre resistances

Wtf is the point of trying to say Zed does true damage? A dirk at level 6 is going to give what? Like 7 armor pen? You're trying to give the pre-mitigated damage as the actual damage the ADC would take. Even with the dirk that damage is gonna be reduced by ~25% so we're down to < half their HP. So please explain how <50% is now a "one shot". Go on. I'll wait.

Add ulti or ignite and a auto+passive and its sufficient to kill a squishy target, add in some more bonus AD or lethality and he does it for real with only W-Q-E+electrolute.

Literally completely irrelevent. The question being dicussed says that a W + E + Q oneshots a squishy. NOT a R + Ignite + E + Auto + W + Q + Auto. Legit wtf was even the point of bringing this up? xD

ThefrostyvikingJul 15, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Well we can start this out by being flat out wrong. At level 6 the average marksmen has ~38-40 armor

I was a bit unclear there, what i meant with base armor is exact what i wrote and nothing more, the very stating armor.

The reason i didnt write out anything else is because i dont know the specific growth for marksmen armor per level, but i happened to recall the health having played a game earlier before writing it and having looked at the healthbar around that level by coincidence.

Thus i tried to specify that the base armor was 25-28, and that the health at 6 was 940 or some less......which in hindsight was done in a poor manner causing confusion but pardon me for my first language is not english^^

Wtf is the point of trying to say Zed does true damage? A dirk at level 6 is going to give what? Like 7 armor pen? You're trying to give the pre-mitigated damage as the actual damage the ADC would take. Even with the dirk that damage is gonna be reduced by ~25% so we're down to < half their HP. So please explain how <50% is now a "one shot". Go on. I'll wait.

I did specify "pre resistances".

So for my statement to work all you need do is add a bit more AD and lethality and a few more levels and its all the same in the end.

If doing the same calculation assuming that Zed has ghostblade and another serated dirk by 13 minutes into the game, given that he farms well and scores a kill or two, those added with ....say 20 AD from runes and maybe his ulti and its 100 AD.

He would be at lvl 9 at the same time if i blatantly make assumptions on the basis of my own memory of a game played.

His Q would deal 220 + 90% bonus AD per direct hit.

E would deal 95 + 80% bonus ad, and electrolute would deal 130+50% bonus AD.

So landing 2 direct Q's would deal 620, E would do 175 and electrolute would do 180 for a total of 975 pre reistances.

28 lethality would scale down to like...21 ish if i understood the formula i just looked up right, and a marksman like Ashe has at lvl 8 about 46 armor.

So down to 25 for a comfortable 20% damage reduction from AD, so down to 780 damage post resistances.

Now this is 75% of Ashe´s health at lvl 8.

Literally completely irrelevent. The question being dicussed says that a W + E + Q oneshots a squishy. NOT a R + Ignite + E + Auto + W + Q + Auto. Legit wtf was even the point of bringing this up? xD

My point was, this rather simple combo actually does high damage and it scales well.

And the latter half my final sentence was "add in some more bonus AD or lethality and he does it for real with only W-Q-E+electrolute."

Which given his AD scalings as i have proven, is true.

His combo despite the "small" increase of 40 AD jumps in damage from 50% health to about 75% of a squishies health.

What does this all prove?

At like 3-4 items Zed can easily kill a target with low armor using only his W-Q-E, which is exactly what OP said.

RexxieeJul 15, 20185 votes

{quoted}

Let's see some proof then. Show me some proof where this happens where Zed isn't stupidly fed

Havent you been playing the game like at all lately?

Zed players in diamond have been rushing ghostblade because his damage is just overtuned to the point dusk is overkill.

With ignite and electrocute he can indeed 100-0 any squishy without armor with a basic rotation as soon as he completes 1 item.

Its stupid.

ISLAMICWARRIOR99Jul 15, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Havent you been playing the game like at all lately?

Zed players in diamond have been rushing ghostblade because his damage is just overtuned to the point dusk is overkill.

With ignite and electrocute he can indeed 100-0 any squishy without armor with a basic rotation as soon as he completes 1 item.

Its stupid.

People rush ghostblade because it gives a ton of map pressure not because they don't need duskblade damage

EedatJul 15, 20182 votes

READ. THE. TITLE.

Zed's W + E + Q

NOT Zed's all in with ult. NOT "Zed's R > E > Auto > Duskblade proc > Ignite > W > Q > Auto"

NetorareJul 14, 20186 votes

All ad assassins became braindead after the assassin rework, lethality or duskblade should just be removed together with stormrazor, they are way too toxic. It's funny how you can miss every skill shot on zed but if u press R + basic u can delete someone together with ignite... Assassins are not HIGH RISK HIGH REWARD in league and they have never been sadly. But of course that riot will protect their braindead assassin community...

GrReaper96Jul 15, 20184 votes

Just make it so that combo doesnt proc elec

ChaddyFantomeJul 15, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Just make it so that combo doesnt proc elec

Why not just remove Elec from the game instead given its always been a braindead Rune?

Leto GTJul 15, 20184 votes

I see a lot of them saying that without item 3147 they can't kill anybody but the truth is that this item make them able to oneshot ppl without executing a full combo on the target like THEY SHOULD DO.

It's so retarded when I a zed Yumuu, W to close distance, R E Q Ignite AA then R back to safety. It shouldn't be like that.

TotalJerkJul 15, 20184 votes

You're blatantly lying. Zed cannot oneshot with just W>E>Q unless he is fed.

Pika FoxJul 15, 20183 votes

If youre a squishy you dont really get to complain about being instagibbed. Youre a glass cannon, emphasis on glass.

EA14Jul 15, 20183 votes

I've had around 600 games on zed, and i've never one shot someone with just a weq, nor have i ever seen LL stylish (best zed Na) one shot someone with a weq combo and no auto. I watch his streams and vids often.

ISLAMICWARRIOR99Jul 15, 20182 votes

It cant unless hes fed as fuck

PaffWasTakenJul 15, 20182 votes

Whats even more absurd is the number of zed mains downvoting this thread

Diana holeJul 15, 20182 votes

No replay = no proof

Thread dismissed

FurriesAreHotJul 15, 20181 votes

I'd like it if it chunked me decently for failing to dodge the Q, but I have experienced it doing upwards of 80% of my HP, and that just aint fun

ChaddyFantomeJul 15, 20181 votes

Blame Electrocute

YuGiHoJul 15, 20181 votes

but zoe had a utility ult that allows her to make better use of her basic skills. in that sense she is very similar to panth or k6, these champs and a few others are designed in a way that their basic ability's would be all they need to secure a kill.

Sweet VictoryJul 15, 20181 votes

I honestly do not know why are you complaining about this.

Like you said, Zed is in a bot spot right now. The fact that he is 100 to 0 a squishy means that he must be decently fed. Even then, his w-e-q combo is extremely hard to land, especially since if you even dodge one q electrocute won't proc, which means a huge portion of the damage is negated and zed is left VERY vulnerable for like 15 seconds. The fact that the zed feels no danger of using his w-e-q combo to damage you means that you're positioning incorrectly or lack information (no vision). Even so, assassins should have the ability to chunk out champions with only their basic spells because otherwise, they will be extremely ult dependent. If a Zed is 10/0/0 and one-shots you with a basic combo like that, the damage is justified because its the nature of assassins to snowball the game. There are many ways to prevent Zed from being fed. Understand that an assassin who falls behind is useless.

tldr; if Zed is 100-0 you with that combo, you're doing something wrong.