LW items shouldnt synergize with flat pen the way they do now

Tychusfindlay919··11 votes·1,064 views

As the game calculates currently, % pen comes first, then flat reduciton.

This allows people who want to itemize to assassinate to still destroy tanks because they can just get an LW item on top of all their flat pen, shred the tank's bonus armor by 45%, and then apply all the flat pen after that massive shred.

This is something that shouldve been done a long time ago. If you wanna assassinate fine, if you wanna tank bust, fine, you can't get the best of both worlds.

TL;DR change the coding to calculate flat pen first, and % pen afterwards.

EDIT

The real underlying message of the OP is that if an ADC (particularly caster ADCs) wants to build lethality items to spike early and delete squishies with near true damage, they shouldn't be able to just top off their lethality build with an LW item so that they can continue to deal near true damage to squishies while also having SEVERE kill pressure on tanks because the LW shred applies first and then the flat pen (thus negating way too much of the tanks armor despite the ADCs building a ton of assassin items).

Most assassins don't usuall take LW items, they only take lethality and raw AD items, making them good against squishies but weaker against tanks. ADCs that utilize lethality make up a weird section of users of lethality because their kits allow them to utilize lethality well against squishies, while still outputting enough sustained damage to allow them to get LW on top of their lethality items and still lay the beatdown on tanks.

TL;DR FOR EDIT

If an ADC wants to build lethality and spike earlier, they can't be allowed to just build an LW item on top of it and get the best of both the tank busting and squishy deleting worlds.

16 Comments

ScissorsNstuff1 votes

aka remove assassins from the meta again

LankPants1 votes

Which assassins buy Last Whisper?

ScissorsNstuff1 votes

{quoted}

Which assassins buy Last Whisper?

They don't have to. Changing how the stats work ultimately changes the value of the stats, armor in particular.

Also your post applies to the ferocity mastery and item 3071 as well.

edit

also don't forget that some abilties also do this

LankPants1 votes

Also your post applies to the ferocity mastery and item 3071 as well.

Because of the way how Cleaver works it would still be applied first. It's shred, not pen.

As for the mastery I don't think I've ever seen any assassin not take Thunderlord's or Stormraider's. They don't tend to get the %pen because of that.

Tychusfindlay9191 votes

{quoted}

Because of the way how Cleaver works it would still be applied first. It's shred, not pen.

As for the mastery I don't think I've ever seen any assassin not take Thunderlord's or Stormraider's. They don't tend to get the %pen because of that.

Exactly, I'm going to edit my OP to be clearer.

ScissorsNstuff1 votes

{quoted}

Because of the way how Cleaver works it would still be applied first. It's shred, not pen.

As for the mastery I don't think I've ever seen any assassin not take Thunderlord's or Stormraider's. They don't tend to get the %pen because of that.

correct, it is shred. But the point is that the game is balanced around an idea that flat pen comes last now. It was turned into shred for balance reasons. It was given a particular amount because now flat pen came after anything that behaved like this including last whisper which some assassins will build like pantheon or kha against ARMOR though.

When armor is weaker then you get hp like

item 3748 item 3102 item 3143 item 3068

when armor is strong you get armor and MR

item 3742 item 3025 item 3075 item 3139

Long story short you are going to get things non-tanks abuse more easily if you make armor more effective unless everything is rebalanced again. what ends up happening is that assassins aren't terribly useful unless compensation is given that bleeds into other classes

Edge of Daybreak1 votes

Idk about you but i'm not gonna be assassinating a tank any time soon as say Talon or zed. The raw hp alone is greater than my combo then the resist man.

Tychusfindlay9193 votes

{quoted}

Idk about you but i'm not gonna be assassinating a tank any time soon as say Talon or zed. The raw hp alone is greater than my combo then the resist man.

The real nuisances with the message in the OP are Lethality ADCs who can get a ton of lethality items to delete squishies, and then just top off their build with an LW item and still egregiously hurt tanks.

LemurKick1 votes

The only ADC building Lethality is Miss Fortune, it seems like you're just making up shit to complain about.

Tychusfindlay9191 votes

{quoted}

The only ADC building Lethality is Miss Fortune, it seems like you're just making up shit to complain about.

Willful ignorance is bad, don't succumb to it dude.

LemurKick1 votes

I'm an ADC main, but I also just went through champion.gg and looked at the most popular and highest winrate builds of all ADC's and MF is the only one building lethality, and the only other two who can get away with it are Jhin and Varus. Don't worry I won't succumb to the circle jerk you've descended into.

Xevestos1 votes

As a talon main I'm pretty sure he is the only assasin that's scary for tanks.

DunkinNoobs1 votes

It used to work the way you want it to, then Riot changed it to the way it is now because the way it worked before was stupid.

Tychusfindlay9191 votes

{quoted}

It used to work the way you want it to, then Riot changed it to the way it is now because the way it worked before was stupid.

Perhaps the situation in the past called for what we have now, but now calls for what we had in the past.

DunkinNoobs1 votes

All I hear is that you want tanks to be even more unkillable. No thank you.

I am Pacman1 votes

It used to work with flat coming first but they changed it because tanks were waaay too tanky and armor was overall op.

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