Fuck kogmaw
goes 0/5 in lane but carries the game because they had zac and janna who peeled and we cant even touch him. kills the whole team with 
. such cancer. I was hecarim with 
and over 4k hp. He kills me in less than 3 seconds.
104 Comments
SpecterVonBaren18 votesI miss old Kog when he took skill, positioning, and proper ability usage to play. Now it's just "get items, press w, right click, deal tons of damage." They made him more brainless to play than freaking Soraka!
Veltox9 votesTo be fair 
needs to land her q for a good heal now.
BladeSteel1 votesThey're reverting him! :D
SpecterVonBaren1 votesI KNOW! Isn't it great?!
FantasySniper16 votesI miss the time when 
would kill himself on 
bill843 votesHe still does that.
Awhegark1 votes'Dont try to argue with him. The sheep on this boards just jump on the hate bandwagon. After they do this, logic goes out of the window.
Troll for Trump2 votesPicks assassin to delete Kog'Maw
"WTf assasssins are broken bs, I can't do anything wtf?!"
Things like this are why assassins exist.
Dracocrash14 votespicks assasin to kill kogmaw kogmaw kills assasin first
:^)
Embertine8 votesNot anymore he doesn't.
bill844 votes 
This is a fairly standard Rammus build (although not necissarily in this order). It gives 290 armor itself, which is increased to 410 once defensive ball curl is used.
This means that thornmail, with just the bonus armor part and without runes, will be doing 102.5 magic damage per auto by itself. Additionally, defensive ball curl has a base damage of 65 along with 10% of his armor as magic damage. Add this 410 armor to his base of 104 and you get 514, meaning that defensive ball curl will be doing 106.4 magic damage per auto.
So with these two combined, Rammus is doing 208.9 magic damage to kog every time he is hit with an auto. However, this is decreased by about 23% because of kog's base mr. This means that kog will only take about 160.7 damage for every auto he uses. now at Kog's base health of 1912, it will take about 12 autos for Kog to die and that is if he takes no other damage the entire time.
Now what about life steal you say? well thornmail also reflects 15% of damage dealt from autos (this does include their on-hit effects). Meanwhile, Kog will usually only buy a single lifesteal item: 
which only has 10% lifesteal, so that healing is more than canceled out, especially since that healing is reduced by resistances while the reflection is not.
But now one last scenario that I probably should have included earlier. Kog will usually buy which gives him more mr. Kog will gain 65 MR from this once the passive is counted in, bringing his total mr to 95. He now has 48.7% damage reduction from magic damage. This will bring the damage per auto down to 107 (still not counting reflection). Kog now dies in 18 of his own autos, which will normally be about 4.5 seconds without any other damage coming onto him.
Now I am limited for time, but I believe that this should be enough that Kog will die before he kills the rammus, since the rammus will have 218 MR (68.5% reduction) with this build and defensive ball curl, even after some of it is taken by wit's end. He is taking about .6% max health per auto from w, and if kog is jungle, he is only taking about another .6% max health from that. And I don't want to calculate the current health from bork and such so I will leave you with that.
TL;DR Kog will kill himself in 12 autos with wit's end, 18 without, and I have too much time on my hands.
Embertine6 votesThe percent health damage and lifesteal allows him to bypass it unfortunately.
Honestly I hate how broken his W is. But to be perfectly honest it's not just his W, but the fact that he's abusing items that aren't even meant for ADCs.
bill847 votesOk I finished it with edits since you last saw it most likely, and I think that it will address the lifesteal thing. But lastly, Kog is not just confined to "ADC" he is an on-hit based champ, so. logically, he will buy items that apply on hit affects, and you cannot really say that he is abusing them, since he was meant to build on-hit.
Sightless662 votesOh hell yes he does. Rammus can easily eat Kog alive up until kog has 4 to 5 items. You do absolutely hilarious amounts of damage to him up ujtil the very late game.
Jamochawoke12 votesThis is one of the main reasons I picked up Tryndamere :)
Kog focusin' me? That's ok, press R and beat his face in.
It Hertz When IP4 votesHis passive will still get you though. Not an ideal trade.
SpecterVonBaren31 votesActually it's a fantastic trade. Tryndamere is notorious for being a bad teamfighter, he's the most dedicated split pushing champion in the game, trading a Tryndamere for the enemy team's biggest damage source is a fantastic trade.
Troll for Trump1 votesIt won't happen, because Kog would never one v one Trynd. They would have to split up their team, which is even better. Kog needs a team to peel for him, or he'll die. The only ways I can think of to shut down Kog are Exhaust, Grevious wounds/ignite, Rammus, and other broken champs.
CeexSett1 votesBut if Rammus taunts Kog'Maw won't he die in some 4 seconds as well? Bonus armor and MR doesnt do that much.
Other ways of shutting him down are 
, insane fast burst 
or some imediate CC like flash Tibbers.
Auz the Ripper2 votesRammus's defensive ball curl deals flat damage to whoever autoattacks him and kogmaw attacks alot with each attack dealing low damage so kogmaw will take a very large amount of damage just from attacking rammus.
What Is Smite2 votes
fixes that issue since the damage reflected is magic and if it's a jungle Kog then he doesn't need to be effective, I usually go /
/
depending on the enemy team comp
TheOvermind15 votesWhen you pick tryndamere to teamfight vs janna zac and kogmaw, you know you are boosted.
Schàdenfreude12 votes :pewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpewpew
Wiz the Great10 votesNah man instakilling all assassins in 1 second and tanks in 2-3 seconds while being like 2-10 is totally fine, they just outplayed you by superior positioning and mechanics of standing still :^)
archerno19 votesNo triforce as heca?
FortisDominus11 votesNo triforce as heca?
i did buy it i was only naming defensive items
Bladerunner77772 votesDon't build defense, build more damage to beat Kog
I personally really like building 
on Hecarim.
E + Ghost + Rigtheous Glory is really good engage and normally supports don't have enough time to react and peel.
I also play top lane Hecarim for the 
homeguard :^)
In some cases I would suggest maybe skipping Cinderhulk. I think it's kinda useless against Kog so maybe just going 
into 
would be a better idea
Throw in a 
if you're feeling confident. Armor pen is really good on Hecarim and the movement speed active would go well with Righteous Glory + E + Ghost
Troll for Trump2 votesYes, but then, without a tank, the rest of the team would die. Basically, he would turn into an assassin of a Talon type. Kill one target, and hope you can get the 2nd before you die.
420 Stylish6 votesMy biggest problem is when I get straight in his face as an assassin, Zed in this case, and he just straights annihilates me in melee range. That I'm far from OK with. If his damage were to stay I'd want him to be even squishier than he currently is.
Eedat6 voteshttp://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/2287254852/209139549?tab=overview
:^)
I was 1/7 at one point. Showed up late to a team fight after my team was dead, pressed W, right clicked, and got a 1v4 quadra-kill 40 minutes in. One of them was low, but the other 3 were all above 1/2 HP
Ended up doing the most damage on my team and ended the game God-like
Kog'Maw. Fun time, fun times.
IcyPepper5 votesgoes 0/5 in lane but carries the game because they had zac and janna who peeled and we cant even touch him.
Well, to be fair... isn't this what hypercarries are supposed to do? Do terribly during the laning phase, and shine if your team doesn't end before the 35 minute mark?
What would be worse is if Kog often went 5/0 in lane against bullies, or bullies like Graves could go 0/5 in lane and still carry like nobody's business. Or something like that.
Minor nitpick. If Koggy is OP or whatever (the AS scaling on his W was weird...), then nerf bat he needs.
Brain Errör 4041 votesIf this is what hypercarries need to do, vayne needs some buffs. Loses lane, never recovers.
IcyPepper2 votesshrugs
Doesn't Koggy have a slightly better time farming? Let me check real quick...
In their current state of power (which doesn't say much, because Koggy is thriving right now while Vayne's barely within a reasonable win rate...), Koggy gets significantly more minions killed and gold income on average. If would be better if they were near equal at the time, so I could get a better idea...
Anyway, looking at Vayne's win rate by game length, she starts at an abysmal 43% at 0-25 minutes and rises to a decent 53% at 35-40 minutes. A little on the weak side, but pretty normal for a hypercarry. She's fine. The idea is to end the game soon after stomping the hypercarry, not giving them time to recover. Vayne apparently can recover.
Looking at Koggy's win rate by game length, I'm just going to flip the table and admit his powercurve's all over the place. I don't like jumping on the "it's time to nerf X" train, but Koggy's more than likely going to need nerfs if he's starting with a 53% win rate at the very start of the game.
Brain Errör 4041 votesVery informative.
I keep forgetting most of this checks out in plat+ Elo so teams can accommodate their hypercarries, which rarely happens in low Elo. If Kog is starting at a 53% early in the game though, then I do believe he needs a bit of a nerf. Most (in my experiences anyways) games end before the 35minute mark these days as well, so if you lose lane as a hypercarry, it's a really tough comeback, though, not improbable or impossible.
Thanks for the info.
dunder kill3 votesHow does give you over 4k HP again?
Schoenberg3 votesWho is kog maw? Don't you mean W'maw?
Kayge2 votesupvoted if before I even read the context. Agreed. Fuck kog`maw
Saianna2 votesFor the love of everything that's good, pure and holy..
It isn't Kog Maws fault more than Guinsoo Rageblade!
For fks sake! This item is totally retarded and gives too much damage! Stop accusing badly reworked champion if the item is responsible for all of this shit!
Aatrox Mid 1v52 votesgoes 0/5 in lane but carries the game because they had zac and janna who peeled and we cant even touch him. kills the whole team with
lol kog is in no way un balanced right now. he has no mobility and is laughably squishy to the point where lucians or mf's ult alone can kill him. what caused you to lose that fight was the peel from his teamates, not kog himself. he was just doing an adc's job and dealing damage. one thing you can do in teamfights is bait out his w so he'll litterally just be a potato until it goes off cd
LadyRenly1 votesas hec you should be killing him in less than 3 seconds, sorry but you did something wrong.
MunchCrunchLunch8 votesas hec you should be killing him in less than 3 seconds, sorry but you did something wrong.
no. he won't be able to kill him late game. kog lifesteals too much with just botrk.
also he will just kill you before you can even land half your combo. other day. darius. only kog maw was autoing me. stunned and all. we killed him. he had a GA. came back. with half health. and he killed 4 people on my team.
looks at death report. his W max health damage did over 1k. and thats just a part of it. you can't dive kog late game. unless. your a fed assassin. and he he has peel. just ff. you can't do anything.
bill845 voteslooks at death report
Wait you think that this works?
Pika Fox1 votesHes an immobile ADC that is punished severely for even moving. What did you expect? Him to just deal 0 damage? Youre a hecarim, you can press R. Your team should have also had other divers or someone who could follow up the pressure, or someone to poke or disengage while the enemy team had their abilities up.
FortisDominus1 votes[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LmWlZtEj,comment-id=0027,timestamp=2016-09-09T13:50:32.066+0000)
Hes an immobile ADC that is punished severely for even moving. What did you expect? Him to just deal 0 damage? Youre a hecarim, you can press R. Your team should have also had other divers or someone who could follow up the pressure, or someone to poke or disengage while the enemy team had their abilities up.
I have 1 damage item and its triforce at 40 minutes, Kog at that point had bork who could lifesteal my damage and had a janna shield. What do you want the rest of my team to do? walk through the enemy team and go straight for kog while the rest of his team rips us a new one? Come on man, thats not a realistic situation.
Pika Fox1 votesThen you were outplayed at champ select and didnt pick your team around theirs, nor did you properly exert your own strengths to shut down kog, allowing him to eventually get items.
ItsOrval1 votesEnemy goes ? Choose 
to kill him
BladeSteel1 votesBig news...they're reverting kogmaw (basically) to pre-marksmen update kog!.
More from Gameplay
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes
More by FortisDominus
People being boosted on stream
Gameplay204 comments
303
votes
"No supports in dynamic queue" I wonder why...
Memes & Games315 comments
245
votes
I didnt sign up for fucking ranked 5v5's
Gameplay84 comments
134
votes
You when get an 'S+' on the losing team
Memes & Games73 comments
100
votes
Just buy a ward
Gameplay68 comments
97
votes
why do people think tanks are weak right now?
Gameplay213 comments
95
votes