Blaze (Passive) DoT Damage lowered from [4% Max HP over 4s] to [2.5% Max HP over 4s] Detonation Damage increased from [+1.5% Max HP per 100 AP] to [+2.5% Max HP per 100 AP]
So on live if I have 500 AP I do 4% + 7.5% Max HPs (total 11.5% max hps)
On PBE with 500 AP I do 2.5 + 12.5% Max HPs (total 15% max hps)
The more AP I get the more I do compared to live.
ModThe Djinn6 votesIt's less of a nerf and more of a power adjustment towards skilled play and combo play. If you can land 3 spells, it's a buff past a certain AP value. If you can't, it's a nerf. His in-lane harass, for example, has been nerfed, as he has to commit more spell cooldowns and mana towards getting that bonus. So it's honestly a nice change if you're trying to nerf his poke and harass without nerfing his identity as an in-combat combo mage.
Critmaster Garen7 votes[{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KqwEpUYW,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-01-10T21:40:01.534+0000)
It's less of a nerf and more of a power adjustment towards skilled play and combo play. If you can land 3 spells, it's a buff past a certain AP value. If you can't, it's a nerf. His in-lane harass, for example, has been nerfed, as he has to commit more spell cooldowns and mana towards getting that bonus. So it's honestly a nice change if you're trying to nerf his poke and harass without nerfing his identity as an in-combat combo mage.
how does this compare with 
in his inventory though?
is there really much of a difference on the burn damage?
1.5% or 2.5% max health damage per second over 7 seconds (the last tick of brands 4 second dot activates liandries for 3 more seconds) is 10.5% or 17.5% max health damage.
so a single burn from brand barely lost any damage, but his 3 spell combo got buffed.
seems like an overall buff to me as soon as he has the item.
ModThe Djinn1 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KqwEpUYW,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-01-10T22:44:46.465+0000)how does this compare with
is there really much of a difference on the burn damage?
The difference in burn damage will be 1.5% of the target's maximum health, no matter what items you have. The percentage difference this makes depends heavily on your target and your itemization.
Critmaster Garen4 votes[{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KqwEpUYW,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-01-10T22:48:05.564+0000)
The difference in burn damage will be 1.5% of the target's maximum health, no matter what items you have. The percentage difference this makes depends heavily on your target and your itemization.
my point is the burn damage from brands passive itself isnt very high to begin with.
its currently 4% max health damage over 4 seconds.
what makes brands passive so strong is its interaction with that increases the damage by 10.5% or 17.5% (with a slow) max health damage over 7 seconds.
so a single application of his passive with liandries before and after this change is a total of 14.5% or 21.5% max health damage reduced to 13% or 20% max health damage.
as you can see, this is barely a difference since liandries makes the majority of the damage. the buff to his 3 stack proc is very strong on the other hand.
ModThe Djinn2 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KqwEpUYW,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2019-01-10T22:52:31.410+0000)what makes brands passive so strong is its interaction with
so a single application of his passive with liandries before and after this change is 14.5% or 21.5% max health damage reduced to 13% or 20% max health damage.
this is barely a difference.
I mean, it's 1.5% max health. Against a 1000k health target that's a 15 damage nerf. Against a 3k health tank that's a 45 damage nerf. I would not call that "barely a difference" by League patch adjustments (it's not huge, certainly, but it's also not the -5 damage we sometimes see), although I understand the argument that, compared to the total output, it is small. I don't think the intent was to severely nerf his total output though, but rather to cut down slightly on his in-lane poke, especially in the early game, which this objectively does, even if not by as much as you personally feel appropriate.
Critmaster Garen2 votes[{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KqwEpUYW,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-01-10T22:55:52.910+0000)
I mean, it's 1.5% max health. Against a 1000k health target that's a 15 damage nerf. Against a 3k health tank that's a 45 damage nerf. I would not call that "barely a difference" by League patch adjustments (it's not huge, certainly, but it's also not the -5 damage we sometimes see), although I understand the argument that, compared to the total output, it is small. I don't think the intent was to severely nerf his total output though, but rather to cut down slightly on his in-lane poke, especially in the early game, which this objectively does, even if not by as much as you personally feel appropriate.
it might make a difference, since he has a harder time to bully someone out just with single spells alone.
but i really think its liandries that needs to be nerfed again, or get some sort of rework to its passive.
they could actually look at brand himself for a rework in this case.
instead of making it damage over time effect, they could make it flat 10% max health damage with a 10 second cooldown, whenever you hit an enemy with 3 separate abilities within 2 seconds or something like that.
this would make it a bit more agnostic towards the type of mage who can use the item in general, while giving it more counterplay. if you dont get hit by 3 spells of your opponent, you dont have to eat the damage.
right now, brand can really burn up to 20% of your health with it just by pressing e. and thats not going to change by shaving 1.5% off his passive.
ModThe Djinn1 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KqwEpUYW,comment-id=000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-01-10T23:05:45.001+0000)it might make a difference, since he has a harder time to bully someone out just with single spells alone.
And that seems to be the precise intent of the change, so I stand by my analysis above. :)
but i really think its liandries that needs to be nerfed again, or get some sort of rework to its passive.
That's a different issue, and one I'll admit I would need to take a look at more before commenting on. I don't have a deep enough knowledge of the data I would like to have prior to approaching that topic.
D357R0Y3R4 votesSince when do you get 500 ap at lvl 1?
Yea NO, this is a nerf because for most part of the game Brand will have less damage
ThreshHub3 votesSo more patch notes are on the pbe. And also, I think they are trying to make it so brand can't work with the support salary since he now needs to scale. They are thankfully trying to push him back to mid.
Greymoore1 votesI imagine that they are shifting his power from laning phase to team fights. These changes lower his poke damage while buffing his aoe damage. I just wish they nerfed support brand in ways that would not affect mid brand since mid brand doesn't need more damage.
Fear the Kayn1 votesYou obviously don't quite understand why Brand is considered OP in the support role. It's because he doesn't need AP to deal a lot of damage, especially early. These changes make him more of a later game champion, which I think it what a lot of people want.
Tahminatrix 2 votes[{quoted}](name=Fear the Kayn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KqwEpUYW,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-01-10T23:22:20.940+0000)
You obviously don't quite understand why Brand is considered OP in the support role. It's because he doesn't need AP to deal a lot of damage, especially early. These changes make him more of a later game champion, which I think it what a lot of people want.
These changes don't target where he gets most of his base damage from.
Bob the Toastr1 votesIt's a buff to midlane brand (who typically has more ap) and a slight early nerf to support brand (who typically has less ap)
This is good
Modl Ryden l1 votesIf Brand misses his 3-skill rotation, he'll sweat a bead of sweat and realize he didn't kill anyone. Then that bead of sweat evaporates. And then he dies.
Daddy Ants1 votesThey are trying to hit Support Brand more than Mid Lane Brand.
Sire Hippington1 votesWhat you fail to see are three things:
He needs to land a full combo to get any value from the buff, where as the nerf hits any damage he does. Most of the time, brand will hit you with a single W for harras, aplying his dot which will be cut nearly in half. Also, you usually reaply the dot alot, so it's up for more than the 4 sec of a single application, while you rarly get more than one proc of the explosion per combat.
The passive stacks up to 3 times, so on a full combo the dot alone does 12% over 4 sec, which gets nerfed to 7.5% This changes your math to 12%+7.5%=19.5% on live vs 7.5%+12.5% = 20% on PBE, so even the full combo does hardly more damage with 500 ap
Brand typically doesn't get much AP, but prefers pen and procs, reaching 500AP happens maybe at 5-6 items if at all. Also, he's played alot more often as support and also performing better as support, which also means usually less gold and so less AP.
So all in all, it's a quite noticeable nerf to his early and remains a nerf even later in the game untill you reach fullbild...
