Support Maokai is (still) a problem!

C9 Squeeky ··3 votes·864 views

The playstyle is unhealthy. Maokai is supposed to be a tank/vanguard, meaning he should have to engage the enemy head-on to do what he wants. Even with 7.10 changes, though, he is still being played in the support role and is oppressive to lane against. Support Maokai usually gets item 3303 to spam E, even after mana cost nerf. There are a couple reasons why he's oppressive and it is all in the new saplings. The saplings provide free harassment with little counter-play except "don't get too close to brush" or "try to outrun the sapling". Normally, you can juke skillshots and then you can re-enter your brush and take control of it. You cannot "juke" saplings. I know of the adjusted sapling speed currently on the PBE but I feel it is not enough and doesn't fix the fundamental problem considering Maokai's playstyle of a vanguard. Just poke E until they're low, then all-in. I have a few potential solutions:

  1. Nerf the crazy damage. The saplings now deal 8% at all ranks, 16% of TARGET's MAX HP when thrown in a brush. It's a one-point wonder. Can you think of any level 1 ability that can take 16% of a champion's health from level 1? That also has 1100 cast range on an 11 second cooldown. Very few, if any. Lower the balance numbers or make the saplings scale off Maokai's own HP instead of targets'. That way it still has relevance all game long.

  2. Make empowered saplings give increased sight/vision and chase range instead of increased damage. This enforces saplings to be sentries, much like Kalista W Sentinel.

  3. Make the increased (double) damage apply only when thrown in brushes in the river/jungle; or only when thrown on your team's side of the river. Make it exclude lane brushes (top/botlane). If Saplings are supposed to be sentries, shouldn't they guard your jungle entrances? ADC/support shouldn't have to risk their lives being close to the river, more vulnerable to ganks, just because they want avoid the empowered saplings thrown in the lane brush.

  4. Put Saplings on a ammo/charge system. Saplings may not be invisible but can often be as bad as Teemo shrooms. They are shrooms with legs AND are accessible at level 1.

TL;DR Support Maokai is frustrating due to the high damage, high cast range (safety) and zoning from his saplings in lane/brush.

5 Comments

JavelinJoe2 votes

Nope it is not. It was nerfed more than enough. It might just be you now.

Succeedsawce1 votes

{quoted}

Nope it is not. It was nerfed more than enough. It might just be you now.

this.

it's actually not even funny how big of a nerf it was to him being able to AP support. you are literally the only one who thinks it's strong now, OP.

C9 Squeeky 1 votes

You two must not ever played against Maokai support or are playing it yourself and crying about the weak nerf.

Succeedsawce1 votes

{quoted}

You two must not ever played against Maokai support or are playing it yourself and crying about the weak nerf.

Solaris Ventara2 votes

In honesty its just as much a problem in game modes such as ascension. all a Maokai has to do is build AP with cooldowns, and they can toss 4 sapplings into a bush by the time you respawn in 10 seconds after getting blown up by the last 4. thats pretty much an instant delete if you're playing any kind of low hp adc, such as tristana or kog'mah, on any map. if not changing its scaling, or putting it on an ammo/charge system, at the very least either make them destroy-able (meaning some health) or make it so they have at least half the area of awareness....

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