and Ezreal is too busy abusing Iceborn to buy it much. Clearly the attempt to take it away from Bruisers and give it to ADCs failed so can we have all of the stats back? It can keep the CDR tho I like that.
BluePolarizer20 votesIf only Triforce could be 
or 
...
SirHeavyScrotum6 votesThe Stinger Build actually sounds amazing, except that it would give 20% cdr which would be a little much for an item that is built on Irelia.
43161549_DEL9 votesI WANT ZEPHYR BACK THOUGH....fuck trinity...just give me zephyr T_T
PeponiPoro2 votesI am so pissed the removed Zephyr, that item had the highest attack speed of ad itemization. Building for Gnar has become more difficult...
LordGeovanni2 votesthere was 0 reason to remove zephyr
Poske1 votesThe Stinger Build actually sounds amazing, except that it would give 20% cdr which would be a little much for an item that is built on Irelia.
Irelia players dont even build it anymore
She doesnt care about crit She doesnt care about cooldown that much She cares that attackspeed got reduced She cares that Ap got removed..
They all just go regablade and full tank.. Same thing is with jax
Trinity became a 4k gold trash item unless you are corki
SirHeavyScrotum1 votesExcept that every Korean Masters Irelia player builds Trinity force. Rageblade Irelia is a low elo thing.
Edit: Frozen Heart is still a really commonly built item on her anyway, because her R has an insanely low cooldown with it and her E will come up more in duals. Irelia does care about CDR.
Poske1 votesExcept that every Korean Masters Irelia player builds Trinity force. Rageblade Irelia is a low elo thing.
Edit: Frozen Heart is still a really commonly built item on her anyway, because her R has an insanely low cooldown with it and her E will come up more in duals. Irelia does care about CDR.
I agree cdr is important for irelia
Spirit visage + glacial is core for defensive items
I wouldnt be surprised if players shifted towards iceborn It gives 20% cdr and procs her q
Alright Irelia still builds trinity
But that doesnt change the fact that trinity rework was fail Those who were using trinity no longer like it that much to the point where they even dont use it (Corki / ez / kow maw Though corki does still build it )
And it became worse item for nearly any bruiser.. whether it is still viable for them or not
It only became better for Lucian And Gp
SirHeavyScrotum1 votesI agree that the Triforce rework was a fail, I was just saying that putting 20% cdr on it would be a problem if built with the Stinger for certain champs, the one that stood out in my mind was Irelia. Nasus would also be pretty strong if they did that to it. The other option with the shard would probably be way too strong on Lucian (double energized sheen proced shot would hurt like a mother), but of course they could always just balance out those champs afterwards.
Poske1 votesI agree that the Triforce rework was a fail, I was just saying that putting 20% cdr on it would be a problem if built with the Stinger for certain champs, the one that stood out in my mind was Irelia. Nasus would also be pretty strong if they did that to it. The other option with the shard would probably be way too strong on Lucian (double energized sheen proced shot would hurt like a mother), but of course they could always just balance out those champs afterwards.
Irelia is already a problem...
And No good nasus ll ever build trinity
You always want to go max cdr and max tank on him
SirHeavyScrotum1 votesEver heard of a guy named Sirhcez? He builds Triforce pretty much every game on Nasus. The move speed is really good. He's basically the only high elo Nasus main.
hi im alphonse15 votes
No no, it's fine. Tri force is fine just the way it is
Sire Hippington9 votesthe most iritateing thing is that Lucian, the critscaleing spellweaver, doesn't built trinity, the spellweaver+crit item...
Nunya Bezwacks1 votesidk wtf this spellweaver is but lucian is a CASTER and trinity is trash for casters in comparison to 
Sire Hippington3 votesSpellweaver means useing a mix of AAs and spells, usually in an AA-spell-AA-spell rotation - you weave spells in between AAs and the other way around, so prettymuch what lucians passive wants you to do. And trinity by giving a good bunch of bonus damage on the next AA after a spelcast, so it suplements the spellweaving playstell perfectly well.
And ideally, you would get trinity+ER, just that they kinda killed that combo when they made it so you need 30% crit for ER
GayFluffyUnicorn1 votesThe reason u don't take trinity on lucian anymore is the changed sheen proc passive. It's only 200 base AD instead of bonus (when i'm not mistaken). More AD, crit and 50% extra crit dmg from IE for example just amplifies his doubleshot much better than the little sheen proc.
Sire Hippington2 votesit never scaled with bonus ad, trinity always was base. and as a first item, thos sheen procs do outdamage IE, unless your really lucky with the crits, though compareing trinity with IE leads nowhere anyway. The compareable item would be RFC, and rfc is more common cause the extra range on an AA is pretty huge, especially later on when a single passive-proc with crit can take more than 50% of a squishy. It also offers not much less damage compared to how much cheaper it is than trinity.
but mostly, this discussion isn't about whever trinity is good or not, nor about why most adc don't built it. It'S about the fact that adc don't built it, not even lucian who should be the adc that synergieses most with it as his kit supports the spellblade proc to the fullest and he scales well with crit compared to corki or ezreal while nor really wanting AS, and the changes they made in preseason to it thus have failed, as the only goal of those changes was to make it more attractive for adc. And since the atempt to make trinity an adc item failed, it really would be nice to chage it back into the great bruiser item it once was.
MunchCrunchLunch5 votesits terrible on ezreal. since ezreal has to abuse something to be good honestly.
Ackelope9 votesWhy is it terrible on Ezreal? He can make use of just about every stat it gives. Sheen effects, in general, are quite good on him because of his Q's ability to apply them, the attack speed and crit are still good, if you're not auto attacking while playing Ezreal you're doing something wrong and losing out on a lot of damage that his passive brings, the movespeed on hit and unit kill apply on his q and make it easier for him to kite, extra hp is never something bad, and the cdr is good too, Ezreal relies heavily on auto attacks and abilities. Sure, I don't think it's currently the best thing on him right now, blue fits this meta too well, but tri force is certainly not terrible.
GawnMower2 votesi have always found that 
is better on ezreal. everytime i see triforce ez i die a little on the inside as they cant kite people
Ackelope3 votesI disagree. Saying that Ezreal can't kite, regardless of what he builds, is just wrong. He's one of the best kiters in the game I'd say. Tforce helps him kite by giving the movespeed boost from phage. I won't claim that tforce is better for him when kiting than IBG, but it certainly can still get the job done.
GawnMower1 votesmy wording was pretty shitty in previous comment, most triforce ezreals, that i see, cant kite because they have someone very fast chasing them, and you are reliant on hitting your q's in order to recharge your e faster to keep kitting.
Where as with IBG if you miss your q you can still auto to apply the slow, ive always found that the better way to stop people chasing you down is to slow them down rather than speeding yourself up. especially now with udyr flying around and rammus coming back onto the scene.
He can almost certainly still kite with triforce, hell he can still kite without either tri or IBG, just IBG makes it so much easier
LegitBusinessman3 votesDon't bring attention to this thread, if people start trying out triforce Lucian and realize how op it is, bot lane is screwed.
YCitizenSnipsY14 votesTri force Lucian was the original build for him. People were well aware of how good he made use of the item with his passive.
Unstoppable Monk10 votes
RELEASE KOREAN LUCIAN 
Akali is SO HOT44 votesCurrently, all of the other ADC items are so good that Triforce isn't worth getting over them
Rew7113 votesWell, Corki and Ezreal weren't the only ones I'd use it with. I'd also build AP+AD on Varus and even Teemo. When I'd want to take Teemo bot, this item was there for me because it helped a lot with everything he lacked. Teemo ADC is hard, but rewarding to me. He's so squishy and easy to kill. Also, I love buffing Varus's W, so I get its AP percentage up to a bonus 2% with the amount of AP I get. Then I can harass others with the fact I can take 21% of their health in late game. I once even got it up to 5%, and went ballistic with the fact it can take 30% of their health. It's like being eaten by Tahm Kench, only it takes more effort to do it because of items.
yoniame3 votesi play ap varus, but guinsoo is much more viable for him
TheNewHumanine8 votesIf you're autoattacking enough to proc Guinsoo's on AP Varus you're doing it wrong man...
Sire Hippington3 votesif your not AAing enough, your doing it wrong, unlike ad-varus, his Q+E deal little damage, you have to AA for the W stacks, as well as the good ap scaleing on the W on-hit
OyddAWqJ5r2 votes8 times? That's way too much. You'll never proc Guinsoos Rage reliably.
OyddAWqJ5r13 votes
Occasionally 
.
Levyathyn3 votesI literally came in here to comment about how I still use Tri on Lucian, and it works. Admittedly I'm not in Diamond or anything, but still.
A Miss Fortune5 votesTri force still isn't a bad item on Lucian. If you need to hit an earlier powerspike it's better than going for IE or ER because they usually require crit chance to be fully effective.
lolipopevelynn3 votesdidnt only lose the AP and gain the CDR? i dont get the bitching about it losing stats and become a ADC item lol? infact its a really terrible item on ADCs because you only get half of its passive MS buff. i still dont get why corki even considers building it when there are so many better damage options.
RisenDarkKnight3 votesIt not only lost the the AP it also lost 15% attack speed, 5 ad, and 3% movespeed. That's a pretty significant loss on auto attack reliant champions. It's really only good on champs that love Crit and CDR like Corki and Gangplank.
Akali is SO HOT15 votesGained CDR, AD was lowered, AP was removed, AS halved, MS lowered by 3%, mana increased by 50, and Crit chance doubled to 20%
AD, AS, and MS are all things that Bruisers like to have (having that AP isn't a bad thing either as a lot of them have AP scalings) and all of them were nerfed for the sake of giving it to ADCs. Especially for champions like Jax and Irelia who love having attack speed. The CDR added was nice but crit chance is something that Bruiser do not want at all unless they are going some weird ass crit build so doubling it made it even less enticing on them.
Not to mention that the cost was increased for all of the stat changes.
Vellich0r3 votesIt's not meant as an adc item.
Akali is SO HOT12 votesThe whole point of the changes were to make it an ADC item.
???????
Tis a nice day2 votesCan you get a source on where a Rioter says this?
Akali is SO HOT7 votesThey changed Trinity force to be more marksmen oriented the same patch as the huge marksmen update. They don't have to say anything to make it clear that they changed it so that Marksmen would buy it more instead of Bruisers. Same with Black Cleaver. They don't just make drastic changes like that for no reason especially during a big of an update as that one
delonix2 votesI actually think "Tis a nice day" is right about this. Here are the changes: 5.22 & 5.24.
In the 5.22 changes, there's no context that I can find, but the changes are notably listed under "Items" and not "Marksman Itemization," where all of the "marksman items" are listed. In the 5.24 changes, Riot comes right out and says Trinity Force is "used far less as a true marksman item."
The increased crit and decreased attack speed, attack damage, and movement speed do seem like changes geared towards marksmen, but it's important to keep in mind that outside of Corki and Ezreal, the passive effects of Trinity Force are really strong for bruisers (or fighters, juggernauts, whatever you want to call them). Irelia and Jax are still building Trinity Force, as are Gangplank, Nasus, Hecarim, and probably others. CDR is also generally better on fighters than marksmen, and fighters with AP and AD scalings, like Jax, Irelia, etc., also got the new Guinsoo's, which is amazing.
I'm not sure what your point is about the Black Cleaver. I don't remember any changes that would make marksmen buy it more than bruisers.
Poske2 votesI actually think "Tis a nice day" is right about this. Here are the changes: 5.22 & 5.24.
In the 5.22 changes, there's no context that I can find, but the changes are notably listed under "Items" and not "Marksman Itemization," where all of the "marksman items" are listed. In the 5.24 changes, Riot comes right out and says Trinity Force is "used far less as a true marksman item."
The increased crit and decreased attack speed, attack damage, and movement speed do seem like changes geared towards marksmen, but it's important to keep in mind that outside of Corki and Ezreal, the passive effects of Trinity Force are really strong for bruisers (or fighters, juggernauts, whatever you want to call them). Irelia and Jax are still building Trinity Force, as are Gangplank, Nasus, Hecarim, and probably others. CDR is also generally better on fighters than marksmen, and fighters with AP and AD scalings, like Jax, Irelia, etc., also got the new Guinsoo's, which is amazing.
I'm not sure what your point is about the Black Cleaver. I don't remember any changes that would make marksmen buy it more than bruisers.
Correction irelia jax nasus hecarim (unless its toplane hecarim) are no longer building trinity Of course if someone is a bad player then he is just bad ...
Sire Hippington3 votesSo they just decided to reduce stats bruisers want and therefor give stats that adc want on it for no reason at all? Sure, thats much better...
Fact stays that the changes made it way less attracive for most of the previous users, as many actually did use the ap, and prettymuch all really loved AS, and ad also is great for them. Crit is the one stat most of the old trinity users didn't give a damn about as it was way to unreliable as you wouldn't reach high numbers, and it isn't the best stat without lots of ad/as/critdamage on top anyway, while most trinity users only built trinity and maybe another of item. So all stats non-ADCs care about have been reduced/removed, and the one stat only adc care about has been doubled. Cdr is nice every single champ in the game.
Also, i haven't seen a good irelia or jax getting trinity anymoe, nor nasus. gp gets it for obvios reasons, and heca also still gets it cuase he never scaled well with as and his ap scaleings were compareable low aswell, thoough i still see many hecarim useing iceborn instead since the changes.
And for BC, for some reason the AD was increased aswel as the cost, and the defense decreased. It made it alot worse for juggernauts and bruisers that mostly valued the shred, cdr, mobillity and hp, while it became an interesting armor-pen option for phsical DDs, or it would be if it wasn't so damn expensive. Right now it feels bad on any champ for me unless i'm ahead and can aford to pay 3500g for little defense on a jugger/bruiser, or for little ad on an adc/assasin. At this point, it would be way better to split it up in two items, one givng less hp and more ad, the other giving more hp and less ad and adding a switch funktion like we have on the hydras.
delonix2 votesThanks for the reply. After I little bit of digging, I found that it's much clearer why the changes to Trinity Force were made. The changes weren't targeted at Trinity Force at all, it just inherited the stat changes from the component items. Phage had its AD lowered by 5 because it's a bruiser item, not an ADC item. Zeal had its crit chance doubled from 10% to 20% and its attack speed lowered to make it more of an ADC item. Sheen had its AP removed and its mana increased and got CDR, making it significantly better on bruisers who wanted to build Sheen but not Lichbane.
The overall changes might have made Trinity Force slightly less appealing to bruisers, but that doesn't mean that Riot had any intention of making Trinity Force the ADC Sheen item, so trying to call them out on that doesn't make any sense. Crit might not be great for Bruisers, but they've always paid for crit when building Trinity Force. And for the AD/AP/AS that bruisers want, they now get Guinsoo's, which is ridiculously strong. I don't think all of the Trinity Force users I listed were getting it, but I know at least Irelia and Jax love it.
Trinity Force is about more than raw stats, which is one reason why it's always going to be more of a bruiser item than a traditional marksman item. The two passives are fantastic on most bruisers. Bonus movement speed when you're hitting something means you can't get kited as easily, and Spellblade works great with the high base AD of bruisers.
CDR is okay on every champ, but it's significantly better on champions with a lot of strong abilities. Traditional marksmen who are autoattack reliant might like CDR, but it's way down on their stat priority list because most of their damage is coming from autoattacks, which are modified by AD, Attack Speed, and crits. Bruisers, on the other hand, tend to love CDR because it allows them to gapclose more, CC more, and put out more damage.
As for who is building Trinity Force, champion.gg lists it in the most common and highest winrate builds of all of the champs I listed. Hecarim top and jungle both use Trinity Force more often than IBG and win more often with Trinity Force than IBG. If you have a source for good irelias or jaxes saying Trinity Force isn't worth building anymore, that would be cool.
For the Black Cleaver, the cost increase is partially due to the increased value of the stats now that it builds out of Caulfield's instead of Kindlegem, and partially is a nerf targeted at juggernauts. Deadman's Plate has been receiving a bunch of nerfs for the same reason: juggernauts are supposed to be low mobility, low cc, high damage, and high health. With the Black Cleaver and Deadman's Plate, they were still low on cc, but now had high damage, high health, and high mobility. The Black Cleaver still has all of the things that juggernauts and bruisers want though: shred, cdr, mobility, and hp. The Black Cleaver is still being built on juggernauts like Garen, Illaoi, and Darius.
Sort of tangential to your last point, the Hydras probably won't be free to switch anymore after the next patch.
Sire Hippington2 votesthe cost increase is partially due to the increased value of the stats now that it builds out of Caulfield's instead of Kindlegem,
the question is why they changed the builtpath in the first place. It was a fine item befor, now as i said it feels a bad pchase if your not ahead cause you pay really alot gold for not much tankiness on champs that need to get tanky. Anf of course juggernauts still get it. Thy don't have much cdr options, they desperatly need all the mobillity they need, and they usually need the %shred to stay relevant later on. There are no alternatives, but that doesn change that bc doesn't feel great to get right now most of the time, even if it feels needed.
for trinity, my source is my own experience. Getting trinity on most champs doesn't feels good anymore for me, and i have alot more succes with other builts. At the same time, the trinity useing jax and irelias i meet usually do not much at all, while those who go for other builts, usually guinsoo's+tank, are quite hard to deal with.
An for the components changes, I do get the sheen change, while i certainly miss the ap on sheen items on many champs, the cdr is a nice replacement and it makes sheenitems more atteracive for a wider range of champs. However, they could have replaced zeal with a better suiteing item and finally get rid of crit on trinity. And jst because phage lost some ad does not have to mean trinity needs to loose some aswell, especially since phage became cheaper while trinity became more expensive. And for the high winbrate builts: trinity is a win more item, it offers mostly offensive combat power vs single target, aswell as sticking power, so it's great to get if ahead. It'S pretty common to built more agressive if you have a lead and more defensive if you are behind. Corelation is not neccesarily causation.
i stand with it, if the those chages weren't aimed at makeing it more attracive for adc, then it were pretty poor shortsightned changes with no purpose. Prettymuch colateral damage from other itemchanges that wasn't take care of. There was alot feedback on PBE that bruiser players didn't like the changes atall. If the aim wasn't to make it worse on bruiser, then why stick with the change if it is mostly disliked?
Gentzer1 votesI still kinda like the item on Miss Fortune. The issue is that you give up too much to get Triforce. For most ADCs, getting Triforce means giving up either a Zeal item, an IE or Reaver, Life Steal or defensive items like Maw or Scimitar
dangopee7 votesDude she has 63 base AD at level 18. Enjoy your 126 damage Spellblades. Grams of Damage. If you want a phage passive for kiting, cleaver is better on her in every way.
