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Eve still feels like a potato

Subject 5··13 votes·815 views

Still trying to play Eve but it's usually always the re-occuring problem:

I blew my load and did like 90% of the enemy carry HP, but I don't have any way to actually finish them off so they just life steal back up or I just die because I didn't have my ultimate ability to get away.

Another constantly occurring problem is that my E doesn't get me in enough range, and the enemy carry just blows me right the fuck out of the water by the time I'm actually able to get to them.

  1. Either make her Q super fucking quick with a skinny skillshot line but long range, via, double the stealth range??? How the fuck am I suppose to get charm off - walk up to them and lick their armpits like "hey don't kill me, I'm just trying to kill you."
  2. Make her E an actual gap closer. Her current E isn't a gapcloser, don't act like it.
  3. Put her ultimate ability on a 30/20/10 second cdr but make it deal 70% less damage. At least then this impossible to perform kit is actually viable, considering she has enough damage even without her ultimate.

I don't understand why Vayne gets to tumble in and do 100% of your HP with one auto attack in a stealthed ultimate when Eve has to walk up to somebody and lick their asshole before even thinking about trying to land a full combo.

21 Comments

Hupsis3 votes

Her ult is very powerful and versatile. I think the cooldown on it is justified. You can go in the middle of an enemy team, dodge their abilities and escape. If anything I'd like it to have an increased jump distance (but probably won't happen). Reduced cooldown on successful kill would be nice tho (this was on the PBE but wasn't released on live).

Her E isn't really supposed to be a gap closer. It has a component which allows her to follow her target if it flashes or uses a dash, which is fine enough. I just hope all the bugs on it got fixed (like the one where it goes on cooldown and consumes the empowered cast when interrupted mid cast).

Also a quality of life upgrade to her Q which would allow us to hold down Q to cast the spikes automatically when available would be appreciated.

Subject 53 votes

{quoted}

Her ult is very powerful and versatile. I think the cooldown on it is justified. You can go in the middle of an enemy team, dodge their abilities and escape. If anything I'd like it to have an increased jump distance (but probably won't happen). Reduced cooldown on successful kill would be nice tho (this was on the PBE but wasn't released on live).

Her E isn't really supposed to be a gap closer. It has a component which allows her to follow her target if it flashes or uses a dash, which is fine enough. I just hope all the bugs on it got fixed (like the one where it goes on cooldown and consumes the empowered cast when interrupted mid cast).

Also a quality of life upgrade to her Q which would allow us to hold down Q to cast the spikes automatically when available would be appreciated.

Actually her ultimate doesn't protect her from lock on abilities such as

Leblanc E Karma E Vladimir Q

Etc, etc, etc - even if you're untargetable, you'll still die.

Hupsis1 votes

While that is true, you could still potentially get away from the range of tether abilities.

There was an interesting ult iteration tested on PBE where successful kill with the ultimate in addition to reducing the cooldown would instantly make Evelynn go in demon shade when arriving at the new destination. I think that would be a fitting addition to the ability (even if the cooldown wasn't reduced).

Oleandervine2 votes

Evelynn is not a confrontational assassin. Your main method of attack isn't to just blast in alone straight from stealth and murder someone. You actually have to time it, be patient, and wait for your opponent to make mistakes. If you are gankng bot lane, wait for the laners to engage before you go in, an enemy ADC will freak out if you appear out of nowhere while they think they have your team on the run. Furthermore, get creative with your ganks. You don't always have to gank from the river. Once you hit 6, you can run down your lane and hide in the bushes and gank the lane from the bushes. Enemies never expect it.

Also, movement speed is your friend. People take Dark Harvest on Eve, but in reality, Predator boots are better. When you're going to gank, turn on the boots, and run for it. An enemy can't react fast enough if you move fast enough to be on top of them when they first see you. Don't try to gank fed carries either. If the Vayne you mentioned is super fed, don't go it alone. Of course you will get splattered. Evelynn is squishy, so make sure you have the upper hand before you do things.

Lastly, W is not just an engage tool. Sure, it's hardest CC is the charm, but if you cast it mid fight and proc it, it's a 65% slow, which means they can't run away that easily. This allows you to weave in more autoattacks as well as more opportunities to crack off the Spellblade of Lichbane.

Get out of this mindset that Evelynn is Rengar or Talon. Her burst isn't as high as theirs, so you need to learn how to play around it. This involves hit and run tactics. Evelynn's passive heals her when Demon Shade goes online, which means that if you trade with an enemy and they flee, you can chase them while healing back up to roll most of your combo again. Do not forget this important aspect of her playstyle.

Vekkna3 votes

actually have to time it, be patient, and wait for your opponent to make mistakes.

Isn't this just an appealing way to say that she lacks agency? I mean...virtually any champ can join a 2v2 and turn a fight, and most of them can do it better. And a lot of those don't have preconditions that restrictive.

Oleandervine1 votes

Ganking is nothing but joining a fair fight and turning the odds in your team's favor. I never said to only use her to engage after allies have, only to do so in the bot lane against carries who can kill her quickly.

Vekkna1 votes

Trying to think of a champ who can't kill or peel her faster than she can kill them.

Karthus maybe?

Subject 52 votes

{quoted}

Trying to think of a champ who can't kill or peel her faster than she can kill them.

Karthus maybe?

Varus AP Varus

Though Karthus is suppose to do early on in teamfights and he doesn't split push so that would never be an acceptable case for Eve to attack him over anybody else.

Subject 52 votes

{quoted}

Evelynn is not a confrontational assassin. Your main method of attack isn't to just blast in alone straight from stealth and murder someone. You actually have to time it, be patient, and wait for your opponent to make mistakes. If you are gankng bot lane, wait for the laners to engage before you go in, an enemy ADC will freak out if you appear out of nowhere while they think they have your team on the run. Furthermore, get creative with your ganks. You don't always have to gank from the river. Once you hit 6, you can run down your lane and hide in the bushes and gank the lane from the bushes. Enemies never expect it.

Also, movement speed is your friend. People take Dark Harvest on Eve, but in reality, Predator boots are better. When you're going to gank, turn on the boots, and run for it. An enemy can't react fast enough if you move fast enough to be on top of them when they first see you. Don't try to gank fed carries either. If the Vayne you mentioned is super fed, don't go it alone. Of course you will get splattered. Evelynn is squishy, so make sure you have the upper hand before you do things.

Lastly, W is not just an engage tool. Sure, it's hardest CC is the charm, but if you cast it mid fight and proc it, it's a 65% slow, which means they can't run away that easily. This allows you to weave in more autoattacks as well as more opportunities to crack off the Spellblade of Lichbane.

Get out of this mindset that Evelynn is Rengar or Talon. Her burst isn't as high as theirs, so you need to learn how to play around it. This involves hit and run tactics. Evelynn's passive heals her when Demon Shade goes online, which means that if you trade with an enemy and they flee, you can chase them while healing back up to roll most of your combo again. Do not forget this important aspect of her playstyle.

That playstyle doesn't work in a game where the adc blows Eve out of the water with half of a combo. Pretty much every adc is capable of smashing Eve before she 'carefully and collectively walks up to you'

On a second note, her passive healing. If you build AP on it, you're getting an even worse passive heal than if you built less AP. Why?

Subject 52 votes

{quoted}

Evelynn is not a confrontational assassin. Your main method of attack isn't to just blast in alone straight from stealth and murder someone. You actually have to time it, be patient, and wait for your opponent to make mistakes. If you are gankng bot lane, wait for the laners to engage before you go in, an enemy ADC will freak out if you appear out of nowhere while they think they have your team on the run. Furthermore, get creative with your ganks. You don't always have to gank from the river. Once you hit 6, you can run down your lane and hide in the bushes and gank the lane from the bushes. Enemies never expect it.

Also, movement speed is your friend. People take Dark Harvest on Eve, but in reality, Predator boots are better. When you're going to gank, turn on the boots, and run for it. An enemy can't react fast enough if you move fast enough to be on top of them when they first see you. Don't try to gank fed carries either. If the Vayne you mentioned is super fed, don't go it alone. Of course you will get splattered. Evelynn is squishy, so make sure you have the upper hand before you do things.

Lastly, W is not just an engage tool. Sure, it's hardest CC is the charm, but if you cast it mid fight and proc it, it's a 65% slow, which means they can't run away that easily. This allows you to weave in more autoattacks as well as more opportunities to crack off the Spellblade of Lichbane.

Get out of this mindset that Evelynn is Rengar or Talon. Her burst isn't as high as theirs, so you need to learn how to play around it. This involves hit and run tactics. Evelynn's passive heals her when Demon Shade goes online, which means that if you trade with an enemy and they flee, you can chase them while healing back up to roll most of your combo again. Do not forget this important aspect of her playstyle.

I disagree, pretty much all meta ADC's are capable of reacting quick enough even if Eve bought item 3009 item 3742

The average person can react in under a second, Eve takes longer than 1 second to walk up to you in order to do anything in her kit except for the ultimate. But guess what - the ultimate is an execution based ability, so, fuck you Eve, go lurk in a corner where all of the other champions aren't played.

LunarEdge71 votes

One doesn't get that luxury at this state of the game.. you either one-shot or get killed as her, I presume

PopcornBunni2 votes

The problems balancing Eve come from her charm and the need for reaction to assassin burst combos. Because the charm arrow indicator only shows up once the charm is already fully primed, the reaction time against her has to be gated by her stealth radius and movement speed.

Since she didn't have a typical assassin rotation in her prior form- R into E for good upfront damage, but then Q followups that added persistent damage- She didn't need such reaction time necessary. She couldn't outright burst someone down with a full combo and had to always clean up and chase with Q, giving plenty of time to react after the initial burst.

With her new kit, she's a balancing nightmare, going to be either worthless or broken as hell based on the damage numbers she has in any given patch.

Before any other change can be made, she needs her charm indicator arrow moved forward in the charm timer. If the arrow showed up after 1 second instead of after 2.5, Evelynn's opponents would always have a consistent 1.5 seconds to react to her location when she goes for her combo, no matter how fast she moves or how small her stealth radius is. Conversely, by weakening her full combo in this way, it shores up powerbudget for the rest of her kit, opening up areas for change that could make her feel better or more in line with her older self.

So, changes I'd want as a former Eve player--

Base stats Movement Speed 335 -> 345 Along with her passive change below, this is designed to give her some better early camp routing

Passive: Stealth detection radius decreases with level, becoming smaller than even her prerework radius at level 17 and 18 In the later game, Evelynn has an awful time picking targets out of an organized group. By lowering her stealth break range as the game goes on, she has more opportunity to at the least go one-for-one with a key target.

NEW!: While Stealthed, Evelynn's base movement speed is reduced by 10. Compensation for the change to her base speed

W NEW!: Evelynn gains 25/35/45/55/65% movement speed toward her W-marked target Cast Range: 1200/1300/1400/1500/1600 -> 1100/1150/1200/1250/1300 Charm arrow appearance after: 2.5s -> 1s

E Magic Damage: 30/40/50/60/70 +4% (+3% per 100 AP) of the target's max health -> 20 (+50/60/70/80/90% AD) + 4% (+3% per 100 AP) of the target's max health

Empowered E NEW: hits the target three times rapidly, applying on-hit effects and traveling with the target Magic Damage per hit: 15 (+15/25/35/45/55% AD) + 3% (+2% per 100 AP) of the target's max health Giving Evelynn her on-hit procs and synergy with gunblade back. Numbers listed might be too strong

Subject 52 votes

{quoted}

The problems balancing Eve come from her charm and the need for reaction to assassin burst combos. Because the charm arrow indicator only shows up once the charm is already fully primed, the reaction time against her has to be gated by her stealth radius and movement speed.

Since she didn't have a typical assassin rotation in her prior form- R into E for good upfront damage, but then Q followups that added persistent damage- She didn't need such reaction time necessary. She couldn't outright burst someone down with a full combo and had to always clean up and chase with Q, giving plenty of time to react after the initial burst.

With her new kit, she's a balancing nightmare, going to be either worthless or broken as hell based on the damage numbers she has in any given patch.

Before any other change can be made, she needs her charm indicator arrow moved forward in the charm timer. If the arrow showed up after 1 second instead of after 2.5, Evelynn's opponents would always have a consistent 1.5 seconds to react to her location when she goes for her combo, no matter how fast she moves or how small her stealth radius is. Conversely, by weakening her full combo in this way, it shores up powerbudget for the rest of her kit, opening up areas for change that could make her feel better or more in line with her older self.

So, changes I'd want as a former Eve player--

Base stats Movement Speed 335 -> 345 Along with her passive change below, this is designed to give her some better early camp routing

Passive: Stealth detection radius decreases with level, becoming smaller than even her prerework radius at level 17 and 18 In the later game, Evelynn has an awful time picking targets out of an organized group. By lowering her stealth break range as the game goes on, she has more opportunity to at the least go one-for-one with a key target.

NEW!: While Stealthed, Evelynn's base movement speed is reduced by 10. Compensation for the change to her base speed

W NEW!: Evelynn gains 25/35/45/55/65% movement speed toward her W-marked target Cast Range: 1200/1300/1400/1500/1600 -> 1100/1150/1200/1250/1300 Charm arrow appearance after: 2.5s -> 1s

E Magic Damage: 30/40/50/60/70 +4% (+3% per 100 AP) of the target's max health -> 20 (+50/60/70/80/90% AD) + 4% (+3% per 100 AP) of the target's max health

Empowered E NEW: hits the target three times rapidly, applying on-hit effects and traveling with the target Magic Damage per hit: 15 (+15/25/35/45/55% AD) + 3% (+2% per 100 AP) of the target's max health Giving Evelynn her on-hit procs and synergy with gunblade back. Numbers listed might be too strong

My current way of solving Eves abysmal reliability problems: item 3117 item 3742 item 3800 item 1410

She still has enough damage to get somebody low enough to remove them from the fight, but it's still a less optimal build for what Eve SHOULD be building, as a straight assassin. Because that's her job. She just needs to be able to sneak up on people and reliably get her charm off honestly - people AREN'T going to let you walk up and take a few sniffs of their deodorant.

Linna Excel2 votes

With her new kit, she's a balancing nightmare, going to be either worthless or broken as hell based on the damage numbers she has in any given patch.

IMO this is a large part of the reason her rework is a failure and she needs another one. Reworks are supposed to keep champs from being nightmares to balance.

NTrumpWeTrust2 votes

Having a stealthy ganker that 1 shots anyone but tanks is not a healthy design. Just because you're assassin doesn't mean you should be able to play without your team and 1 shot people. If theyre getting away with 10% hp then which ever lane you're ganking for needs to step it up. If your laner can't contribute 10% hp to a gank, then they're the problem, not eve.

Kai Guy1 votes

First off, please tell me you use Quick cast or Quick cast w indicators. If your not please take the time to learn how to play with this on for all champions and cut out the unnecessary extra motions required for default casting.

I want to try to get folks to start considering eve as more of a mid game carry. Shes a bit item dependent so you need to go for smart ganks early and farm camps efficiently. The advantages in her kit is that for an assassin she has pretty good damage to targets besides just squishy back liners, and can wait for the window to go in on targets with a lower risk. You can position aggressively on eve thru her camo befor using W. She is very much an opportunistic champion so I'm confused why folks seem to judge her viability exclusively on how well she can 100% to 0% enemys solo. Find a lane that's pushed or hurt then abuse them. If its gonna be a 1v1, they are full hp, and you lack the damage to kill them don't go for that fight.

Far as her W goes, Oleandervine is correct, 65% slow is good. 2 seconds of 65% slow combined with intelligent positioning make it very easy to move up and into E range on enemy champions. You can currently cast Q first then cast W as its still traveling to apply that slow with very little reaction time allowed for enemy to react.

Raije1 votes

I feel like she needs something. Either her ult needs to do scaling damage or be unaffected by shields. Hitting someone with 15% health who just popped a shield should still do the bonus damage. Or have her not be harshly punished by ulting when they have 30.1% health by making it scaling.

Also letting her item be popped by items(hextech) could make it a little easier to get her combo off. Or by letting the W last longer after it gets on the target so your timing doesn't have to be so precise. She's just a rough champ to play in any position other than ahead against a team that lacks easy to land cc or with a team with a lot of cc.

PokladnicaZla1 votes

1.The Q +charm is really easy to do if you position well before hand. 2. A RITOer already commented it's not meant to be a gap closer,but more of a melee damage ability. 3. Do you know what kind of balance issues that ulty would cause?! That's an absolute no.

The only things that could be added are either a bigger base MS or GW added to her E.

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