MR scaling

JustMyBassCannon·May 13, 2015·4 votes·595 views

Just a few thoughts about MR and scaling.

First, why is scaling MR only on most melee champions? It's not consistent across the board; there are some melee champs that still haven't received scaling MR for no known reason (in Galio's case, it was supposedly because of his passive, but now that means about as much as someone telling you that they main Bard).

Secondly, why is it only melee champions? It's not like ranged champions are that much harder to hit with spells. More often than not, they're easier to hit with spells because they tend to have less mobility, and their range rarely puts them out of reach of spellcasters.

Third and finally, why is it the same amount of scaling MR? It's not that way with Base/Growth Armor stats, so why is MR standardized like this?

8 Comments

Teridax68May 13, 20152 votes

Being ranged is already a massive advantage in terms of safety and reach, which is why melee champions tend to have better stats overall. Even Ryze and pre-rework Swain , who work like ranged bruisers, can afford not to have MR growth. Putting aside the recent rise of mobile ranged champions, even immobile ranged champions have an advantage when dodging spells, since their distance gives them a bit more time to anticipate them, and therefore react to them in time. By contrast, a tank diving headfirst into a Syndra is not going to have as many opportunities to avoid her spells, for example, even if they do have one or more dashes.

I think Xypherous mentioned on a Reddit thread that the lack of scaling MR on some tanky melee champions (e.g. Shen ) was to create "itemization gaps" -- those champions' lack of MR would force them to compensate via items -- but that's also a decision he mentioned wanting to go back on, since it didn't quite achieve those results. Some melee champions, like Yasuo , have no scaling MR because they're intended to be more vulnerable against mages, and Xypherous also mentioned shaving off the MR growth on more damage-oriented fighters like Fiora and MonkeyKing .

I'm not entirely sure why MR growth is the same for all champions. It's likely that any kind of growth past 1.25 would make any champion a bit too innately strong against magic damage, and any growth below that would be hard to notice, but then again there's so much variety to armor growth that these fixed numbers seem like a relic.

JustMyBassCannonMay 13, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Being ranged is already a massive advantage in terms of safety and reach, which is why melee champions tend to have better stats overall. Even and pre-rework , who work like ranged bruisers, can afford not to have MR growth. Putting aside the recent rise of mobile ranged champions, even immobile ranged champions have an advantage when dodging spells, since their distance gives them a bit more time to anticipate them, and therefore react to them in time. By contrast, a tank diving headfirst into a is not going to have as many opportunities to avoid her spells, for example, even if they do have one or more dashes.

Yes, I can understand melees having better overall stats because of the range advantage. It's not the stat variance that bothers me, but the fact that MR scaling is an exclusive thing.

I think Xypherous mentioned on a Reddit thread that the lack of scaling MR on some tanky melee champions (e.g. ) was to create "itemization gaps" -- those champions' lack of MR would force them to compensate via items -- but that's also a decision he mentioned wanting to go back on, since it didn't quite achieve those results. Some melee champions, like , have no scaling MR because they're intended to be more vulnerable against mages, and Xypherous also mentioned shaving off the MR growth on more damage-oriented fighters like and .

So lacking MR scaling is supposed to pigeon-hole builds if they're against magic damage--which is going to be most games against competent teams. I'm glad he mentioned disagreeing with his past self, because that's a pretty moronic decision. Sure, have lower MR on some champions and higher MR on others, but a difference of >22 MR when the baseline is 30 MR is a pretty significant defensive disadvantage for the sake of making Shen want MR (because it's not like a tank would naturally want MR, right?)

As for going back and removing it from other champions, well...

I'm not entirely sure why MR growth is the same for all champions. It's likely that any kind of growth past 1.25 would make any champion a bit too innately strong against magic damage, and any growth below that would be hard to notice, but then again there's so much variety to armor growth that these fixed numbers seem like a relic.

...why not just reduce the MR growth on said damage-focused champions? Or reduce their base MR?

You could fluctuate base and growth MR on different champions, based on their kits. Like every other scaling stat, there is no reason to keep it static across the board, aside from laziness.

Slamurai JackMay 13, 20151 votes

There are 5 melee champions that do not have scaling MR at this point, at they are Yasuo , , Kayle , Singed , Shen . In Yasuo's case, he already has so many tools to deal with AP's (shield, dashs, and wall) that adding scaling MR on top of that could make him impossible to deal with. Kassadin already has his passive which reduces magic damage by 15%. Kayle is technically melee but functions as a ranged champ. Singed is intended to be weak to magic damage to compensate for his own absurd damage and his passive which gives him a shit ton of every health. Shen is the odd one on the list, although I would say its most likely because of his ability to taunt enemy adcs from a significant distance while also taking massively less damage from them, which makes a magic damage very important for taking him down.

As for Galio, I think the biggest reason they finally decided to give him scaling MR is because of the nerfs to item 3174 , his most core item. Cutting 15 MR from the item was a significant hit to the gargoyle, and definitely not one that he deserved, so it's only fair that he got some direct compensation. In contrast to this is when Riot nerfed Lich Bane and compensated many of it's most prolific users. Among those not compensated, however, was Kayle, and I assume Riot justified that by the fact that Kayle honestly deserved a nerf at the time.

JustMyBassCannonMay 13, 20151 votes

But why not just have lower scaling MR? Or a lower base?

Slamurai JackMay 13, 20151 votes

Because every champion in the game that gains no MR per level starts with 30 MR. And every champion that has scaling MR starts with 32.1 and gains 1.25 MR per level with no exceptions. They used to start with 30 as well but the way riot changed level scaling at the beginning of the season bumped it up to 32.1. The base and scaling are exactly the same for every champion, and Riot isn't going to change that to accommodate champs thats are already balanced around having no scaling MR.

JustMyBassCannonMay 13, 20151 votes

You mean they aren't going to bother with actually balancing MR scaling, in other words.

No other scaling stat has this distinction, and there's no justification. It's pure laziness.

It's not like all champions have HP scaling from 500 to either 1800 or 2200, depending on whether or not their kit has HP steroids or builds tanky. No, champions vary from a minimum of 400-600 to a maximum of 1600-2300 in base HP. Same with Armor; it scales from a base in the 20-30 range to 65-97.

And these are all balanced around how they want the champion to be balanced.

So why can't they account for that with MR?

Slamurai JackMay 13, 20151 votes

Because literally all of the champions that don't have scaling MR are balanced around not having it. All of them. I did miss one earlier, Maokai , and he has his ult. And they don't need to balance around scaling MR on other champs when they can just scale around health. Also, it has the benefit of making magic pen easier to balance and more reliable. Tbh, Riot doesn't seem to like MR in general, they've totally gutted the MR options we've had avaialable this season. Why exactly is a mystery to me.