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ADCs Need To Adapt

Malak·Jun 12, 2018·44 votes·12,610 views

And I don't mean stop playing adc and pick up Mord bot.

I mean learning all the new matchups correctly.

ADC mains have developed a lot of great skills that has helped them rise up above others in the bot lane. However, something that most ADC mains lack is the ability to handle diversity.You're conditioned that the enemy ADC is the same as you and that only the supports determine what the lane looks like.

Throughout most of your ADC career, you have faced only enemy ADCs. It's the role that has had the least amount of weird picks even in casual play. Always ADC vs ADC. Now, you're suddenly facing a variety of opponents and that is catching you offguard. The problem is you don't know how to lane versus other classes, not that ADCs are not viable anymore.

Imagine if you're a mage that has never played versus a Zed or Yasou. You're obviously going to get stomped and then complain on forums that mages are unplayable.

Or you're a low-mobility top lane melee bruiser that has never played versus a good kite champion top before. That just feels unfair as hell.

It's time for ADCs to develop some of the skills needed to survive in other lanes.

Time to change your items, not going full damage vs some matchups, change your trading behavior, etc.

My hope is that adcs will be viable in different lanes as early game poke lane bullies that can also scale really well into the lategame. But not mandatory for both teams every game like it was before.

EDIT:

Common QQs: "Not even Korea is playing adcs!!" Yes they are, but they're spending a lot of time trying other champs bot since they're now also viable. Why would they keep playing the same champs they've played for years when it's a great time to try new things? People in NA are playing plenty of ADC too.

"ADCs don't exist" is something I've seen a lot. It's laughable. I haven't seen all the LCK games but all the ones I saw had at least 1-2 adcs in them. I remember Lucian, Ezreal and Kaisa specifically. Really goes to show how disconnected people on these forums are with reality.

108 Comments

ZephyrDrakeJun 13, 201817 votes

Not even Korea is playing ADCs anymore.. sorry but ADCs are terrible atm and no amount of "adapting" is going to remedy that

HàrrowRJun 13, 20187 votes

{quoted}

Not even Korea is playing ADCs anymore.. sorry but ADCs are terrible atm and no amount of "adapting" is going to remedy that

Last game i won a 5v4 with Vayne,my supp went afk,me and Taliyah jg could take on the entire team,and they had the same amount of kills as us,they're not dead,you just have to adapt,i buy Ninja tabi on every adc and build GA as my 4th item right after PD and IE,you basically cant lose a 1v1 against most AD champs unless they're very fed.

ZephyrDrakeJun 13, 20185 votes

{quoted}

Last game i won a 5v4 with Vayne,my supp went afk,me and Taliyah jg could take on the entire team,and they had the same amount of kills as us,they're not dead,you just have to adapt,i buy Ninja tabi on every adc and build GA as my 4th item right after PD and IE,you basically cant lose a 1v1 against most AD champs unless they're very fed.

So let me get this straight... You somehow managed to get to the late game in a 4v5 situation? Sorry but that just tells me that the enemy team was full of incompetent people that had no idea how to close the game and not a "adcs are still good just adapt" thing

HàrrowRJun 13, 20185 votes

{quoted}

So let me get this straight... You somehow managed to get to the late game in a 4v5 situation? Sorry but that just tells me that the enemy team was full of incompetent people that had no idea how to close the game and not a "adcs are still good just adapt" thing

Nah we had 5 people,but my supp went afk 30 minutes into the game,we still had like 3 teamfights without him tho and won

BestPudgeNAJun 13, 201812 votes

{quoted}

Not even Korea is playing ADCs anymore.. sorry but ADCs are terrible atm and no amount of "adapting" is going to remedy that

Meanwhile in reality EZ and Lucian have the highest pick rates in Korean solo q with 47% and 37% pick rates while maintaining over 50%

Marksman are truly awful.

ZephyrDrakeJun 13, 20185 votes

{quoted}

Meanwhile in reality EZ and Lucian have the highest pick rates in Korean solo q with 47% and 37% pick rates while maintaining over 50%

Marksman are truly awful.

Wow 2 picks out of how many? Truly this means ADCs aren't absolutely useless

3TWarriorJun 13, 20182 votes

corki and miss fortune basically function the same as Ez and lucian

then don't forget that NOTHING has defined a marksman/woman for the entirety of league's existence EXCEPT that they have high dps or BPS (as it was before) and are typically ranged

you could substitute a variety of champions for them and still function, so long as you had the range to farm for those powerful AD items and then be able to use them effectively

BestPudgeNAJun 13, 20188 votes

{quoted}

Wow 2 picks out of how many? Truly this means ADCs aren't absolutely useless

You "OMG TANKS ARE SO WEAK IN THE TOP LANE" Me "But the 2 highest play rate champs in the game are Mao and Shen top" You "Wow 2 Tanks out of how many? TANKS are useless"

This is actually what "ADC" mains believe. Imagine any other role archtype being this delusional.

charge attackJun 13, 20182 votes

Cause Ez/Lucian are not conventional ADCs? They are spellslingers.

Any ADC that has to build crit in any way is complete garbage.

Dw though, Ezreal and rageblade are also getting nerfed so there will only be 1 viable ADC.

wildfox99Jun 13, 20185 votes

Any ADC that has to build crit in any way is complete garbage.

in a meta where the game is decided at min 15 lategame champions can't impact the game...wow,that's strange...

crit ADC are fine,but the meta doesn't allow them to scale,instead of asking for buffs why don't you ask for longer games?

ZephyrDrakeJun 13, 20181 votes

{quoted}

You "OMG TANKS ARE SO WEAK IN THE TOP LANE" Me "But the 2 highest play rate champs in the game are Mao and Shen top" You "Wow 2 Tanks out of how many? TANKS are useless"

This is actually what "ADC" mains believe. Imagine any other role archtype being this delusional.

When I see anything that is not Lucian and Ez actually being useful in any way you can come and say that ADC mains are delusional. ADC haters like you would rather have the entire role be dead before aadmitting to your bias against the role. There is no point in playing crit ADCs and most of the non crit ones barely do anything and still feel like complete shit to play. But sure you can keep believing that ADCs are fine all you want

BestPudgeNAJun 14, 20182 votes

{quoted}

When I see anything that is not Lucian and Ez actually being useful in any way you can come and say that ADC mains are delusional. ADC haters like you would rather have the entire role be dead before aadmitting to your bias against the role. There is no point in playing crit ADCs and most of the non crit ones barely do anything and still feel like complete shit to play. But sure you can keep believing that ADCs are fine all you want

Kai'sa has a 60% ban rate and a 20% WR for a reason, Jhin has a 20% pick rate for a reason, Draven and MF have some of the highest WR rates of any champs for a reason. Only 2 "new bot lane carries" have pick rates above 2% and one of them Yasuo fits some people definition of an AttackDamageCarry. Markmsan are still the dominate force is botlane by a mile. You say no one "picks" ADC but Vlad has the 3rd highest pick rate of any non-marksman bot and his pick rate is below that of twitch.

Straight up it's 100% delusional too think otherwise.

MalakJun 14, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Kai'sa has a 60% ban rate and a 20% WR for a reason, Jhin has a 20% pick rate for a reason, Draven and MF have some of the highest WR rates of any champs for a reason. Only 2 "new bot lane carries" have pick rates above 2% and one of them Yasuo fits some people definition of an AttackDamageCarry. Markmsan are still the dominate force is botlane by a mile. You say no one "picks" ADC but Vlad has the 3rd highest pick rate of any non-marksman bot and his pick rate is below that of twitch.

Straight up it's 100% delusional too think otherwise.

ADC mains will cry hard unless the ADC role is 100% ADC again. Meanwhile mid has every single class coming in

SoƒiaJun 13, 20182 votes

And you know what those two have that separates them from just about all the other ADC picks?

I'll leave you to figure that out.

Although I believe after this coming patch Ez will lose his relevance.

BestPudgeNAJun 13, 20182 votes

{quoted}

And you know what those two have that separates them from just about all the other ADC picks?

I'll leave you to figure that out.

Although I believe after this coming patch Ez will lose his relevance.

There are 15 Marksman with a higher playrate then Yas bot and Yas has the playrate of any non-marksman The top 4 highest win rate bot laners are still Markman Kaisa is still just broken and has 60% ban rate Vlad Bot has a lower play rate and Win rate bot then Twitch

Those aren't the only 2 viable marksman.

rtbf223434721Jun 13, 201812 votes

Adc's lost resistances
Crit based adcs are much more dependent on a good support to farm
Tank supports got buffed with resistances
Shields got nerfed
Crit based adc's have trouble trading vs ADC lane bulies.
Crit based adc's have trouble trading vs heavy poke damage.
Crit based adc's have trouble farming and powerspike in time to be useful in the game
Assasins got buffed
Turrets got nerfed
Adc's are no longer needed to take objectives.
Snowball is out of control: The game is already decided before the crit based adc got time to collect his items and scale into lategame

There is no room for adaptation. Crit based adcs have trouble trading early and need more gold/farm/time to be useful, it's really easy to shut them down with poke. It is not worthy to buy defensive items on adc. The reason for me is the high cost that adc items have. If you are playing champions that will only be effective for your team dealing damage you should buy dps. Or just stop playing them.

The amounts of gold you need to be effective as a crit adc is huge and i think it is a waste to spend gold in anything that dont turn you more effective for your team. What's the point on having defense if you don't have relevant damage ?

I recommend you to play 15 or 20 games straight playing crit based adcs and take your conclusions.

Acheron16Jun 13, 20186 votes

Nah man, this mid main who only played a couple of Varus games (probably mid too) clearly knows best.

Adcs just need to ADAPT*!

*results may vary

HàrrowRJun 13, 20183 votes

{quoted}

Adc's lost resistances

Crit based adcs are much more dependent on a good support to farm

Tank supports got buffed with resistances

Shields got nerfed

Crit based adc's have trouble trading vs ADC lane bulies.

Crit based adc's have trouble trading vs heavy poke damage.

Crit based adc's have trouble farming and powerspike in time to be useful in the game

Assasins got buffed

Turrets got nerfed

Adc's are no longer needed to take objectives.

Snowball is out of control: The game is already decided before the crit based adc got time to collect his items and scale into lategame

There is no room for adaptation. Crit based adcs have trouble trading early and need more gold/farm/time to be useful, it's really easy to shut them down with poke. It is not worthy to buy defensive items on adc. The reason for me is the high cost that adc items have. If you are playing champions that will only be effective for your team dealing damage you should buy dps. Or just stop playing them.

The amounts of gold you need to be effective as a crit adc is huge and i think it is a waste to spend gold in anything that dont turn you more effective for your team. What's the point on having defense if you don't have relevant damage ?

I recommend you to play 15 or 20 games straight playing crit based adcs and take your conclusions.

Depends on what you mean by defensive items.

item 3047 item 3031 item 3087 item 3026 item 3139 item 3036

Will do basically the same damage as going "full damage" the difference between tabi and zerkers is negligible on most carries that aren't that dependent on their AS like Lucian Ezreal MissFortune Jhin Draven or go for on hit builds where they buy a lot of AS already so having 35% more isnt that big of a deal when youre already sitting at 2.5 like Varus KogMaw not to mention that there isn't really a lot of times where an ADC can freely attack to maximize that AS,a lot of times he has to kite/orb walk or your team already pinned an enemy down and are all attacking him,so you doing 50dps more at that point doesnt matter,he will die without you even touching him.

That leads me to my second point,contrary to very popular belief,yours included, obviously, adcs aren't the only damage dealers in your team.

Not all games end up with ADCs having the highest damage dealt,hell i do the most damage almost always when i play mages,and even if they do end up first,you usually see at least 1 or 2 players not far behind,lagging maybe 5-10k damage dealt,and not every game is won by having the highest damage dealt,sometimes making a good pick,landing a good hook,and most importantly playing around objectives will get you the victory.

Now im not saying Crit is good right now,its disgustingly expensive,and IE doesnt really give you the same benefit it used to give,im an adc main but i play mainly things like Jhin,Mf,Ez,Lucian,Varus anyways,and im not saying youre not right about Assassins being stronger,supps being weaker etc. but all im saying is change something up,most people,me included,don't realize how different it feels when you just get item 3047 item 3026 item 3139 / item 3072 you suddenly become so much less dependent on your supp,and vice versa,when youre team fighting youre so much harder to get dived when the enemy knows that theres a high chance he will die or waste his ult and he might not even pop your GA.

Just try it out,i mean if you don't believe me look at the pros,tabi ga qss are essential items for a reason in their games also

rtbf223434721Jun 13, 20182 votes

I feel that: The games are so fast paced The crit adc items cost so much The poke damage hurts so much more now And the tower is so easy to bring down

That if you play a crit adc and you fail to hold your ground in lane. You can get so behind that the game will end before you can consider buy those defensive item you spoke about.

SaiannaJun 13, 20184 votes

Cause all crit-based ADCs start with infinity edge, right? You guys got nerfed first time since like.. ever and now can't stand being just slightly weaker. yes. Slightly.

There are classes that were shat on continuous times and now you sneer at them calling them whiners.

Your endgame damage is hardly affected, but hey, lets cry a river, cause you can no longer kill a squish in 3 autos and now you need to hit them for like.. 1 or 2 more.

rtbf223434721Jun 13, 20181 votes

I dont want to burst your bubble but i can still kill a squish in 3 autos. In my opinion i just need this item 3095 item 3085 item 3006 to be a powerhouse in the game. Damage is not the problem, crit adcs still have damage (i think they have more now). I think the problem is the completely gutted early game combined with the weak towers.

For me the hardest moment now for adc's based on crit builds is the laning phase. After i have the possibility to buy and i can start trading and have a positive impact in the game. I need 1300 gold for + 1300 gold for . They nerfed ADC resistances because they wanted the early damage to stick. They nerfed shields and buffed tanks supports resistances.

Things start to become problematic when you need to recall over and over because you can't trade properly and the poke is too much; the towers are realy weak soo you will lose your tower if you recal many times. If you cant hold your ground even when u have a terrible weak early game now you will lose cs and your tower.

You will be in bot lane farming trying to catch up in gold and xp and your enemies will rotate and help other lanes gaining more advantages. The game can end and you could not reach your powerspike in time to help your team or be relevant to the game.

If you dont have confidence in your lane partner you will struggle even more if you play a crit based ADC.

In my opinion if you can pass this awful early game with good creep score and your tower intact, crit based adcs still are a powerhouse in the game and the items they buy after that initial power spike doesn't matter mutch.

SaiannaJun 14, 20182 votes

I dont want to burst your bubble but i can still kill a squish in 3 autos.

I think you'd do better trying to burst that 2 meters thick concrete bubble of "crit ADC so weak" bullshit those idiots spew.

rtbf223434721Jun 14, 20182 votes

The way i see it, right now crit ADC works like this:

Early game: Zero damage + Zero sustain + Paper Tower If they cant farm they cant reach mid game or late game. His team will probably lose. Anything that can prevent him from farming makes him useless permanently.

Ofc if a crit adc is allowed to farm and get his items then he is not weak. But no one will let a crit adc farm if they can push him out of lane over and over till he is as relevant as a minion. By the time he becomes relevant again the game is over.

SaiannaJun 14, 20181 votes

I remember times when ADC had to buy sustain items to have sustain... Ah old times...

Anyways, Imo it's wrong to rush for crit if that makes your early-mid game uncertain. I believe crit-ADC just have to find another route for their lategame potential. Change order of items bought, or way they play. Once players will get used to the change, not many will actually be crippled with the nerf.

rtbf223434721Jun 15, 20181 votes

You get pushed out of lane before u can buy any sustain items now...

Crit ADC dont rush Crit, the first item is item 1038 1300 gold.

Any route for their lategame potential needs farm, but they can be shutted down at lvl 2 without gold for item 1038 . You cant change the order of items bought if you cant even buy 1 item. Right now the best way to play is under tower geting poked and trying to get cs.

Players are getting used to the change... adc no longer have a place in the game as a viable strategy to win.

Crit Adcs will be buffed in 8.13 so ~~everything~~ will be fine.

Acheron16Jun 13, 20181 votes

Sustain rune nerfed for ranged AD Resistances lowered Item price increased Item power lowered until late game Assassins being reverted so they burst faster and harder Support shields being nerfed

"Slightly weaker"

Whatever you say dude

SaiannaJun 14, 20182 votes

Compared to all nerfs other classes received this is hardly noticeable nerf actually. Crit-based ADCs were NEVER EVER supposed to be strong in all phases of the game. And their power lategame is hardly affected.

You guys (i presume u are one of ADC mains) were living a dream, or dare I say: played totally different game than the rest of your team.

Your power you had was pure disgusting focing others to bend everything around what you do or how you play.

And this nerf compared to the outcome how people will react to those changes, I don't think you'll hardly see the change. People will adapt they need 1-2 more autos to burst someone.

OtterlyLostJun 13, 201810 votes

For me its not about "failing to adapt." Its that my champions are just not worth playing. .-. They're not worth playing anywhere. Their powerspike is literally 10900 gold and this is if you build Stormrazor, Statik Shiv, IE, and Greaves. It takes 10900 gold to be maybe half a champion. Maybe. If you just opt to go straight for crit then Shiv, RPC, IE, and Greaves will run you 10600 and you're actively wasting stats at that point; you're gaining 60% crit times 2 coming out to 120% crit. That means that you're wasting 20% crit and, in turn, wasting gold. 30% crit by itself is 1800 gold; That means that every 10% of crit is worth 600 gold, which means by going over the 100% crit cap by 20%, your build will waste 1200 gold. So not only are Crit builds far too expensive for ADC's to legitimately scale into the game with, but they're not even gold efficient builds because the way new IE works means you're wasting 1200 gold. If not for the fact that the AS/Crit Items have other, meaningful passives, it would almost be more gold efficient to build an IE, Shiv, and Zeal and just sit at 90% crit for the rest of the game. It would mean you're not burning an extra 1200 gold for stats you can't make use of.

I suppose an option could be transitioning away from Shiv/RFC for Runaan's/Phantom Dancer but you're still wasting 1200 gold in stats.

There is no "adapting" that needs to be done. There is nothing that ADC mains themselves can honestly do; their champions feel bad to play, feel bad to build, and feel bad in the game. Not only that but it feels bad to be an ADC main because, from our perspective, the community hates us, Riot doesn't clearly care, and it feels like we're being forced out completely and made obsolete.

And finally, as an ADC main, my issue with the ADC changes was never because Bruisers/Mages/Tanks/Skirmishers were bot. My issues with the ADC changes have and always will be that they made my class, the champions I personally enjoyed, useless and awful to play.

Bob the ToastrJun 13, 20188 votes

Omg the late game class doesn't get to be strong until late game? THE HORROR!

WDG DevourJun 13, 20187 votes

The problem is there is no late game because Riot wants to make games "short"....

Bob the ToastrJun 13, 20185 votes

You're correct. The ADC changes were needed, but Riot needs some other changes to slow games down so they have time to get to late game.

AtmosphereJun 13, 201810 votes

There's a difference between being strong in the late game and being irrelevant until the late game. Why would anybody pick an ADC who doesn't do major damage until 35+ minutes when you can take Vlad or Irelia bot and have the early game sustain and power to exceed in the mid game and match in the late game? It's a lose/lose situation for marksmen

wildfox99Jun 13, 20184 votes

ehm,so nerf irelia and vlad?

i mean,you are talking about 2 champions that atm are so strong but you can't compare an entire class with a single champion,or else i could say that mages are too weak early game because Lucian is a good early game pick

crit ADC still outscale other classes,there are some exceptions such as vlad and irelia but it's not only an ADC problem,try to face them as mid laner and you see it's the same,they are a lane bully that outscale you in lategame

######anyway don't expect to be relevant if you go for a full lategame build,try to change your builds and playstyle

BestPudgeNAJun 13, 20184 votes

{quoted}

There's a difference between being strong in the late game and being irrelevant until the late game. Why would anybody pick an ADC who doesn't do major damage until 35+ minutes when you can take Vlad or Irelia bot and have the early game sustain and power to exceed in the mid game and match in the late game? It's a lose/lose situation for marksmen

Vlad bot has a lower with rate then 11 of the 17 bot lane marksman.

In sub 25min games Vlad ranks 15th in WR among op.ggs current 20 bot laners. He ranks 17th of 20 in WR for games 25-30 mins

Truly Vlad is an early/mid game powerhouse and not at all a scaling champ.

KrytoricJun 13, 20183 votes

{quoted}

For me its not about "failing to adapt." Its that my champions are just not worth playing. .-. They're not worth playing anywhere. Their powerspike is literally 10900 gold and this is if you build Stormrazor, Statik Shiv, IE, and Greaves. It takes 10900 gold to be maybe half a champion. Maybe. If you just opt to go straight for crit then Shiv, RPC, IE, and Greaves will run you 10600 and you're actively wasting stats at that point; you're gaining 60% crit times 2 coming out to 120% crit. That means that you're wasting 20% crit and, in turn, wasting gold. 30% crit by itself is 1800 gold; That means that every 10% of crit is worth 600 gold, which means by going over the 100% crit cap by 20%, your build will waste 1200 gold. So not only are Crit builds far too expensive for ADC's to legitimately scale into the game with, but they're not even gold efficient builds because the way new IE works means you're wasting 1200 gold. If not for the fact that the AS/Crit Items have other, meaningful passives, it would almost be more gold efficient to build an IE, Shiv, and Zeal and just sit at 90% crit for the rest of the game. It would mean you're not burning an extra 1200 gold for stats you can't make use of.

I suppose an option could be transitioning away from Shiv/RFC for Runaan's/Phantom Dancer but you're still wasting 1200 gold in stats.

There is no "adapting" that needs to be done. There is nothing that ADC mains themselves can honestly do; their champions feel bad to play, feel bad to build, and feel bad in the game. Not only that but it feels bad to be an ADC main because, from our perspective, the community hates us, Riot doesn't clearly care, and it feels like we're being forced out completely and made obsolete.

And finally, as an ADC main, my issue with the ADC changes was never because Bruisers/Mages/Tanks/Skirmishers were bot. My issues with the ADC changes have and always will be that they made my class, the champions I personally enjoyed, useless and awful to play.

Holy shit this. Literally everything you said is spot on.

Ungrateful ThugJun 13, 201810 votes

Bot lane have essentially been in total control of whether games are won or lost for a year and a half now. I don't think it's farfetched or unfair to tell bot lane mains to dry their tears and get used to it. Because we all know Riot will eventually overbuff bot lane again.

AzadetheJun 13, 201812 votes

They aren't even weak atm. They're just so hooked on crit builds that they try to rush item 3095 even on champs who don't benefit much from rushing it.

I've put item 3071 back in my rotation because it gets the earliest game impactful crits after you start building crit, not because of crit rate, but because the reduced armor increases the power of the crits. In less than 2 items I'm up to 340 Crits with just + item 3086 If I Third item an IE, we're talking about 600-700 crits in 2 1/2 items. Even on champs that don't have augmented damage hits.

HàrrowRJun 13, 20182 votes

{quoted}

They aren't even weak atm. They're just so hooked on crit builds that they try to rush even on champs who don't benefit much from rushing it.

I've put back in my rotation because it gets the earliest game impactful crits after you start building crit, not because of crit rate, but because the reduced armor increases the power of the crits. In less than 2 items I'm up to 340 Crits with just + If I Third item an IE, we're talking about 600-700 crits in 2 1/2 items. Even on champs that don't have augmented damage hits.

You did this on Jinx! I remember you from my post about getting a defensive item back into the adc build.

Spread the word!

rtbf223434721Jun 13, 20185 votes

Phage 1250 Gold 15AD 200HP + Kindlegem 800 Gold 10%CDR 200HP The Black Cleaver 3000 Gold 40AD 20CDR 400HP

B. F. Sword 1300 Gold 40AD Stormrazor 3200 Gold 70AD 30% AS

Zeal 1300 Gold

I play Jinx regularly and i tried the item 3071 and item 3086 build on her. I did not like it. Is only 200 gold cheaper. I have the same problem in farming till i power spike and i need more time to power spike and be relevant. I dont need the CDR and the HP does not help because i dont have the damage to back him up. Supet Mega Death Rocket feels weak and i cant finish ppl with it in lane and i dont have AD to create opportunities to use it.

If my support is good and i can farm i prefer to invest in AD and AS and start trading. item 1038 + item 3086 into item 3095 + item 3085 It's what i feel works best for now.

AzadetheJun 13, 20181 votes

I'm a good R user that almost never misses, so that's part of it.

Personally I like the Phage movement speed boost, and I was running Grasp, so going BC increases my damage on hit because it's HP based.

Jinx is a routine attacker, so I don't know why you'd item 3095 . That's self defeating her Q once the crit is on cooldown.

rtbf223434721Jun 13, 20181 votes

The problem i had with R was not the difficulty of landing it, its the lack of damage to execute someone. With 1300 gold invested i can buy item 1038 with 40AD do decent damage with my R in laning fase and start trading. If i go with the item 3071 build with 1300 gold invested i have item 3044 15AD, even if i land R it usualy does not result in a kill. I dont find the need to have the movement speed of when im using Fleet Footwork. In general i feel that im still squishy even with the 400 HP and after i spend 3000 gold i dont have the damage to be usefull for my team with just 40AD. I feel it is not a worth the investment.

Normally i rush item 1038 + item 3086 , if i can buy those 2 items with a good creep score and my tower intact i can start trading and try to win vs most match ups. My problem is that im very vulnerable and i can't do good trades before i get at least 1 of my rush items + i need a capable support that helps me in the process of farming and protect tower.

I buy item 3095 because i can powerspyke a little early in the game with a better build path.

I can buy item 3095 3200 gold + item 3086 1300 gold 15%AS 15%Crit + 70AD 30%AS insted of item 3031 3700 gold + 1300 gold 15%AS 15%Crit + 80AD and a Late game passive.

The item 3095 passive help me poke with rockets and gives movement speed for repositioning. After that i usualy finish the zeal item am buy more damage ( item 3072 or item 3031 ).

My build usualy looks like this item 3095 item 3085 item 3006 item 3031 item 3087 item 3072 . Note: Stormrazor synergizes well with Statikk Shiv as the empowered attack counts as a Critical strike, increasing Statikk Shiv's damage... when you enter in a fight you ENTER IN A FIGHT xD

AzadetheJun 14, 20181 votes

If you're talking about damage up to an R you're using it in a duel. I'm shooting from across the map and hitting recall nubs. I have about a 90% hit rate on low HP recallers. Point Blank her ult does less damage.

I tank more damage than most adcs do, and don't die. My last game I did this by the time I was 8/0/6 I had tanked some 12,300 damage and mitigated some 5600. My teammates maxed out at 9-11k damage taken and 2-4500 mitigated. And they had deaths.

I also had healed some 2600 damage in 15 minutes just through Grasp.

rtbf223434721Jun 14, 20181 votes

Unfortunately i don't get the chance to shoot Supet Mega Death Rocket across the map and hit "recall nubs" many times. Ppl now hide in fog of war and stuff xD It is not worthy to shoot it blindly, i might need it to finish someone and not have it. I can only use it as a finisher or to help in team fights.

The way im playing i dont need to tank damage, if i can reach mid game even with cs and my tower intact i can manage being glass cannon. The problem is now i fell its much more difficult to reach mid game without being pushed out of lane many times and get so behind that the game ends before i can recover.

AzadetheJun 14, 20181 votes

I kill them in the fog of war. A good Jinx knows exactly where they are going to recall, even if they aren't visible.

rtbf223434721Jun 14, 20181 votes

I don't like the risk of missing Super Mega Death Rocket it is too valuable. Using it to hit someone in the fog of war it is not worthy. For me It's more profitable to use it as an execute in targets that flash or run at low life.

Capitalising on recalling enemies it's too unreliable and i don't consider it as a viable option to use it if i dont have 100% certainty it will hit. I use R on recalling champions if i have vision and i know they will not move. That way it is not a blindly used ult.

Acheron16Jun 13, 20182 votes

Might as well build Lord Dominics Regards, it gives much more penetration than Black Cleaver.

Acheron16Jun 13, 20183 votes

I think you are confusing "control" with "influence".

Botlane had for a long time the biggest influence whether games were win or lost, but also the least control.

Supports are the one with most control, adcs just deal damage if allowed to build towards such and if unimpeded in fights. Every other lane ganked (and still pretty much) ganks bot, not to put their own botlane ahead, but to put the enemy's botlane behind, since that's 2/5ths of the enemy team.

Adcs, per se, have had the least agency in the game for a good while. They are little more than damage balls, that the team protects and directs to where they are most useful.

TewljrJun 13, 20183 votes

What do you mean Brand and Irelia are great adcs

KlydeFrogJun 12, 20181 votes

Lol umm no you as the adc should shyt on yas and zed well zed more then yas but you ger the point early game.

MalakJun 12, 20189 votes

{quoted}

Lol umm no you as the adc should shyt on yas and zed well zed more then yas but you ger the point early game.

you didn't read..zed and yas have nothing to do with adcs, in my post

but yea I agree.You really shouldn't lose early vs zed as adc

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