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Oh great ADC mains please show me

Photos of Ghosts··4 votes·1,401 views

Whether it's me or my ADCs who are being dumb. Ok so I mostly play blind pick, and often pick Soraka. There are often assassins in the enemy team, sometimes stealth assassins. Against those I always make sure to upgrade my red trinket (...OK, maybe the idea comes to me only past 30 mins). Now, I'm bronze, and in bronze you often have these moments where neither team has any idea what to do, so you just depush every time the minions come to your base. During those moments, the teams inevitably split up, and that is the time for assassins to shine. There comes into play my little Soraka, faithfully staying by her ADC. I can silence the assassin, but if it works on Kata, it's not very effective against someone like Rengar. Anyway, AD assassins usually have Youmuu's to get out of it and dodge my slow. What happens then is: my ADC gets bursted to 0. 4 times in a row. Me: "dude you have lifesteal and I have tons of heals, just build some [armor or mr], he won't be able to instakill you and our sustained damage and healing will render him useless." My ADC: "-.- yea sure imma build tank on an adc" Me: "Not TANK, just rush the part of GA which is the most useful right now, I really hope it's enough" My adc: "I'm ADC not tank"

... What I see in that is "ZOMG ROFLMG MY COOKIE CUTTER BUILD DOESNT SAY THIS AND IM MORE USEFUL DEAD WITH 30 MR THAN ALIVE WITH 70" Am I wrong for some reason?

23 Comments

Chuck Charles2 votes

well number one, you are worrying far too much about other people's actions rather than your own. You can't control people in this game. The sooner you realize that the better. You can't even suggest usually because most people have too much pride to admit they are doing something wrong. The number one way to avoid being assassinated is to not be in position where that is possible.

a GA, banshees, QSS, or maw of malmortius are all viable options but if said assassin is fed enough it might not be enough by itself even. Generally speaking that adc should not be in a spot where that can happen. You should also generally as a team not be split up past 35-40 minutes as death timers are insanely long.

Wards are also your friends wherever you are going to be with said adc, you should ward DEEPLY for him so you have warning of when assassin is coming. Ward entrances to paths they would have to take to reach a spot where they could "surprise you". It won't always save you but wards are your friend.

Soraka is a great support, but I feel in bronze, you don't wanna play a true support since most carries are bad. Just play a carry yourself and carry the game. Lux, Annie are perfect for this

supes the lost1 votes

The hard engage tanks like Leona, Blitz, and Thresh are also really good in bronze, plus, I've seen many an adc just eat hooks all game, so you have that going for it.

Wegest2 votes

ADC main chiming in here.

So, the problem going on is twofold.

  1. The ADC is positioned poorly
  2. Lack of vision

1- When i say poor position, in this case it's not about team fight positioning but map position.

Example - It's about 15 minutes in, that lovely post lane transition phase. Your tower is down, so is the enemy top tower. there's a 3v3 going on mid and 2 people are missing on the enemy team, and you and the ADC are pushing out bot. Most bronze/silver will push past river. This is overextending and out of position. Some will push up to river. Without clear knowledge of where the missing enemy assassin is, this is again incorrect in your scenario of "The assassin eats us". Get the lane going in the other direction, ward the nearest to river incoming lane, and go join your team in mid. If your ADC is not on board, leave em behind to solo overextend. 1 death is better than 2. Having said that, if 15 seconds ago the assassin was seen on map top lane, shove the bottom to river and then roll up, you're safe (relatively). If the enemy assassin is visible and no where near on map (and you can account for 4-5 enemy champs right now) then keep shoving that bot lane to heart's content -until- the enemy notices and people vanish from map, then it's time to roll out.

2 - When facing an enemy assassin who is good/aggressive, you have to run a ward chain protecting yourself and your ADC. Between the two of you mid/late you should have 5 wards (your sightstone their upgraded trinket). Use these wards to monitor incoming gank paths and prevent the assassin coming in and killing you both. If your ADC refuses such tactics and "knows better" go be support for someone else. It should only take a couple of deaths for the ADC to realize they are doing it wrong, or they'll turn troll and hey, who want's to support them anyway.

tl:dr - know the enemies location, or get advanced notice when they are coming. Vision wins games. Lack of vision feeds the enemy. Good luck.

Photos of Ghosts1 votes

c: ty

DarkDeamonDragon2 votes

Advanced warning of an attack is the best way to help you and your ADC get away or get better positioning. The way you're talking about the ADCs you support, I'm guessing they're in the mindset they don't have to help ward either. Try to encourage them to upgrade their trinket and if that doesn't work then throw wards out along your route to keep yourself and your ADC safe. If you ping to go back, and they don't listen, go back yourself. Like someone else said, 1 death is better than 2.

You may also want to keep in mind that after the laning phase is over, your obligation is not specifically to your ADC, but to whomever is the carry. That could potentially be your mid, jungle, or top (even in some very rare cases when I'm playing a support like Annie or Velkoz I end up becoming the carry). Stick with the one that's doing the best on the team and protect them instead of the ADC if necessary.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

Most ADCs have so low hp that even armor can't save them - they need good positioning...

Photos of Ghosts3 votes

True. However, I've seen so many ADCs getting bursted to 20 HP and dying to an autoattack, and with their low armor a mere 50 armor would have meant a good 30% damage reduction.

NoMonku1 votes

It isn't really worth it in most situations. Only if they can actually afford the GA would it be useful because they can die, but if they GA never gets popped they never needed the GA in the first place. IMO at lower levels of play it doesn't make too much of a difference if you get only one defensive item because they aren't skilled enough to be able to take advantage of that difference. Also there are a lot of factors going into how your ADC is dying. If they are clearing minions outside of turrent range, if the assassin can stand right next to them, there isn't any actual way for you to stop them as Soraka unless you have very good reflexes. Also if they are AD, they can most likely auto your ADC to death if they can't kite/position correctly.

I say if you want to keep your ADC alive more, play TahmKench since he can eat them and make it impossible for them to take damage. One of the reasons I dislike supporting is because if my ADC doesn't perform to my "standard" I really don't feel like waiting in lane babysitting them or helping them get through laning phase. It is why I prefer to play supports like TahmKench Bard who either can negate how bad they are or lets me get away from them more often.

Fiveofswords1 votes

depending on the assasin on the other team (say rengar or something) there really isnt crap the adc can do. their only chance is a safety in numbers sort of thing. when they are alone its just nothing to do...best chance is having good vision

basically you want the adc to sacrifice their role as adc for the sake of living a few seconds longer against an assasin. those few seconds are unlikely to matter. most likely they are gonna die anyway. and meanwhile if you ever do have a teamfight, the adc is not going to be as effective. not worth.

Photos of Ghosts1 votes

I'm always with my ADC. I'll agree that all would be easier if the team stood grouped and stunlocked any incoming single target assassin, but teamplay (any gameplay element) is harder to achieve than rightclicking an item in the shop

IcyPepper3 votes

basically you want the adc to sacrifice their role as adc for the sake of living a few seconds longer against an assasin.

Er, two things.

  1. One defensive item does not take away the ADC's role. Most ADC's tend to have five carry items, and one defensive item. It's the most effective way to play ADC, and GA tends to be popular (with banshee's or randuins, depending on the enemy comp).

  2. A few seconds is a lot. If the ADC could survive for a few seconds in this hypothetical situation, that's enough for Soraka to heal them up alongside their lifesteal and potentially defeat the assassin. 2-3 seconds can make all the difference in this sort of game, not to mention that 2-3 seconds of survival (plus GA possibly) is instantly more useful than 0 seconds because you instantly popped.

Go ahead and fact check me. Here's an excellent resource. Most if not all the effective ADC builds by champions have a sixth defensive item (and if it's not late-game, nobody said you had to rush the item. Sometimes a chain vest that you're going to build into a GA later is effective enough by itself). Banshee's, randuins, and GA seem to be effective, while occasionally you'll see a defensive/offensive hybrid item like item 3139

Fiveofswords1 votes

adc do often get some defensive item....late game. but you need the adc to maintain their damage so they are effective. soraka has no kill potential so if the adc has defense rather than damage, this makes the assasins death even less likely. the best you get is a chance to escape. No, the simpler solution when you are playing vs a strong assasin is just for adc to stay with at least 2 other people at all times. that way even if the assasin can kill the adc, the assasin dies for it anyway. not worth.

think of it like...i dunno...starcraft. adc are like seige tanks.the best way for seige tanks to 'protect' themselves is by INCREASING their damage. they need to be difficult to reach, and then they just need lots of damage to melt the enemy front line. You cannot 'beef up' the seige tanks to the point that they are unkillable, you really have no option but to screen them or be careful they are never caught put of position.

Photos of Ghosts2 votes

Dude, I'm talking about AS item + 2 BF items ADC. What's the point in building more damage, you won't oneshot the assassin with an autoattack.

Fiveofswords1 votes

obviously the point isnt to 1 shot the assasin, its to do damage in teamfights, enough damage that people are more restricted in what they can do. If the adc does have enough damage to be any threat at all to their front line then well the whole team is screwed. if the adc cant kill a tower fast enough for the enemy to group and react, or kill dragon.baron fast enough....you get the idea? adc is damage, their defense is 99% positioning and peel from their team.

Sire Hippington3 votes

you don't deal damage in a teamfight at all if you are dead... spending 700g on armor or mr after IE/PD is often the better choice than a pickaxe, especially of you have strong healing/shielding as backup, as armor/mr increase the effective hp you gain from heals/shields aswell.

I've one alot of adc games cause i got some small early defense, makeing the difference from getting bursted or surviving with ~15% hp and then kiteing the enemie down or sustaining back up.

Most adc are just far to obsessed with their cooky cutter builds, even if merely changeing your boots would make a huge difference. Most adc aren't that dependend on the 25%as from boots, getting ninjas to outtrade the enemie adc and surviving a wild rengar or haveing mercs to escape that lux cage 0.7sec earlyer while takeing some less damage often is far more valuable.

IcyPepper1 votes

Well good thing I specifically said you don't have to rush a defensive item early, and can just partially build it so you can build other items in the meanwhile!

If 750 gold can help you survive, then do it. I'm not saying you should spend 2800 right away. I do think of these things, you know.

Photos of Ghosts1 votes

Also take into account that these assassins are going for solo missions (bronze "I DESURV CHALLENJOUR" mentality) so if we take them out as a duo then we have a 5v4 teamfight with our full HP ADC (ty raka)

Fiveofswords1 votes

soraka has such amazingly low kill potential, theres really no chance for this. either the assasin doesnt have enough burst to kill the adc, whereby the adc would win with damage, making soraka unnecessary, or the assasin gets a double kill, it jsut takes a second longer because the adc spent 600 on chain mail or something. its not goign to matter.

IcyPepper1 votes

Have you considered that Soraka's healing might make a difference if the assassin doesn't 100-0 the ADC immediately?

Soraka has low kill potential, but drastically increases her ADC"s kill potential by helping them survive. Especially if she builds the right support items to increase their dps.

Amadeus Wolfgang1 votes

Ok so i am a ADC main, i get a good support there and here, but you shouldnt be worrying about other peoples action's on what they care and what you care, leave it be, just play the game and let it be, someday you might get reported for this :l Just saying

Only Play Darius1 votes

ADC mains tend to be toxic and self-centered. They are also playing the only role you are required to have on your team.

Don't be surprised if you're support and your ADC ignores your advice and tells you they know best. That's just how they are.

crobemeister1 votes

I used to main Supp, but switched to ADC. If you are facing a team of assasins targeting your ADC, I think Soraka isn't that great of a pick. Often the ADC will be insta popped before you can silence/heal regardless of having a defensive item. You are better off picking a champ that can properly peel and lock down the diving assasin. Like Leona Alistar Nautilus

Of course the ADC should have summoner 4 or a reposition ability or QSS to survive the initial dive.

A Miss Fortune1 votes

In my opinion as a long time ADC main, I don't think there's an issue with building something like item 1031 before you've completed all of your damage items. It won't really delay you that long and it can be extremely useful, you build it into item 3026 anyways on top of that.

Or you can build item 3157 on an ADC. I actually build it vs Rengar a lot. The AP isn't that useful, but the Armor and Active can be life saving.

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