fervor should probably ramp up even slower but more reliably than it does now.

Critmaster Garen··1 votes·577 views

the way it should work imo

1 stack per second in combat (2 for melee champions) instead of per auto attack or spellcast, so it would take 5 to 10 seconds in total for the damage to ramp up.

stacks last 4 seconds, but drop off 1 at a time instead of all of them at once, while out of combat.

would at the same time make the stacking of the mastery itself easier and more reliable, but reduce the burst damage of marksmen from crits at the start of a fight and have their damage ramp up slowly over a fight instead.

i know people are going to come in here and complain about on-hit builds and on-hit champions. but id honestly riot looked into their itemization instead of buffing a pretty universal keystone that is not only going to affect on-hit champions.

item 3124 has buffs on the pbe, and so does item 3153 so right now these champions are already seeing some buffs. buffing rageblade is a better approach to buffing on-hit builds in my opinion, since the buffs will really only affect champions who dedicate their item builds to on-hit damage.

18 Comments

Grimspeake1 votes

Lol so champions being buffed should be nerfed in the same patch?

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

Lol so champions being buffed should be nerfed in the same patch?

the mastery which is more universal for ad carries right now would be kindof nerfed (though its not just a straight nerf if it was made more reliable), while on-hit builds in specific would be buffed, bringing crit scaling carries and on hit champions closer together power wise.

the idea is that carries could use fervor to ramp up their damage more reliable in extended fights, but make it more time gated in return.

an ad carries job is not to go into a fight and blow everything up with frontloaded burst, but to deal sustained damage.

khorney1 votes

sooooooooooo, the nerf/change is fervor does what for people who did on hit builds. ill take the bonus damage on hit vices the stupid increase physiscal damage

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

sooooooooooo, the nerf/change is fervor does what for people who did on hit builds. ill take the bonus damage on hit vices the stupid increase physiscal damage

of course people would take the on hit damage, because the old fervor was broken on anyone who used auto attacks, to the point where we saw full tank builds on assassins, running fervor because they got enough damage out of it to still 1v1.

that was not an issue with defensive itemization, but a mix of too reliable % damage in assassin/skirmisher kits combined with the raw item independent damage they got out of fervor.

ZephyrDrake1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HW53fhI5,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2016-11-22T02:32:23.353+0000)

of course people would take the on hit damage, because the old fervor was broken on anyone who used auto attacks, to the point where we saw full tank builds on assassins, running fervor because they got enough damage out of it to still 1v1.

that was not an issue with defensive itemization, but a mix of too reliable % damage in assassin/skirmisher kits combined with the raw item independent damage they got out of fervor.

and now fervor is garbage and a change like this is going to make it even more garbage! fights are decided way too fast for a change like this to make it useful and even then most ADCs don't bother with fervor and just decide to go for warlord's since it's actual decent sustain vs a mediocre AD boost that you wouldn't be getting reliably. On hit builds won't care for this change either since the entire point of on hit is to ramp up the damage relatively fast and keep it that way. That's why their items pretty much always have attack speed attached to them. Tell me who would a change like this benefit? ADCs? they much rather have it stack faster! than slower... on hit builds? once again they much rather have it stack faster... random AD casters? they much rather get Thunderlords or DFT than wait for a slow stacking keystone to provide a very marginal increase in AD that will rarely, if ever, max out anyways due to the way they fight... so who is this change targeted to? it literally fails to provide anything that anyone wants or needs

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

and now fervor is garbage and a change like this is going to make it even more garbage! fights are decided way too fast for a change like this to make it useful

and nothing about that will change if we dont start changing game mechanics to reduce burst damage by carries in the game to extend the duration of fights by a bit.

that includes changes to fervor.

they already increased the burst window of assassins and made it easier for ad carries to counterplay assassins (except rengar apparantly). now is the time to change ad carries to sustained damage dealers who shine in extended fights instead of frontloaded crit machines who blow everything up in front of them.

and even then most ADCs don't bother with fervor and just decide to go for warlord's since it's actual decent sustain vs a >mediocre AD boost that you wouldn't be getting reliably.

then maybe it would be a good opportunity to tune down warlord aswell. mayve via level scaling. its not like adc are lacking options in lifesteal. would maybe force them to buy at least a vamp scepter or finish a lifesteal item 1 item earlier, delaying their powerspike from mid to lategame and preventing them from crit bursting enemies too early on.

On hit builds won't care for this change either since the entire point of on hit is to ramp up the damage relatively fast and keep it that way. >That's why their items pretty much always have attack speed attached to them. Tell me who would a change like this benefit? ADCs? they >much rather have it stack faster! than slower... on hit builds? once again they much rather have it stack faster... random AD casters? they much >rather get Thunderlords or DFT than wait for a slow stacking keystone to provide a very marginal increase in AD that will rarely, if ever, max out >anyways due to the way they fight... so who is this change targeted to? it literally fails to provide anything that anyone wants or needs

on hit builds should follow the same rule as crit carries and have their damage ramp up over time. thats why rageblade works how it does.

5 seconds for melee champions and 10 seconds for ranged champions to get the full damage of fervor is appropriate enough. some of those champions could be buffed by slightly increasing the ad scaling of their inbuilt on-hit damage to synergize better with the mastery.

khorney1 votes

on hit was really what made varus strong among adc now with the nerf/change in it gee varus is weak and cant do shyt compared to toehr adcs...... warlords doesnt work on him due to the fact that its better on people who can kite and have self peels none of which varus has. The new fervor doesnt do anyuthign i can give a rats asss about getting a alittle extra ad big fckn whoop. DFT and Thunderlords really doesnt benefit him either so what does Varus do besides wonder why riot hates him

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

on hit was really what made varus strong among adc

considering his item builds and midlane presence in tournaments, im pretty sure what made him strong were armor pen/cdr builds and not fervor.

i guess, when it comes to the lack of keystone synergy in general... welcome to the club?

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

on hit was really what made varus strong among adc now with the nerf/change in it gee varus is weak and cant do shyt compared to toehr adcs...... warlords doesnt work on him due to the fact that its better on people who can kite and have self peels none of which varus has. The new fervor doesnt do anyuthign i can give a rats asss about getting a alittle extra ad big fckn whoop. DFT and Thunderlords really doesnt benefit him either so what does Varus do besides wonder why riot hates him

sorry but what? Varus is far from being weak and if you think that DFT does nothing for him then you are playing him wrong. You pick Varus for the insane poke he provides not because you want him to auto something. You are supposed to play him from a massive range and poke the enemy out

khorney1 votes

seeing they changed lethality and items your point on varus having this isane poke is wrong but good for you. He doesnt synergize with him at all nothing does, why would you pick varus when other adcs can do what he does but way better.

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

seeing they changed lethality and items your point on varus having this isane poke is wrong but good for you. He doesnt synergize with him at all nothing does, why would you pick varus when other adcs can do what he does but way better.

sorry but Varus is a POKE champion, you pick him because you want POKE not because you want him autoing. There are plenty of ADCs that do that better, Varus is one of the ADCs that wants to auto champions less. He first wants to poke them down and then go in to land a few autos and then proc his W. That's what he does and changes to items doesn't change that in the slightest

khorney1 votes

lethlaity makes him lose early damage, ghost blade no longer gives him attack speed which he needed. He cant use duskblade really.

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

lethlaity makes him lose early damage, ghost blade no longer gives him attack speed which he needed. He cant use duskblade really.

he did not need the attack speed at all! there is a reason why Varus best build has always been pure AD and next to no attack speed. Yes lethality makes him lose some early damage... like everyone who used to build tons of armor pen, doesn't mean you can't poke people out of lane which is all he wants. He doesn't need duskblade at all. Go for a more AD heavy build with slight amounts of lethality and you will do just fine.

khorney1 votes

do u understand why he needed ghostblade ?

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

do u understand why he needed ghostblade ?

for everything except the attack speed. He built it for the armor pen, for the extra movement speed. The attack speed was the least of his worries and it's still a pretty decent buy on him, specially now that is cheaper to buy

khorney1 votes

but you miss the point, i could careless about how blade was tbh, missing damage on fervor hurts on hit builds a lot.

Ruin Lance1 votes

ok so this would indirectly buff ad champions with dot damage, most notably darius. so i don't think this should be a thing.

Critmaster Garen1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ruin Lance,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HW53fhI5,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-11-22T07:27:59.566+0000)

ok so this would indirectly buff ad champions with dot damage, most notably darius. so i don't think this should be a thing.

i dont think he has problems stacking the mastery right now as it is.

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