Can we get Shaco Stealth to be fair like all other stealth

5050BS·Oct 2, 2018·6 votes·3,154 views

No warning at all that he is around. the "Poof" is BS as it can happen over walls and in bushes all other stealth gives a clue, his should too

11 Comments

SwiftKitten88Oct 2, 20182 votes

i'll agree when u explain to me how "all other stealth" is fair.

the only "fair" stealth is Rengar because its on an ultimate and it gives u a warning

and Evelynn becuase he always marks u first, again.. giving u a warning..

Akali i dont even need to explain Twitch used to be fine at 4 seconds at lvl 1 which u could play around... to 10 second at lvl 1. which literally means u can half a quarter of the map warded and still not see him coming Shaco again like u said.. isnt remotely fair...

with the only thing even being POSSIBLY redeeming is you can see his smoke in fog of war.

DuskDaUmbreonOct 2, 20184 votes

Akali gives you an even bigger warning with her stealth, though.

Not only do you see its nearby by seeing the smoke, you see the general area to stay the fuck out of.

SwiftKitten88Oct 2, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Akali gives you an even bigger warning with her stealth, though.

Not only do you see its nearby by seeing the smoke, you see the general area to stay the fuck out of.

true, i dont have as much of an issue with Akali 's as i do with some forms stealth. but a lot of people are unhappy with it so i thought i would add it to the list because of the untargetability, and how even if u hit her in it you wont show a shimmer.

i do think riot did an AMAZING job at implementing a game breaking mechanic in the LEAST game breaking way possible. but i still don't think it was a good idea to implement in the first place., and thats more what i was getting at.

there was really no "need" to upgrade her stealth... they could just have easily made it work the same way with the cloud in normal stealth. that's more of the issue. the fact that true sight still reveals her, but just wont make her target-able is the only thing that salvaged that decision riot made.. can u imagine if true sight DIDN'T reveal her?

it would literally drop stuff like Caitlyn ulti, make her unpouncable (i already cant use takedown as that required a target for the auto) but i can at least close the gap)

i think riot implemented her new form of stealth AMAZINGLY well, i just don't think they should have implemented it in the first place.

EvenOct 2, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Akali gives you an even bigger warning with her stealth, though.

Not only do you see its nearby by seeing the smoke, you see the general area to stay the fuck out of.

If only teammates understood NOT to try and walk in and use all their skillshots/aoe at nothing

5050BSOct 2, 20181 votes

You are right Twitch also needs a indicator.

boricCentaur1Oct 2, 20181 votes

The only time stealth can work is when its in short and even then its bs I say just remove all stealth from game and shaco is a good example of how stealth is bs and makes games less fun.

ASCORBICAZID500Oct 2, 20181 votes

You can see smoke whenever he turns invisible.

ttv PennywiseOct 2, 20181 votes

as a D3 shaco main i so want rito to add a demonic clown laugh that enemies hear if you q in a certain distance of them, scaling the distance down with leveling his Q

SHANK LUX MAINSOct 2, 20181 votes

Can we get shaco damage buffs so he can actually compete with meta junglers? Also shaco stealth has super low range until level 5 at the earliest and there is a red cloud when he uses q

SnugglesnacksOct 2, 20181 votes

Though the moba sort of bothers me, doesn't HoTS have a decent stealth mechanic, where they're transparent figures would periodically 'flash' in sight (I know a few do in LoL, but I mean in a more common way not including smoke rings or exclamation points)? Or maybe it's some other moba, but in any case it seemed like a decent balance, where the stealth mechanic was fairly useful in unpredictability without being a completely unfair advantage that couldn't be dealt with. I just don't know how something like that would be implemented incorporating how wards work/don't work in LoL.

DemainaNyxOct 2, 20181 votes

The only fair stealth in my opinion is Pyke . It tells you he's around with the sharks on the ground, he doesn't get random ass bonus damage for using it, and he is only camouflaged so he can't really use it as an escape if he's in the middle of the enemy team.

Evelynn Khazix Leblanc Pyke Akali Rengar Shaco Teemo Twitch Vayne Kaisa Talon MonkeyKing

All of these champions have some form of stealth that I can think of.

Leblanc in her passive. But it's like 1 second, so we can sorta ignore her since she needs to be low HP to proc it, so it isn't really in her control to use it.

Evelynn has it after 6. It boosts her E damage and lets her position to get her W proc. Yeah, if she W's you that means she's in the area, so that helps, and it also points her out once it fills. However, most good Eve's will throw the Q right before the W fills so it lands the instant it's full, thus basically negating the point of arrow pointing her out cause you're dead already.

Khazix in his ult. It procs his passive, which is bonus damage and a 2 second slow. It's also invisibility, meaning he can use it in the middle of a teamfight to reproc his passive with the only counterplay being true sight. It's an ult, so it needs to be strong, but I still dislike being able to be invisible in the middle of the entire enemy team on command with no counterplay outside of "you better have true sight on me". However, he still procs his passive by pressing R even if he is spotted by true sight, so while you can counter his stealth, you can't counter the extra damage he gets from using it.

Akali in her W. No damage buff, but it restores her energy, which is her only limiting factor for her damage. She is revealed by true sight, but not targetable, which is rather absurd in my opinion since it's the only stealth that prevents towers from hitting her champion.

Rengar in his ult. Gives him random bonus damage on his next auto and shreds armor on the target he dives on. It's an ult so I can sorta understand it, though I wish there was a way to avoid the damage.

Shaco in his Q. Puff of smoke is the only indicator he's around and gives him bonus damage on his first auto out of stealth. Again, bonus damage on an auto seems unfair again since it's essentially undodgeable (rare cases you can dodge it though). Not to mention invisibility on a basic ability. It's so strong that he's one of the few champions in the game that doesn't take flash because it and his ult are enough safety for him.

Teemo in his passive. Essentially stationary stealth, limited to one position or a bush area depending. Not as oppressive as some stealth but still gives him bonus attack speed which is extra damage essentially. Unless you see him stealth, you'll never know he's there though unless you have oracles though.

Twitch in his Q. 10 seconds of stealth at level 1. So long he can even fully channel recall in stealth. No indicator that he is around when he uses it. Also gets bonus attack speed when he comes out of stealth (bonus damage essentially) and his Q's cooldown is reset if someone dies with his poison on them. I think that's the only stealth that resets period (vayne and kaisa kinda, but don't fully reset).

Vayne in her ult when she tumbles. 1 second of stealth max per tumble. Bonus damage from Q on next auto. The invis itself doesn't give bonus damage exactly, but the ability that procs her invis gives her the damage, so I'm counting it. Her ult also gives her bonus AD so since her ult is the reason she gets invis on Q anyway, you could say it is what gives her the bonus damage. It is an ult though so it needs to be strong. Her ult duration can also be extended on kill or assist, which extended the duration of potential invis.

Kaisa in her evolved E. 0.5 seconds of stealth. Also gives her bonus attack speed for 4 seconds after using it, which is essentially bonus damage. The only benefit of this is she doesn't get it until later in the game because she needs to have enough attack speed to evolve it, unlike other stealths that come off a basic abilites or level 6, she might not get hers until level 11 or something depending on how well she is doing. It does lower her E's cooldown on each auto though so it sorta resets if she's actually autoing like she should be.

Talon in his ult. One of the only stealths that doesn't get bonus damage when coming out of stealth, though the blades will converge on the target he autos out of stealth or Qs. Invisibility so it can be used to escape if caught out, which I personally dislike. Because of this, he can literally run through the entire enemy team and get a melee range Q on whoever he wants. Granted, that may be the only reason he's even somewhat viable in a teamfight situation. And, again, it's an ult so it should be strong.

MonkeyKing in his W. Again an invisibility on a basic ability. I dislike on demand invisibility, even more so on a basic ability though. No bonus damage from using it though, but because of his clone he can use it to tank stuff like Caitlyn ult or other abilities that can be intercepted. The only other person who could possibly use their stealth to save a teammate is Leblanc which is highly situational, so it seems rather strong for a diver champion to have on command.

That's just my opinion though. I agree that Shaco's is bullshit especially after they buffed his damage out of stealth, but my biggest issue with most of these is just the rune changes. Without the new runes, these champions wouldn't be as strong as they are. Getting 1 shot out of stealth thanks to Dark Harvest, Duskblade, Stormrazor, and 1 auto is just bullshit. This applies to other champions too (Graves for example) but stealth champions get to abuse it more from what I've seen because they can more easily get in range for the 1 auto.