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Urgot is the only fucking juggernaut worth a shit

Tychusfindlay918··4 votes·3,261 views

Because he's a lot safer and more reliable than most of the other juggernauts while still having the insane damage and tank that is typical of juggernauts.

Like why fucking play darius or illaoi? Sure their damage is pretty good, but it's not as insane as other melee carries and the damage is so fucking high in the game that callin darius or illaoi tanky is fucking laughable, because it's not all that hard to murder them in less than 4 seconds, ESPECIALLY because their clunky ass fucking kits make those 4 seconds excruciatingly painful.

Juggernaut class fucking SUCKS.

http://na.op.gg/champion/statistics

Just look at fucking top lane, you have urgot in #1 and then that's it. Somehow fucking cassiopeia is murdering the entire top lane roster (lulz) and the next "best" juggernaut is down at position #13, illaoi, and as someone who plays her fairly religiously, she's fucking ok if the matchup isn't too bad and pure fucking shit otherwise.

Juggernauts don't exist in jungle basically.

Juggernauts don't exist in mid basically.

Juggernauts don't exist in bot basically.

Juggernauts don't exist in support basically.

This fucking class is so disgustingly painful to play minus one fucking champion who should've had his knees batted the fuck out from under him 3 months ago.

22 Comments

Fízz v23 votes

juggernauts and assassins arent allowed to be good because of low elo xd

If you are a strong juggernaut or assassin, you most likely break what the class is supposed to be (Urgot is a ranged "juggernaut" with mobility, LB is a ranged "assassin", Kassadin is a tank "assassin" that scales)

DragonShea1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Fízz v2,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J1O62ET3,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-12-31T01:48:38.858+0000)

juggernauts and assassins arent allowed to be good because of low elo xd

If you are a strong juggernaut or assassin, you most likely break what the class is supposed to be (Urgot is a ranged "juggernaut" with mobility, LB is a ranged "assassin", Kassadin is a tank "assassin" that scales)

let lower elo suffer, if they got a problem then they should learn. I've had a hard fucking time dealing with illaoi but I manage, there are other champs that annoy me to I still deal with it.

NemeBro1 votes

{quoted}

Because he's a lot safer and more reliable than most of the other juggernauts while still having the insane damage and tank that is typical of juggernauts.

Like why fucking play darius or illaoi? Sure their damage is pretty good, but it's not as insane as other melee carries and the damage is so fucking high in the game that callin darius or illaoi tanky is fucking laughable, because it's not all that hard to murder them in less than 4 seconds, ESPECIALLY because their clunky ass fucking kits make those 4 seconds excruciatingly painful.

Juggernaut class fucking SUCKS.

http://na.op.gg/champion/statistics

Just look at fucking top lane, you have urgot in #1 and then that's it. Somehow fucking cassiopeia is murdering the entire top lane roster (lulz) and the next "best" juggernaut is down at position #13, illaoi, and as someone who plays her fairly religiously, she's fucking ok if the matchup isn't too bad and pure fucking shit otherwise.

Juggernauts don't exist in jungle basically.

Juggernauts don't exist in mid basically.

Juggernauts don't exist in bot basically.

Juggernauts don't exist in support basically.

This fucking class is so disgustingly painful to play minus one fucking champion who should've had his knees batted the fuck out from under him 3 months ago.

Do you not consider Aatrox a Juggernaut?

But yeah, juggernauts as a class are largely a failure. They suck ass.

Moody P2 votes

aatrox buys full lethality and does almost nothing that fits a juggernaut's description, he's a squishy diver if we're being generous

(more like he's a mistake)

NemeBro1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J1O62ET3,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-12-31T01:54:14.014+0000)

aatrox buys full lethality and does almost nothing that fits a juggernaut's description, he's a squishy diver if we're being generous

(more like he's a mistake)

Build path doesn't matter. Despite his squishier build and all-in playstyle Aatrox on average dies less than every juggernaut in the game except for Garen, arguably the tankiest juggernaut period. He's not really a diver because he doesn't have the reliable backline access a real diver like Camille, Jax, Irelia, and Xin Zhao have. He has some mobility but it is very short-range, and his abilities are relatively telegraphed.

He was a mistake though, yeah. The champion has virtually no weaknesses.

Moody P2 votes

Build path does matter. Being a juggernaut kind of implies raid boss status; if Darius dropped all of his current items and went full crit and that was his established build and what he became balanced around he would not be a juggernaut anymore.

Aatrox has more lane safety than any other juggernaut on top of having a revive that lets him walk away, too.

Warwick does not have reliable back line access either but you would not say he isn't really a diver

NemeBro1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J1O62ET3,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-31T02:31:02.179+0000)

Build path does matter. Being a juggernaut kind of implies raid boss status; if Darius dropped all of his current items and went full crit and that was his established build and what he became balanced around he would not be a juggernaut anymore.

Because he would be popped like a pimple yes.

Aatrox, despite his build path, isn't, not even in team fights, due to having stacking GAs on.

Would you not consider Mordekaiser a juggernaut?

Aatrox has more lane safety than any other juggernaut on top of having a revive that lets him walk away, too.

Yeah, his tank steroid is so good he can build glass cannon.

Warwick does not have reliable back line access either but you would not say he isn't really a diver

First of all, Warwick can leap across the field of battle like a majestic gazelle with his ult, can use his Q to dash through champions with the grace of a cat, and his W allows him to gallop across the map like a proud stallion. His mobility is leaps and bounds beyond Aatrox. It isn't even close.

Though Warwick is also freakishly tanky as far as divers go, arguably tankier than any juggernaut save perhaps Garen.

Moody P1 votes

Would you not consider Mordekaiser a juggernaut?

no, mord is a melee battlemage

First of all, Warwick can leap across the field of battle like a majestic gazelle with his ult, can use his Q to dash through champions with the grace of a cat, and his W allows him to gallop across the map like a proud stallion. His mobility is leaps and bounds beyond Aatrox. It isn't even close.

Warwick still can't reliably close the gap and can be body blocked, not to mention W is out of combat MS only. Aatrox at least has 2 seconds of guaranteed MS on his ultimate as well as his E and Q range to disrupt a fight while he's moving in for a kill, on top of only needing one full Q rotation to kill a squishy (and even less than that factoring in his lethality build, assuming he applies passive and Dusk on his target and not being forced to waste it on a frontliner) compared to Warwick needing more time to finish the job on his meta build.

Tychusfindlay9181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J1O62ET3,comment-id=000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-31T03:26:47.088+0000)

no, mord is a melee battlemage

Warwick still can't reliably close the gap and can be body blocked, not to mention W is out of combat MS only. Aatrox at least has 2 seconds of guaranteed MS on his ultimate as well as his E and Q range to disrupt a fight while he's moving in for a kill, on top of only needing one full Q rotation to kill a squishy (and even less than that factoring in his lethality build, assuming he applies passive and Dusk on his target and not being forced to waste it on a frontliner) compared to Warwick needing more time to finish the job on his meta build.

Item build path does not determine class status.

Otherwise you'd have classified viktor as a tank not too long ago.

Mordekaiser IS a juggernaut and still plays like one even when he goes full AP. Full AP morde has insane fucking melee potential with his permashield passive and ludicrous W heal.

chipndip12 votes

{quoted}

He was a mistake though, yeah. The champion has virtually no weaknesses.

Shit scaling, inability to bust through tanks after the early game, inability to pin down mobile targets, easily peeled in team fights, lack luster drain-tanking that still gets stuffed by Grevious Wounds...so on and so forth?

DragonShea1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J1O62ET3,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-12-31T01:54:14.014+0000)

aatrox buys full lethality and does almost nothing that fits a juggernaut's description, he's a squishy diver if we're being generous

(more like he's a mistake)

True me, if damage was fixed He'd be a proper juggernaut, right now he has to get those offensive items because the meta is damage and his kit allows him to focus on damage items more so than other juggs.

Moody P1 votes

his AD ratios are also absolutely insane, which encourages him to buy lots of AD to make use of them

Moody P1 votes

they need big defense buffs tbh

Garen has the right template for actual tankiness and not shitty % missing healing as their only saving grace (imagine only having a relevant heal when ur about to die lmao) but he pays the price of being garen

Illaoi Volibear Darius honestly need straight defense buffs like getting resists during their ultis or tenacity in their kit or something

speaking of that how about we get some actual base stat differences that matter? a meager 200 hp over Irelia doesn't mean a thing when she's got her own innate healing, a disarm, a stun, and then a fat 40% DR if she actually gets dropped out of her dash spam and needs a "correct mistakes" button. (Voli doesn't even have THAT much; he's got like 10 AD over her and a little more armor and that's it.) fat and immobile juggies should have it better if they're not gonna get the mechanics necessary to outplay the myriad of bullshit they have to wade through without dashes

Yorick not keeping his old damage reduction for having ghouls out is so pathetic. shitty base stats and then his only innate defense is the worst self-heal in the game. yikes

DragonShea1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J1O62ET3,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-12-31T01:52:15.656+0000)

they need big defense buffs tbh

Garen has the right template for actual tankiness and not shitty % missing healing as their only saving grace (imagine only having a relevant heal when ur about to die lmao) but he pays the price of being garen

Illaoi Volibear Darius honestly need straight defense buffs like getting resists during their ultis or tenacity in their kit or something

speaking of that how about we get some actual base stat differences that matter? a meager 200 hp over Irelia doesn't mean a thing when she's got her own innate healing, a disarm, a stun, and then a fat 40% DR if she actually gets dropped out of her dash spam and needs a "correct mistakes" button. (Voli doesn't even have THAT much; he's got like 10 AD over her and a little more armor and that's it.) fat and immobile juggies should have it better if they're not gonna get the mechanics necessary to outplay the myriad of bullshit they have to wade through without dashes

Yorick not keeping his old damage reduction for having ghouls out is so pathetic. shitty base stats and then his only innate defense is the worst self-heal in the game. yikes

I proposed that tanks and juggs get more base HP but the circlejerk is strong here. Juggs suffer as much as tanks do because their items are bad at the moment.

Dr Dog1 votes

another mage top lane hmmmm wow its almost like mages that have sustain dmg are always abused top lane and literally ruin the fun of the role if they arent banned

CauseSCIENCE2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dr Dog,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J1O62ET3,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-12-31T02:17:28.210+0000)

another mage top lane hmmmm wow its almost like mages that have sustain dmg are always abused top lane and literally ruin the fun of the role if they arent banned

The only mage toplane I know is Viktor, and occasionally Swain, and I haven't even seen the former in a while since the nerfs. Plus even with their sustained damage it still takes a while to poke down most tanks.

Dr Dog1 votes

viktor, now cass, pretty sure ryze at one point aswell, sustain dmg mages with some form of kite getting any power as a top laner crowds anyone melee out of top as seen with viktor most recently

VoraciousX1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dr Dog,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=J1O62ET3,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-12-31T02:17:28.210+0000)

another mage top lane hmmmm wow its almost like mages that have sustain dmg are always abused top lane and literally ruin the fun of the role if they arent banned

Cassiopeia has made her way top lane multiple times over multiple seasons. This is nothing new. However vs certain other top lane matchups she sucks hard. Old Akali, despite her dashes, used to cuck Cassiopeia(doesn't appear so now) when she went top lane especially because of it being a longer lane. Now she loses to cheese picks and Kled, Wukong, Maokai, Olaf, and Galio. All of which aren't played that often. Cassiopeia will of course trump Juggernauts. They can't move very fast, and don't have ways to close the gap on her. So if people are picking Juggernauts top super often, she's going to abuse that.

hoganftw1 votes

Mages pretty much get a free lane vs juggernauts. Viktor top is literally disgusting.

Cats Are Food1 votes

Because Illaoi can oneshot your entire team, deny her lane opponent, and be hard as hell to kill?

Just some options.

chipndip11 votes

I guess Aatrox just up and died.

Kelg1 votes

theyre supposed to fight tanks but theres no point in bringing tanks since they die in one second

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