Can we finally deal with Thunderlord's

Jefftiffy··2 votes·656 views

Instead of nerfing everyone and their mother that abuses it. I mean seriously if everyone is using it, it is a problem. It reminds me very much of summoner 4. It is starting to root itself in the game and being made almost essential unless the champ synergizes better with another mastery similar to how Udyr often replaces summoner 4 with summoner 6, but can do pretty well with either. Thunderlord's is way too good right now. It is essentially the flash of the keystones. Why take the other ones unless you can guarantee that it is better for your champ in your specific match up. Seriously, I main Gnar and I take that over any other keystone because it quite literally is that good. Why take anything else if you can take Thunderlord's and snowball.

I understand there is supposed to be a choice in masteries, but right now it's basically: "Does my niche benefit any more from anything other than Thunderlord's?" instead of "Which Keystone is best for my champ?". I understand Riot is trying to buff up the other keystones, but that just creates more problems. Keystones are supposed to be influential, but they aren't supposed to outweigh items. Right now if you don't take the right Keystone for your champ, you are almost always screwed. Keystones are supposed to influential, but not to the point where it breaks the entire game down because the keystones are forcing games to be decided (as in the point where there is a extremely low chance of coming back) 10-15 minutes earlier on average. Games are being decided before the 20 minute mark which IMO is a bad thing. It's the reason Kog rework got overboard because games were ending way too fast, so Riot decided to give him an early game and look what it did. It created a monster in 1 patch. A single patch made someone go from "eh" to "Fuck Kog, perma banned."

There are people in Diamond+ who just don't want to play this game anymore just because it's literally a pick fest. Whoever picks more top tier champs wins in more than 50% of games (unless top tiers are picked that have anti-synergy with eachother like Janna and Ekko ). And this all sprouts from Keystones being brought up to Thunderlord's strength instead of just nerfing/reworking the damn problem which was Thunderlord's itself.

9 Comments

Little Stick Man2 votes

like flash, thunderlords is a perfect generic addition to every champions kit. the only real problem with it is it's too useful in every situation

Jefftiffy1 votes

{quoted}

like flash, thunderlords is a perfect generic addition to every champions kit. the only real problem with it is it's too useful in every situation

That's always been my problem. It is just too good so everyone takes it unless they synergize better with something else. So Riot's idea is to bring everything else up to it instead of bring it down to everything else, which is bad game design because everything else was already stronger than what we used to have. It artifically shortened games without changing the core game, but also forcing the meta to be more snowball heavy because of the extra utility combined with loss of wards that were used to help stall out snowballing games.

Fervor should be the go to on most ADCs, but instead Thunderlord's drowns it out because of the flexibility.

Little Stick Man1 votes

I agree, honestly it'd be best to just change it like they changed warlords. I think it'd be better if it dealt way less damage but slowed the target. just something other than an ability used to chunk an extra 200 health off of the enemy

KLee10071 votes

How about dealing X% less damage for champion after Thunderlord's been used? Been lingering in my 'ways to tackle Thunderlord' for a while now but havent been able to get feedback.

KLee10071 votes

I agree that Fervor, and personally as well as Bloodlust, should be the masteries that ADCs mostly take... And some changes for Deathfire touch as well... It hasn't seen the light for months now...

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Meh if they buff the ratios on DFT and lower level 18 CD for TLD to 20 seconds we'll have more diversity.

Jefftiffy1 votes

{quoted}

Meh if they buff the ratios on DFT and lower level 18 CD for TLD to 20 seconds we'll have more diversity.

The thing is why does Thunderlord's do better than DFT until post like level 11. At that point the game is usually decided. Thunderlord's just has the innate scaling and item scaling while DFT uses items only and gets reduced effects for AoEs while thunderlords is also an AoE.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Nah even past lvl 11 TLD outperforms DFT.

DFT after it's buff was comparable to TLD who had a 20 second CD but now since TLD is lower than 20 seconds at later parts in the game TLD will always be better on everyone except jhin/veigar/brand(And other DoT/AoE attackers on multiple targets for longer than 8 seconds and try to stay engaged like karthus/swain, not malz/anivia since they don't want to keep their AoE out or malz's DoT which only hits 1 target) (better off going other masteries on several champs I'm just saying for DFT vs TLD)

When TLD was a 20 second CD it meant you'd have to have either 600 ad or 1200 ap in order to outperform it with single target skills or 2 AoEs, 300 ad or 600 ap with 2 single target or 4 AoE skills in a 20 second window which wasn't hard at all thus easy to choose DFT on a lot more champs but now that late game TLD's CD is lower than 20 seconds champs don't have the privilege/window of opportunity to land skills leniently. Basically in order to get the damage you need to get 16 seconds of damage stacking but now it's unrealistic that anyone would choose it over TLD except who I mentioned before.

TL;DR- Only nerf TLD should have is raise it's lvl 18 CD to 20 again, and either level 1 CD is 30 or 25 seconds, either that or 20 seconds at all levels again. TLD should never be under a 20 second CD as far as I'm concerned unless they want only jhin to take DFT. (As a user I wouldn't even mind if it was nerfed to 25 seconds at all levels, just dont want it under 20 seconds)

Jefftiffy1 votes

The thing is I am talking ratios. Around level 11 you start to outscale thunderlord's with items. Without items Thunderlords always wins. Not to mention you have to get at least 4 AP per level to do damage with it. Because HP regen will overcome DFT.

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