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Font of Life (the new stoneborn pact) is another version of ardent censer.

Critmaster Garen··6 votes·6,793 views

for people who are wondering what im talking about, its one of the new season 8 runes that had been revealed a couple of days ago.

https://media.lolusercontent.com/api/embedly/1/image/resize?url=http%3A%2F%2Fimgur.com%2F0nKAfRb.png&key=a45e967db0914c7fb472fd4381e6c85b&width=425

Impairing the movement of an enemy champion marks them for 4 seconds. Ally champions who attack marked enemies heal for 5 + 1.0% of your max health. (Healing values are reduced to a third for your own attacks.)

the problem with this rune is, that it will trigger on every individual auto attack for its duration. this is just another version of ardent censers passive, that overly synergizes with marksmen.

please pull the breaks on it and rework the concept before it even hits the pbe.

id suggest changing the mechanic more similar to ther current version of grasp, and give it a slightly larger heal on an internal 4 second cooldown and make it trigger on any damage dealt instead of just auto attack damage in specific.

whatever happened to making other types of champions than marksmen viable in a duo lane, and changing support abilities to synergize with a larger variety of carry types?

it seems recently every change to supports, tanks, and support itemization seems to be focused entirely around marksmen.

26 Comments

Brutalitops013 votes

It's literally identical to current Stoneborn Pact except you can also heal yourself with it as well.

It's also a smaller, instant heal rather than a larger heal that gives 40% of it instantly and 60% over 2 seconds.

Critmaster Garen2 votes

{quoted}

It's literally identical to current Stoneborn Pact except you can also heal yourself with it as well.

its not identical.

stoneborn pact applies a regeneration effect over 2 seconds.

font of life grants an on-hit heal to every single auto attack.

this means font of life favours champions who auto attack as fast as possible, which is mostly marksmen. and guess whos getting a new keystone that allows them to break attack speed cap for a couple of seconds?

its literally the same shit as ardent censer. a passive that gives marksmen an on-hit heal. only against cced targets this time.

ModDaenrysTargaryen2 votes

uhh stone-borne pact basically does the same thing... and we have that right now

Critmaster Garen2 votes

{quoted}

uhh stone-borne pact basically does the same thing... and we have that right now

no it doesnt. stoneborn pacts mark ~~is consumed upon attacking the marked target, ~~ and applies a regeneration effect.

this means the mastery will synergize equally with a large number of champions. you dont need to play a champion that stacks attack speed to fully benefit from the effect.

font of lifes mark will persist over 4 seconds and heal the attacker on every auto attack against the marked target instead.

edit.: correction on the mark being consumed. the problem with the on-hit heal is still there.

ModDaenrysTargaryen2 votes

nowhere does it say its consumed on hit

Your crowd control effects brand enemy champions with an Earthen Rune for 4 seconds. Other allied champions who attack branded enemies heal for 5 (+ 2.5% of your maximum health) over 2 seconds (halved to 2.5 (+ 1.25% of your maximum health) if you are ranged). 「 40% of the amount is healed 」 on-hit and 「 60% 」 over 2 seconds. The on-hit component stacks and the heal over time's duration refreshes on-hit.

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Stoneborn_Pact,

you can clearly see this if you play lux with stormborn pact in the invasion gamemode

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

nowhere does it say its consumed on hit

Your crowd control effects brand enemy champions with an Earthen Rune for 4 seconds. Other allied champions who attack branded enemies heal for 5 (+ 2.5% of your maximum health) over 2 seconds (halved to 2.5 (+ 1.25% of your maximum health) if you are ranged). 「 40% of the amount is healed 」 on-hit and 「 60% 」 over 2 seconds. The on-hit component stacks and the heal over time's duration refreshes on-hit.

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Stoneborn_Pact,

you can clearly see this if you play lux with stormborn pact in the invasion gamemode

for some reason i remembered a rioter mention that the mark is consumed.

however, my argument still stands. the current version of stoineborn applies a regeneration effect over two seconds. this means the ability doesnt favour attack speed stackers like font of life does.

font of life triggers on every single auto attack over its duration, and slows apply the effect.

ModDaenrysTargaryen1 votes

「 40% of the amount is healed 」 on-hit and 「 60% 」 over 2 seconds.

autoattackers do benefit from stoneborn as well, but the reason why no supports really build it is because it scales with health and most supports that have slows dont build health

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

autoattackers do benefit from stoneborn as well, but the reason why no supports really build it is because it scales with health and most supports that have slows dont build health

right, but this is a buffed version of the keystone aimed at tanks.

it creates the same problems as ardent censer.

  1. the fact that its aimed to support marksmen specifically is kindof bullshit.

  2. we can already see what these effects do to stat check adc who build 2 zeal items and i.e. and have a support with ardent censer next to them. its the same effect as giving them a massive amount of lifesteal.

VoidStaresBack1 votes

What you're missing here is that font of life's heal is almost identical to the on-hit instant heal of stoneborn pact (the difference is 3 points of healing). So all this is is removing the HoT from it, which was almost unnoticeable outside of invasion on anyone who wasn't stacking attack speed. Attack speed stackers have always gotten far more out of stoneborn pact than those who don't because of the instant heal, so nothing really changed.

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

What you're missing here is that font of life's heal is almost identical to the on-hit instant heal of stoneborn pact (the difference is 3 points of healing). So all this is is removing the HoT from it, which was almost unnoticeable outside of invasion on anyone who wasn't stacking attack speed. Attack speed stackers have always gotten far more out of stoneborn pact than those who don't because of the instant heal, so nothing really changed.

this is going to be a lot worse.

the on-hit component of stoneborn was 5 health.

font of life is going to dial this up to around 80 to 90 health if the tank hits the stoneplate active. the difference between auto attackers and other types of champions is a lot smaller with stoneborn.

VoidStaresBack1 votes

No, it was 40% of the heal. since the heal was 5 + 2.5% health, the up-front was 2 + 1% health. Thus why I said a 3 point difference between the heals.

Jbels1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MpaXizrG,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2017-09-16T18:09:25.272+0000)

for some reason i remembered a rioter mention that the mark is consumed.

however, my argument still stands. the current version of stoineborn applies a regeneration effect over two seconds. this means the ability doesnt favour attack speed stackers like font of life does.

font of life triggers on every single auto attack over its duration, and slows apply the effect.

Just going to step right in here and say that font of life is perfectly justified in it's healing not being an over time effect by not healing as much per proc as Stoneborne does. If it still did, I would have a problem, but 5 + ( 1 per 100 health) healing isn't a huge deal, especially when most supports A.) don't finish a 6th item so they can carry pinks, meaning less possible health over all, and B.) Stoneborne pact gives 5% bonus health in addition to that affect, and I don't see that bonus on Font of Life.

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

Just going to step right in here and say that font of life is perfectly justified in it's healing not being an over time effect by not healing as much per proc as Stoneborne does. If it still did, I would have a problem, but 5 + ( 1 per 100 health) healing isn't a huge deal, especially when most supports A.) don't finish a 6th item so they can carry pinks, meaning less possible health over all, and B.) Stoneborne pact gives 5% bonus health in addition to that affect, and I don't see that bonus on Font of Life.

which will make this difference more pronounced between high attack speed champions and champions with a lower attack speed.

stoneborn pact requires you to auto attack once every 2 seconds to access most of the healing.

font of life will massively favour champions with a high attack speed.

Jbels1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MpaXizrG,comment-id=000000000000000000020000,timestamp=2017-09-16T18:30:14.581+0000)

which will make this difference more pronounced between high attack speed champions and champions with a lower attack speed.

stoneborn pact requires you to auto attack once every 2 seconds to access most of the healing.

font of life will massively favour champions with a high attack speed.

So? Unless I'm mistaken, there isn't going to be a rune that replaces the damage lost from Fervor of Battle not being there anymore, meaning lifesteal will be less strong, and I know you raised the point of Berserk as a Keystone, but if somebody can actually efficiently orb walk someone to death at attack speeds that go above the cap, they honestly deserve all of the possible healing that comes with Font of Life.

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

So? Unless I'm mistaken, there isn't going to be a rune that replaces the damage lost from Fervor of Battle not being there anymore, meaning lifesteal will be less strong, and I know you raised the point of Berserk as a Keystone, but if somebody can actually efficiently orb walk someone to death at attack speeds that go above the cap, they honestly deserve all of the possible healing that comes with Font of Life.

why do you assume orb walking will be neccessary?

its the same fucked up situation we have now with marksmen being protected by ardent censer supports. they can sit in place and just drain tank from behind support shields thanks to the on hit heal.

this rune as a beefed up ardent censer effect is a really fucking terrible idea.

Jbels1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MpaXizrG,comment-id=00000000000000000002000000000000,timestamp=2017-09-16T19:44:16.521+0000)

why do you assume orb walking will be neccessary?

its the same fucked up situation we have now with marksmen being protected by ardent censer supports. they can sit in place and just drain tank from behind support shields thanks to the on hit heal.

this rune as a beefed up ardent censer effect is a really fucking terrible idea.

Granted, ADCs are walking sacks of shit that should have been nerfed ages ago in relation to how survivable they are. But you're assuming that every support that uses their adc to break ardent will be using this rune. Don't forget it scales off of max HP, meaning champions like Janna WON'T use this because they won't get enough out of it to justify taking it

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

Granted, ADCs are walking sacks of shit that should have been nerfed ages ago in relation to how survivable they are. But you're assuming that every support that uses their adc to break ardent will be using this rune. Don't forget it scales off of max HP, meaning champions like Janna WON'T use this because they won't get enough out of it to justify taking it

no, you dont understand. its worse.

its not supports who need to run this. imagine ardent censer supports and tanks with this together in one game.

there is no reason bot lane cant still run lulu/twitch, and you just put a tank into the jungle with this rune.

i never claimed that supports are going to run this. im saying this will end up stacking on top of censer, just like top laners and junglers end up taking knights vow and locket in this meta.

Jbels1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MpaXizrG,comment-id=0000000000000000000200000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-09-16T19:57:23.929+0000)

no, you dont understand. its worse.

its not supports who need to run this. imagine ardent censer supports and tanks with this together in one game.

there is no reason bot lane cant still run lulu/twitch, and you just put a tank into the jungle with this rune.

I mean, you could do that, but I feel like your tank would be shooting itself in the foot for most of the game until teamfights start. I would rather just get a rune on that tank that either makes it soak more damage, do more damage, or helps with my clear so I can be all over the map faster. It's too soon to tell whether or not Font of Life will be broken

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

I mean, you could do that, but I feel like your tank would be shooting itself in the foot for most of the game until teamfights start. I would rather just get a rune on that tank that either makes it soak more damage, do more damage, or helps with my clear so I can be all over the map faster. It's too soon to tell whether or not Font of Life will be broken

there arent any tank keystone runes that are useful on their own.

we have 3 keystone runes in resolve right now, and thats a version of grasp, a rune that grants allies a shield when you cc enemies, and this.

font of lifes on-hit heal scales up to twice as strong as ardent censer on its own (without stoneplate active), and that item is already a big factor that breaks marksmen.

i dont see how this would be shooting yourself in the foot.

Jbels1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MpaXizrG,comment-id=000000000000000000020000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-09-16T20:01:54.842+0000)

there arent any tank keystone runes that are useful on their own.

we have 3 keystone runes in resolve right now, and thats a version of grasp, a rune that grants allies a shield when you cc enemies, and this.

i dont see how this would be shooting yourself in the foot.

As far as we know, those are the only runes in Resolve that exist CURRENTLY. For all we know, there could be more on the way. Like I said, it's just too soon to tell.

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

As far as we know, those are the only runes in Resolve that exist CURRENTLY. For all we know, there could be more on the way. Like I said, it's just too soon to tell.

even if there are other runes, mathematically this is already clearly broken.

one thing thats most likely to happen before it hits live is the removal of slows being able to trigger the effect.

but even then, this is downright crazy and obviously a terrible idea. ardent censer already shows what an effect these large on hit heals have on marksmen. you stack this shit on top of it, and how are you supposed to deal with them?

CaptainAntiHeroz1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=MpaXizrG,comment-id=0000000000000000000200000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-09-16T19:57:23.929+0000)

no, you dont understand. its worse.

its not supports who need to run this. imagine ardent censer supports and tanks with this together in one game.

there is no reason bot lane cant still run lulu/twitch, and you just put a tank into the jungle with this rune.

i never claimed that supports are going to run this. im saying this will end up stacking on top of censer, just like top laners and junglers end up taking knights vow and locket in this meta.

Ooooooo but the glory that is season 8 Let me explain supports that can abuse font of life Zed Syndra Ashe

The point is any and all cc leaves the mark so any champ with any cc can got overgrowth plus font and their support item, them 360 into a cacophony of whatever they think will help them drop that enemy vayne the fastest

Big Buff1 votes

there's a difference for ardent censer being strong before, and font of life in the new season. ardent censer gave ~27-28 on hit healing at like, 10 minutes. What you are saying is Cull should be removed because it grants 3 life on hit and favors fast, on-hit champions. Which, for the record, isn't marksmen early on. "oh boy, Imma go ahead and heal 6 health once a second(or like, every 0.8 seconds if they get berserker's greaves)! Oh wait, that's literally just 6% lifesteal with 100 AD!"item 1083 item 1053

The problem with ardent was the sheer amount of power and sustain it had early on in the game, not the values themselves. have you taken a look at some of the other keystones? fervor of battle offers literally 2k gold worth of stats for auto attacking 4 times on a melee champion. Font of life is only extremely strong on super healthy tanks, and only later on in the game (past the 15-20 minute mark, where ardent censer started to fade out in effectiveness).

TL;DR: Font of life is fine. Not only is it a combat only thing, like stoneborn (which is a crazy amount of healing anyway), it's power isn't nearly as strong as pre-nerf ardent censer.

ModWulf Helhammer2 votes

It's more of a new version of Stoneborn Pact.

Also currently Ardent has changes that removes the on-hit heal

KoKoboto2 votes

Yes... They need to rework the concept... Every single rune so far can be used for everything and has so many different situations for it.

This rune is strictly CC w/ Marksmen and that's bullshit. Make it so the healing can be used for everyone not just one class. Marksmen don't need more power.

Critmaster Garen2 votes

at this point, i want to remind everyone that this thing is going to be a keystone.

Berserk 3 seconds after damaging a champion you go Berserk, gaining 60% Attack Speed for 3 seconds. You can extend the effect to 10 seconds by attacking an >enemy champion. Berserk lets you transcend the attack speed cap.

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