Boards›Gameplay

I dont envy Riot.

dunder kill··84 votes·3,020 views

6 months ago people were begging Riot to make junglers gank instead of rewarding AFK farming. So they changed the jungle for this season to do exactly that. Now the community is angry that they did.

?

Remember when the community begged Riot to "MAKE THE GAME LESS SNOWBALLY!!!!!" so they upped the catchup XP along with some other changes? Now we're bitching about it.

Remember when we begged Riot to buff towers so they did and games because 50 minute snoozefests of waveclearing under towers until everyone was full build? Remember then how we bitched and demanded ways to end games when you got a lead so Riot did and nerfed towers again (AKA make the game more snowbally)? Now we're complaining that we want them buffed again and games are too snowbally.

Remember when the community begged Riot for "more counterplay for assassins" then we bitched when they did it?

Remember when the community begged Riot to make games longer, then shorter, then longer again?

Remember the absolute uproar when Sej was nerfed because "she had her time in the spotlight"? Isn't it weird how we bitch when champs are meta for too long then? Isn't that exactly what we wanted?

There is no pleasing this community. It's a revolving door of excuses and blame. No matter what Riot does this community will always get the tar and feathers ready. It's really like a group of people standing in a circle with everyone pointing to the person on their right and saying "it's their fault".

The second Riot gives the community exactly what they want is the exact second we bitch about it.

121 Comments

Big Lincoln61 votes

the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind

you can't just point at "this community" as a scapegoat. we are not one collective conscience and we do not have the same opinions

dunder kill42 votes

Come on man. While there certainly are individuals, the vast majoirty of the community is a hivemind. Take a look around. Throw a few popular buzzwords around and the community jumps ship in an instant.

Legit look at the front page. There are like 10 Rengar threads on it. A month ago everyone overwhelmingly hated Rengar. People overwhelmingly despised old Rengar's design and now we're begging for it back. Same shit with LB. The community absolutely despised that champ and now they want her back.

Same shit, different story. Over and over and over and over and over again.

the community is not a hive mind

90% of it is without a doubt.

SnakDatSmilesBak18 votes

Except people don't want old rengar back. Read carefully and you'll see that's not what rengar mains want. Same with lb. Maybe most of the community seems like a hive mind because they don't read very carefully.

https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/UnsP4Z7r-we-want-rengar-changedfixed-but-we-havnt-given-many-structured-posts-on-how-lets-start

https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/aszKidB2-psa-we-rengarmains-actually-do-not-care-about-oneshotting

https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/q3scZE41-thoughts-on-rengar-revert

Read them carefully, not one is asking for just a plain revert.

the boss baby4 votes

Don't know why people are downvoting this, it's a really good point.

DJMason8823 votes

A lot of people in the comments are asking for a plain revert.

SnakDatSmilesBak8 votes

Most rengar mains will agree that the pre-rework rengar wasn't healthy. They don't want a full revert.

Edit: I've been to rengarmains. You can confirm this for yourself by visiting there.

doiminat0r36004 votes

Just because they claim to be a "rengar main" or are on "r/rengarmains" doesn't mean they actually are. Some just want to be involved in anything league of legends related. Some people go to Worlds or LCS that don't even play the game.

SnakDatSmilesBak3 votes

If someone's on a subreddit dedicated to one champ you can rest assured they care about that champ lmao

doiminat0r36003 votes

Or they could just be trolling, seeing the hype around rengar and making posts in support of rengar changes for the "best"

On reddit, you aren't tied to your summoner name, so people can't look you up to see if you've even played Rengar. Back when Aatrox was a thing, people on the boards and on reddit were complaining about how bad it was. On the boards, I found 10 different posts with 20+ upvotes that complained about how bad the Aatrox rework was. Out of the 10 posts, 6 never played Aatrox before the rework or after the rework unless it was in URF. On reddit, I was unable to actually find summoners because you can make a different username than one that is tied to your account.

It's like being an employee of a sandwich company. A rival sandwich company is having issues with public relations. So you decide you want to bring them down as well and restate everything the top rated comments against that rival company on a different social media account. You help bring change to the rival company while having no repercussions to yourself.

Edit: I like how you put "lmao" at the end just to make it sound less like an insult or offensive statement.

TheSingularity5 votes

Actually you can logic your way through this.

Rengar mains don't want their old, toxic and broken as fuck champion design to return because then rengar will be added to the perma ban list. Just like the recent "fix yasuo" threads that have popped up because people struggle to get a game where he isn't banned. The same will be for rengar.

He was simply that bullshit, that annoying and that toxic to deal with that no one wanted him in their game. If they want to fix rengar, reverting the rework is the worst possible solution. As instead of playing a worse iteration, you don't get to play him at all.

Hexs Fortune2 votes

{quoted}

Come on man. While there certainly are individuals, the vast majoirty of the community is a hivemind. Take a look around. Throw a few popular buzzwords around and the community jumps ship in an instant.

Legit look at the front page. There are like 10 Rengar threads on it. A month ago everyone overwhelmingly hated Rengar. People overwhelmingly despised old Rengar's design and now we're begging for it back. Same shit with LB. The community absolutely despised that champ and now they want her back.

Same shit, different story. Over and over and over and over and over again.

90% of it is without a doubt.

There's plenty of doubt. For instance where are you getting 90 percent from

Catastrop4 votes

{quoted}

90% of it is without a doubt.

90% of the Boards community is, which is already a small portion of the entire League community to start with.

ProfDrDeath3 votes

These upvoted Rengar threads are probably coming from someone linking all the Rengar threads on the Rengarmains subreddit.

the boss baby1 votes

i wrote the most popular one, and I can honestly say I've ever been to that subreddit, and tbh I rarely eve go on reddit in general. I just wanted to express my opinions and ideas.

ProfDrDeath3 votes

You don't need to have gone there yourself. It just needs someone to link your thread, and some dozen copy(knife)cats.

If anything, take it as a compliment to your original thread. It seems to be written well enough to gather such as response.

Fairyfleur2 votes

If anything this proves that the community isn't a hive mind. The people that loved old Rengar never complained, but once the other side got him reworked they started their attack. The community isn't unanimous; there are many different groups, but you won't be able to notice it on the surface because the people who are pleased aren't complaining.

Eedat3 votes

We've both been posting long enough here, let's be real. It pretty much is and we both know it.

SnakDatSmilesBak2 votes

Defintion of a hive mind: a notional entity consisting of a large number of people who share their knowledge or opinions with one another, regarded as producing either uncritical conformity or collective intelligence.

Note where it says uncritical conformity or collective intelligence. Boards does not exhibit uncritical uniformity or a collective intelligence.

Eedat3 votes

Congrats. You can copy and paste. I can too.

A hive mind or group mind may refer to a number of uses or concepts, ranging from positive to neutral and pejorative. Examples include:

  • Groupthink, in which the desire for harmony or conformity in the group results in an irrational or dysfunctional decision-making outcome

This applies to various irrational circlejerks. People will quote off numbers or stats or dynamics that when applied to one champion/item/dynamic/etc are considered 'unfair' or 'broken', yet are perfectly acceptable for another. If you care for more example feel free to ask.

Fun fact. Language is fluid, ambiguous, and always changing. It's not mathematics or physics which are static. Definitions are arbitrary. Words change meaning all the time. You fail to infer meaning from context which is a critical component for communication. The point is very clear and you choose to spout off some definition that nobody cares about. Either that or you're willingly ignorant and choose to be one of those annoying "but TECHNICALLY" people that drive everyone nuts.

five oh tree 5 votes

It really is a hivemind though. You can have two different people post the same exact thing in a day, and one will end up with 50 upvotes while the other will be at -3, simply because if they see it downvoted once they won't even bother and will downvote it. Same with seeing a post upvoted.

SnakDatSmilesBak2 votes

Then how is it a hivemind if you get two different results from the same thing...? What you're describing isn't a hivemind, it's the effects of ethos. If boards was truly a hivemind then both posts would have the same result.

five oh tree 1 votes

He said 90% hivemind; the 10% are the popular and well known boards users, and all the sheep follow whatever gets upvoted or downvoted. I suppose it's not truly a hivemind, and I should have clarified in my response that I was not talking about all boards users.

SnakDatSmilesBak3 votes

Defintion of a hive mind: a notional entity consisting of a large number of people who share their knowledge or opinions with one another, regarded as producing either uncritical conformity or collective intelligence.

Note where it says uncritical conformity or collective intelligence. Boards does not exhibit uncritical uniformity or a collective intelligence. It is not a hive mind. It is not even 50% a hive mind, and everyone knows op pulled "90%" out of his ass.

five oh tree 1 votes

No, think about this for a second. They DEFINITELY exhibit uncritical uniformity.

Anyone says anything about yasuo and it's instantly upvoted to the max. Anyone says anything about reworks being bad, upvoted to the max. There's not even discussion on it, it's just everyone calling it shit.

Basically everyone on the boards thinks the cinderhulk meta was beautiful, and anyone who says otherwise is downvoted into oblivion. Was it beautiful? to tank players, lol.

Definite hivemind behavior.

SnakDatSmilesBak3 votes

"Anyone says anything about yasuo and it's instantly upvoted to the max. Anyone says anything about reworks being bad, upvoted to the max. There's not even discussion on it, it's just everyone calling it shit."

Then how come we see threads about the opposite as well? Or threads criticizing threads about all sorts of things from "DESTROYING BOARDS WITH ONE POST" to "Cool it with the hate posts" to "YOU GUYS ARE IDIOTS YASUO IS BALANCED"? People are openly critical of each other on these boards.

"Uncritical uniformity" also means your example from earlier, where one person posts something and gets upvoted but another posts the same to be downvoted, actually supports my theory that boards isn't a hive mind. It's not uncritical or uniform if one is down voted and one is up voted, right?

AwesomeGuyDj16 votes

And the most ironic thing? All these people who say "the game has been going down hill since Whatever fucking season they say". Their still gunna play. Their still gunna buy skins.

SnakDatSmilesBak14 votes

They're*

LankPants6 votes

Remember the absolute uproar when Sej was nerfed because "she had her time in the spotlight"? Isn't it weird how we bitch when champs are meta for too long then? Isn't that exactly what we wanted?

Way to completely miss all the nuance and all the context creating a complete strawman of the argument.

The argument was never "Sejuani should never have been nerfed", it was that Sejuani was massively overnerfed and that Riot refused to give her buffs after the fact citing the "time out of the spotlight" quote you have there. The hypocritical part is that they've never treated other champions like this at all. If they took Lee Sin and gutted him into absolute oblivion then refused to buff him up for it saying "he'd had his time in the spotlight" then I'd be fine with what they did to Sejunai. They're fucking hypocrites though so this won't happen.

ZT Xperimentor5 votes

It's like there's different groups of players who also use the forums.

SnakDatSmilesBak4 votes

It's really funny to me that almost every comment on this post is telling you that the community is made up of different people who want different things and yet your post is being upvoted like it's fact.

dunder kill3 votes

What are you implying?

SnakDatSmilesBak2 votes

{quoted}

People downvote logic and upvote conjecture, look at this post for evidence.

And I was just saying it's funny to me. Like in a "thanks for the lol" kind of way ^_^

Read into the matter further and you'll understand why boards acts the way your post describes. In fact, it's almost a perfect microcosm.

dunder kill5 votes

You're trying to dismiss my point as "illogical" while using pure conjecture. You realize the hypocrisy right?

SnakDatSmilesBak5 votes

the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind the community is not a hive mind

Is this pure conjecture? What about this?

Yea everyone has their own things they want from the game. Example would be that I want them to buff turrets so that you don't lose tower from going back to base 1 time from full HP, and I like when games go on for 40-50+ minutes. I'm sure there is a decent amount of people who would also want that same thing I mentioned but probably as much people who like when turrets are easy to take/games are way shorter etc.

What about this one?

There is more than one person on boards. Different people want different things. You're right that there's no pleasing this community, but you're wrong about why.

Now while keeping the past few quotes in mind tell me if this is logical or not.

The second Riot gives the community exactly what they want is the exact second we bitch about it.

It's really like a group of people standing in a circle with everyone pointing to the person on their right and saying "it's their fault."

6 months ago people were begging Riot to make junglers gank instead of rewarding AFK farming. So they changed the jungle for this season to do exactly that. Now the community is angry that they did.

?

Remember when the community begged Riot to "MAKE THE GAME LESS SNOWBALLY!!!!!" so they upped the catchup XP along with some other changes? Now we're bitching about it.

Remember when we begged Riot to buff towers so they did and games because 50 minute snoozefests of waveclearing under towers until everyone was full build? Remember then how we bitched and demanded ways to end games when you got a lead so Riot did and nerfed towers again (AKA make the game more snowbally)? Now we're complaining that we want them buffed again and games are too snowbally.

Remember when the community begged Riot for "more counterplay for assassins" then we bitched when they did it?

All I'm gonna do now is quote my first response to this thread and leave it here for you.

There is more than one person on boards. Different people want different things. You're right that there's no pleasing this community, but you're wrong about why.

dunder kill5 votes

While there certainly are individuals, the vast majority of the community is a hivemind.

I can easily point to data that proves that people in large groups lose individuality and just go with the flow. It's an extremely common occurrence. This is absolutely no different although on a smaller scale. People in large groups are sheep. Its been proven over and over and over again. It's started wars and riots. It's collapsed economies and entire civilizations. What you said still isnt "logic". Its an opinion.

SnakDatSmilesBak2 votes

You're ignoring the logical conclusion that there are multiple groups who want different things and are vocal at different times. If you can't see this then there's no point trying to make you understand.

On the other hand there's your conclusion: "boards hates everything no matterm what"

dunder kill6 votes

logical conclusion

There you go again. Just because you call it "logical" doesnt make it logical. Go read up on herd mentality. Theres a lot of data on it which backs my point.

So how is my point illogical with real data backing it up and yours is logical just because you say so? My point has been proven thousands of times in real world scenarios and happens practically every second of every day. You have provided nothing but opinion. You have the illogical claim.

SnakDatSmilesBak2 votes

These are my assumptions:

  1. People complain when there's something they want but don't have.
  2. There are at least 10 people on boards.
  3. Different people may not want the same things.
  4. Riot listens to the community.

Here is my logic: 5. 1, People complain that rengar is op. 6. 4, Riot nerfs rengar. 7. 2,3, Some people dislike the new rengar. 8. 1, People complain rengar is too weak. 9. 5,7,8 There are different groups on boards who want different things.

Conclusion: There are different groups on boards who want different things.

That was fun! Thanks for the practice :)

Edit: Oh and it's called mob mentality when referring to people. It also doesn't explain the behavior in your post.

dunder kill4 votes

Let's be real. We're both locked into a never ending cycle of "no, I'm right!"

There is no end to this and I don't feel like talking circles over and over.

SnakDatSmilesBak1 votes

Except I've been able to outline my logic for you to follow which you conveniently ignored. Quite interesting.

dunder kill3 votes

And I've outlined the logic of my stance and you keep dismissing it as illogical. Hence the loop

korg0234 votes

No they didnt rework junglers to only gank cause of community, they did it cause of pro play and LCS. They want as many plays as possible and as little time spent in jungle farming since its not "interesting" to watch. Dont you see that they are balancing game around competitive LCS play and not about what solo queue community is asking for?

SnakDatSmilesBak3 votes

There is more than one person on boards. Different people want different things. You're right that there's no pleasing this community, but you're wrong about why.

Shadow Hazard3 votes

An issue is that people don't want one type to be unquestionably better than the other

Kyunsei3 votes

I don't agree with you, your missing lot of points. (About snowball, catch-up and jungle farming)

sobi9992 votes

You're stereotyping. Obviously, amidst the huge community of LOL there will always be people who'd be disappointed but at the same time there will be those who will be pleased. If only everyone had a rational and a fair mind. Nonetheless i am happy with riot for how they are making support champs have more impact on the game and not just be the 5th wheel. Other than that everything is really good like the tower damage, the mediocre length of games and the requirement of more teamwork instead of one late game champ snowballing early on if it gets fed. Its all good!

FantasySniper2 votes

Remember when we begged Riot to buff towers so they did and games because 50 minute snoozefests of waveclearing under towers until everyone was full build?

This never happened...

Cosmic Warper2 votes

??? the tower buffs slowed the game down because champs like ziggs and xerath were meta and would waveclear endlessly and stall games out. That's nowhere near true now and if towers were buffed they would not come back to meta.

PresidentPeewee2 votes

There's always two sides to an argument. When it is snowbally, the people that don't want it come out of the woodwork and vice versa. You can't win.

excodar2 votes

Everyone was happy during cinderhulk meta.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by dunder kill

A huge problem with this board
Gameplay117 comments
251
votes
Reminder that whatever team gets first tower has a 73% win rate
Gameplay187 comments
240
votes
Brand support does way too much damage
Gameplay232 comments
189
votes
These changes reek of #LC$
Gameplay83 comments
183
votes
How is this acceptable?
Gameplay83 comments
163
votes
"I know there are server issues and I queued up for 4 games anyway"
Memes & Games32 comments
146
votes