@Why Ashe is punished for "attacking , cs-ing etc" - Her passive should be changed.Maby StatikkShiv?

XuWarrior·Mar 17, 2015·35 votes·14,540 views

While out of combat, Ashe gains stacks of Focus. When Ashe has 100 stacks of Focus her next basic attack will critically strike.

Ashe is the only Makrsman where her passive sux .

Why Her passive can't work like StatikkShiv ? She gains Crit after XXXX shots.

Or just Give her Thematic pasive. Not sure what it could be .

Maby Ashe Gains ex 10%-20-30%(number/dmg for tests) more DMG while target is slowed/Frosted etc.

Let's discuss about her "new possible pasive" ?

68 Comments

Cornerstone1Mar 17, 201512 votes

Riot seems to refuse doing anything about Ashe and her passive. Good luck.

RiotRiotRepertoirMar 18, 201545 votes

Not true in this case. Ashe has a new passive and a few other changes that should hit Live servers some time in the second half of the season if things keep moving forward as planned. We should have details to discuss in two months or so, I imagine.

darkdillMar 18, 20153 votes

[deleted]

CeonnMar 18, 20157 votes

Could have something to do with how they finally piped up and you had the gall to complain about the exact thing you wanted them to do in the first place. :P Why would you wanna talk about it if mentioning you're working on it leads to people whining about how they "Shoulda done it sooner" vs. them telling you later when it hits PBE and everything's finalized where you'll say "Why didn't you tell us before?!11!111!!!!" If you're gonna complain either way, may as well talk about it when you're almost done so nothing's in the dark. :P

ModAcademy KaynMar 18, 20152 votes

Ha, I remember this "Yousosmart" guy. He made all these posts talking about Ashe. Me and him had quite the conversation. What was he talking about?

Rinky DinkyMar 18, 20151 votes

He seems to be within the ranks of Chumbler and Rap....

StephenizgodMar 18, 20157 votes

Lol you probably should have just kept this to yourself. Instead of being excited that there is a buff coming to our favorite Frost Archer they are instead now complaining you have not told them sooner... Yay the Boards!

DisasterSolaMar 18, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Not true in this case. Ashe has a new passive and a few other changes that should hit Live servers some time in the second half of the season if things keep moving forward as planned. We should have details to discuss in two months or so, I imagine.

Can you confirm something? Will ashe be keeping her Q slow?

Ima be honest... her Q slow is like the best thing in her kit, seeing it go would make me sad.

Ace Access Mar 31, 20151 votes

if she loses her slows then she loses a lot of appeal

its useful for teammates when they need to chase down your target

Jeddy017Mar 18, 20151 votes

Other changes?I know you probably won't say a lot or give too much details.But if you can say anything about these changes,like what's you're looking at to change or what you guys are trying to with Ashe,may you say something?

I'm not asking for an elaborate blue print of said changes.Just some a small hint or tease.

Ace Access Apr 1, 20151 votes

we're gonna need those elaborate blueprints just so we'd know if those changes are bad or not, you know so we can say its a very bad idea and campaign against them

Ashe "my slows are my teams free gap closer"

CuixMar 18, 20155 votes

About gosh darn time. Glad to hear it; thanks for the heads up! I hope the "to discuss" part means allowing meaningful dialogue with her fans and players.

aperson1Mar 18, 20151 votes

If you're allowed to talk about it, is the permaslow going to stay?

ProfDrDeathMar 18, 20152 votes

But, I guess these changes won't all be buffs, will they? Especially if her passive becomes more reliable...she already sports good results for the people that play her, so I guess she's in a decent spot aside from the passive.

Might you possibly have a long look at her base stats while you're at it? Except for her AS and AS/level, those are among the lost among all the ADCs.

NagirahMar 18, 20151 votes

Omg I can't wait. Still 2 months is a long time though...

mi ramfanMar 18, 20152 votes

yay

GraidonMar 18, 20151 votes

You tease me Repertoir. You with your vast depths of unknowable knowledge.

Duke AnaxMar 18, 20151 votes

Why do you guys always have such a big problem talking about stuff?

Personally I think talking is the only way to get things done and done right.

Enraged PigletMar 31, 20151 votes

they don't because if they are thinking on implementing in and trying it out. Then they find balance wise or for some reason it's bad and scrap it someone somewhere will repost there comments and make a QQ thread that has no insight on what riot has found and when Riot tries to tell people when those threads pop up the QQ'ers ignore it and continue down an endless path of accusations that never abates. I would say there's a good chance riot has been making idea's and testing them some for a while now and found something that most likely will work.

Xela SyabMar 18, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Not true in this case. Ashe has a new passive and a few other changes that should hit Live servers some time in the second half of the season if things keep moving forward as planned. We should have details to discuss in two months or so, I imagine.

why do we have to wait till june till ashe gets a new passive?

MandaariMar 19, 20151 votes

Holy bleeping bleep, finally!

Is there anything right now that you can discuss? I know you won't talk about solutions, but what does Riot recognize as problems? Even if it's just vague like, "we think the play pattern that her passive encourages is bad."

Edit: Also, if you're thinking about anything significant can you please have a thorough discussion with the community first? Ashe has some extremely iconic stuff in her kit that would be infuriating to lose.

EyrgosMar 19, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Not true in this case. Ashe has a new passive and a few other changes that should hit Live servers some time in the second half of the season if things keep moving forward as planned. We should have details to discuss in two months or so, I imagine.

I hope it's that her & Talon trade passives...

Ace Access Mar 31, 20154 votes

so do the rest of us

I like Ashe and I want to main her but her passive always frustrates me, I have to blow it on creeps when I need to cs

VenowolfApr 27, 20151 votes

two months? When a little sneak peek? a month and a half has been passed from this post so, in maybe 2 weeks we have more info?

SIaytonMar 17, 20155 votes

IMO they could just change it to only apply to champions so you don't waste it last hitting, and it'd be a lot better.

RexZorMar 17, 20154 votes

lol ashe will not be changed till 2999. These threads are pointless at this point.

DragoonRuinMar 17, 20154 votes

You forgot Miss Fortune, her passive is GREAT, until random caster minion decides to sneeze in her general direction, then she becomes slow as a Fracking Snail for 30 seconds. Its also broken by any sort of Aura, of random enemy player even looking at you on the mini Map.

HailFire DragonMar 17, 20154 votes

just make the passive not affect minions and your golden.

ashe passive is fine cause with like a psuedo yasuo passive that could give her 100% crit with like 50% crit chance just by waiting a few seconds each aa. maybe if they make it so that critting with her frost shot passive increases the slow? oe her volley can crit as well. but wiith how good ashe can be especialy with a pick comp and her amazing kiting ability

Enraged PigletMar 31, 20151 votes

if anything I think ashes passive would be better if it was just bonus 20% crit damage and scaled up to 50% at lvl 18, Or was an attack that would stack up and could be used on minions but would also stack up faster when you AA and then it would have plus 30 damage and a crit or something. I think the first one would be easy to balance but the second would be pretty hard.

I think the first option would be intresting because getting IE with it would be a little redundant so ashes might actually build something like SS into BT. But Riot absolutely can't make her passive not proc on minions becasuse a free crit on a champion in trades is to strong. I guarentee that almost any champion that can guarentee a crit early on while having long range would be really strong. They ahve it proc on minons so ashe can't zone all day.

ForPortalMar 17, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Why Her passive can't work like StatikkShiv ? She gains Crit after XXXX shots.

Because that's already Caitlyn's passive.

As I said in the last thread, all you need to do is make her gain focus faster. For example:

Focus If Ashe has not attacked in the last 2 seconds, she gains 5 / 10 / 15 / 20 / 25 Focus stacks per second. At 100 stacks, Ashe will critically strike on her next basic attack. Thereafter, Focus stacks will reset to an amount equal to her critical strike chance.

Do this and her DPS is still lower while holding her fire to gain Focus stacks (it takes 6 seconds to gain 100% crit chance, but if she just autoattacks normally she can do a lot more than two shots in that time), but it will still be charging fast enough to make a difference. The idea would be to reward holding your fire for last hits instead of just spamming autoattacks, encouraging good play and synergising with her Hawkshot passive.

k wìxMar 17, 20153 votes

I'll say it. Ashe's passive is f'n awesome. It completely changes the value of 'crit chance' on her.

Edit: The only thing i'd change is the 'bug' that occurs when your shot gets wasted and the crit gets used. Make it so the proc isn't used unless the damage is dealt to something.

gr8jobMar 17, 20152 votes

I like the idea of it only proccing off of champions. Still, she's a very successful ADC with a lot of utility. She has a lot to contribute to a team, besides her damage. Free vision, AOE slow, constant single target slow, and a global stun. She already has a really high winrate and I'm not sure if she's in need of buffs. Ashe is no hyper-carry, but she has her place. Still, I think her passive is kind of random and doesn't synergize well with her role as an ADC, who should be constantly attacking.

AerothalMar 18, 20152 votes

at least its not a useless, delayed, death passive that, in 80% of the cases does nothing in a high mobility meta...

COUGH Zyra COUGH

Malix FarwinMar 19, 20152 votes

i think if her crit only procced on champions it would be a lot better.

The Lonely CloudMar 18, 20151 votes

While I agree that ashe's passive is pretty bad for an adc, saying that she is the only ADC with a bad passive is just plain not true. When was the last time you saw Twitches passive assist him in killing a single minion, let alone a champion?

rtbf221651412Mar 18, 20154 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Lonely Cloud,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=KK1sYAQq,comment-id=000e,timestamp=2015-03-18T02:25:51.171+0000)

While I agree that ashe's passive is pretty bad for an adc, saying that she is the only ADC with a bad passive is just plain not true. When was the last time you saw Twitches passive assist him in killing a single minion, let alone a champion?

Please tell me you honestly do not think Ashe's unreliable passive is more reliable than an actual reliable passive.

The Lonely CloudMar 18, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Please tell me you honestly do not think Ashe's unreliable passive is more reliable than an actual reliable passive.

I mean exactly what I said. Ashe's passive is bad, but its definitely not the only bad passive for an ADC. Ashe's passive is unreliable. Twitch's passive is reliably meaningless, and can largely be ignored. They both need changes, just for different reasons.

Silents429Mar 18, 20152 votes

Isn't Twitches a true damage DOT ?

Helps with last hitting, killing tanks, and works really well with ignites.

I don't see how its bad.

EnkidusmurfMar 18, 20151 votes

And expunge.

Buy Runaan's, shoot the wave a few times and press E.

AwoofMar 18, 20151 votes

Sounds fine, but when it's so weak it might as well be considered reduced health regen, it doesn't really do anything you listed.

Silents429Mar 18, 20151 votes

"Twitch's basic attacks apply a stack of Deadly Venom, dealing 1 / 2 / 3 / 4 / 5 / 6 true damage per second for 6 seconds. This effect can stack up to 6 times for a minimum of 6 / 12 / 18 / 24 / 30 / 36 and maximum of 36 / 72 / 108 / 144 / 180 / 216 total true damage over the duration."

It might be somewhat crappy to you early on, but it gets insane late game, and amplifies his other abilities as well. Twitch's passive is fine.

AwoofMar 18, 20151 votes

It's not neccessarily as bad as i worded it, but it's nowhere near "insane", like, not at all. (and it doesn't amplify his abilities, E doesn't even exist without it and his ult simply spreads the tickle among more people)

Silents429Mar 18, 20151 votes

It isn't underpowered, and it isn't overpowered. It serves its purpose well, and shouldn't need a change, it allows him to hurt even tanks, and win duels.

And have you seen the scaling and damage on his E? Its insane, especially since he can apply his passive to multiple enemies with a item 3085 or his ult.

The Lonely CloudMar 19, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Isn't Twitches a true damage DOT ?

Helps with last hitting, killing tanks, and works really well with ignites.

I don't see how its bad.

Its a true damage passive that does at most, 36 damage. Most champions base health re-gen basically invalidates his passive. It used to be good but they lowered its damage way too far to be usable.

Silents429Mar 19, 20151 votes

Healing HP every 5 seconds does not invalidate true damage every second, plus the damage his AA does itself, Its Max is 36 after one fully stacked Proc the maximum it can do over the course of its duration is 216 True damage.

Enraged PigletMar 31, 20151 votes

I think it's more then that and you'd be amazed how many times twitches passive gets a kill. And even if it was only 36 hp that's still a lot. There have been several cases where riot has nerfed someone like jax's or yasuo's, Ryzes hp by 20 and they go from being op super pick to almost trash. So giving someone 36 damage or more in there all-ins or general poke is really strong. Though I think people forget that ashes passive can be utilized pretty well in all in's I mean a leona can stun then there's ashes follow up stun with her ult and there jsut standing there for 10 seconds waiting for you to AA him. So if leona waits for ashe passive it can be fairly reliable and early level ashe cheese is pretty good as well.

ModAcademy KaynMar 18, 20151 votes

Where does Varus fit in with this? The same with "Helps with last hitting"?