8 Seasons passed, and I think it's time we make Smite preset for JG

EinarUlfar·Nov 20, 2017·81 votes·3,218 views

Or interchangeable post load-in (pre-leaving base) It leads to remakes, losses, bad ranked games, and overall just a sad/tilted/upset team or Jungler.

Smite is more or less mandatory at this point, and sometimes there are distractions from outside sources during champ select - potentially causing the Jungler to forget smite. Or maybe someone's autofilled / not used to being jungle, and obviously won't be looking to change over to Smite (since we often get same/similar roles and take the same spells, therefore not always looking to change them).

55 Comments

Chaos Milk TeaNov 20, 201711 votes

At the very least your summoner spells could be highlighted and make angry noises when you don't have smite.

Play Teemo's laugh. That'll get them off Reddit.

Velzard of KozNov 20, 20174 votes

Is it strong enough to get them off OrnnTube, tho...

Bottom LanerNov 21, 20176 votes

Ornn grumbles disapprovingly as he forges tissues

PæanNov 21, 201711 votes

OR... We take summoner 11 away as a summoner completely, and put it on item 1039 / item 1041 . So it would be an item active instead of a summoner. This frees up junglers to take more than just summoner 4 or if you're Shaco then summoner 14 . Not to compare MOBAs, but Smite has hand of the Gods or whatever item that acts like summoner 11 for camps and can be upgraded to be AOE like our old purple , or changed to affect heroes/champions with reduced true damage like our item 3706 . Though I'm not sure how you could keep item 3711 as it is unless you have it ward when not targeting champions or have the wards only available when summoner 11 is on CD to avoid misclicking.

RedPanndaNov 21, 20173 votes

{quoted}

OR... We take away as a summoner completely, and put it on / . So it would be an item active instead of a summoner. This frees up junglers to take more than just or if you're then . Not to compare MOBAs, but Smite has hand of the Gods or whatever item that acts like for camps and can be upgraded to be AOE like our old purple , or changed to affect heroes/champions with reduced true damage like our . Though I'm not sure how you could keep as it is unless you have it ward when not targeting champions or have the wards only available when is on CD to avoid misclicking.

That is a great idea.

Bottom LanerNov 21, 20173 votes

so what would stop other champs from buying it and going into lane with it?

zepdrixNov 21, 20172 votes

What would stop them?

The same thing that stops people from buying jungle items in lane right now: Talisman/Machete are absolutely useless in lane: (No damage bonus to minions, no bonus experience, no passive healing).

Buying smite item and bringing it to lane would come at a huge cost. It balances itself.

Need Gold 4 TentNov 21, 20172 votes

{quoted}

OR... We take away as a summoner completely, and put it on / . So it would be an item active instead of a summoner. This frees up junglers to take more than just or if you're then . Not to compare MOBAs, but Smite has hand of the Gods or whatever item that acts like for camps and can be upgraded to be AOE like our old purple , or changed to affect heroes/champions with reduced true damage like our . Though I'm not sure how you could keep as it is unless you have it ward when not targeting champions or have the wards only available when is on CD to avoid misclicking.

DotA has a jungle item that gives you damage vs neutrals and a current % hp active that helps with the clearing. That could work with LoL, except that it lacks the power to steal stuff which I like. You can even buy it at level 1 with the starting money. The downside is that it gave no combat stats iirc and upgraded to nothing, pretty much a crutch item.

Could be an interesting concept, a cheap crutch item that the jungler can sell off later anyway instead of being locked into a jungle item. Of course the exp will be tied to it to keep laners grubby paws off jungle camps.

Lady CrayonNov 21, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=Need Gold 4 Tent,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EudxuQQu,comment-id=00080002,timestamp=2017-11-21T04:43:43.712+0000)

DotA has a jungle item that gives you damage vs neutrals and a current % hp active that helps with the clearing. That could work with LoL, except that it lacks the power to steal stuff which I like. You can even buy it at level 1 with the starting money. The downside is that it gave no combat stats iirc and upgraded to nothing, pretty much a crutch item.

Could be an interesting concept, a cheap crutch item that the jungler can sell off later anyway instead of being locked into a jungle item. Of course the exp will be tied to it to keep laners grubby paws off jungle camps.

Kind of like the Doran's items in the lanes.

Need Gold 4 TentNov 21, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=Chibi Puppy,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EudxuQQu,comment-id=000800020000,timestamp=2017-11-21T10:32:25.394+0000)

Kind of like the Doran's items in the lanes.

Why not? If it gave totally no combat stats outside of clearing, we could potentially increase its power to clear which will open up more jungle diversity. Although, the question is will Shyv/Udyr/Yi/Kayn become broken clear gods with it?

BAK3D BREADNov 21, 20171 votes

no combat stats = champion base dmg buff's a lot of work for something unnecessary and potentially unbalancing it further.

This thread is a joke.

Need Gold 4 TentNov 21, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=BAK3D BREAD,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EudxuQQu,comment-id=00080002000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-21T11:48:13.185+0000)

no combat stats = champion base dmg buff's a lot of work for something unnecessary and potentially unbalancing it further.

This thread is a joke.

Machete doesn't give any stats either. Think of it as starting machete, then just building whatever you wanted to build as if you were laning. Some people already do this anyway, this will be like a very good machete vs monsters that doesn't build into anything else.

SalronNov 21, 20173 votes

Getting ganked by a exhaust + flash jungler sounds really fun and totally not guaranteed death

FławlessNov 21, 20172 votes

of course it does! Imagine a Vi ulting you while slowing you with smite, using exhaust AND igniting you at the same time! Isnt that a great idea????

CatSithNov 21, 20171 votes

If they make smite an active item im sure the smite itemization will change also, most likely remove the different types of smite.

DNFVixenNov 21, 20171 votes

{quoted}

OR... We take away as a summoner completely, and put it on / . So it would be an item active instead of a summoner. This frees up junglers to take more than just or if you're then . Not to compare MOBAs, but Smite has hand of the Gods or whatever item that acts like for camps and can be upgraded to be AOE like our old purple , or changed to affect heroes/champions with reduced true damage like our . Though I'm not sure how you could keep as it is unless you have it ward when not targeting champions or have the wards only available when is on CD to avoid misclicking.

This right here is bloody genius! Esp how to keep the wards available for those that use them!

PokladnicaZlaNov 21, 20171 votes

Who wouldn't want to be ganked by an Ghost+Ignite Hecarime or any other overbearing combination you could think off.Shaco with ignite+flash and his Q? Good luck catching that guy.

It's a nice idea,but all champions that jng would need rebalancing.Taking an additional summoner spell will take some of them over the edge.

PæanNov 23, 20171 votes

It absolutely would need lots of thought before being implemented, but look at this pre-season. It took away the old runes/mastery combo that's been in the game since beta and flipped into something new.
I could definitely see it as a future possibility if Riot were to redo the jungle for the 3rd or 4th time or whatever it is now.

PokladnicaZlaNov 23, 20171 votes

The changes would need to be major. It's not out of the question,but it could more harm than good.

PæanNov 28, 20171 votes

we say that now, but we would never know until they do a PBE-esque test.

RedPanndaNov 20, 20176 votes

Man I made this same thread a month ago and I got downvoted to hell and everyone giving various stupid excuses why we didn't need it. I know you should pay attention to your summoners but I am a jungle main and every once in a blue moon I am forced to support or some such and the next game I'm just in auto mode jungle and totally forget that it was switched.

Here's an idea, let people specify a default summoner setup for roles maybe an option added in the rune pages or item pages that the game will default you to in the player select but you can still change it if you want to.

needHymnNov 20, 20173 votes

[deleted]

Paladin 0f LifeNov 20, 20172 votes

{quoted}

I suppose it's because Riot wants to display the chosen summoner spells on the loading screen, which would be defeated if the user could swap out one as soon as they load into the game. That could be done intentionally to hide a summoner spell. For example, a jungler could role both exhaust and heal, and load into the game. Once in, they exchange one of them for smite. The enemy team then wouldn't know which one the jungler kept... did they keep exhaust, or did they keep heal? Then when the enemy team tries to invade at level 1, suddenly they are exhausted, or suddenly a heal is popped, and perhaps they weren't prepared for that because they couldn't see which of the two the enemy jungler kept.

And if Riot automatically give smite to the jungler, then the problem is, it's hard for the game to know which of your summoner spells to replace with smite. Suppose in your previous game you had TP and Ignite. Which of those two should it replace with Smite? The TP? Or the Ignite?

One possible solution would be to change smite so that it isn't a summoner spell at all. Rather, it would be attached to the two starting jungle items. However, to ensure that multiple champions on the team don't grab up free copies of smite, Riot could make it so that you must purchase the starting jungle item at level 1, or else if you don't, you'll be permanently blocked from buying it later. You can leave the shop and come back and buy it, but only if you are still level one. That way, if the jungler forgets to buy their items, they can go back to base and still be able to buy it since they'll still be level one. But if a laner buys their starting lane items, and goes to lane, they won't be able to come back later in the game and get a cheap jungle item to give them the power of smite, to use smite in the late game to secure things like baron. They would have to buy the jungle item at level 1, which they could do that, however, that costs 350 gold and it'll make them much weaker in their early laning phase so I think very few champions would do that.

Smite meta pretty obvious by now so smite flash would be the mandatory reset if sums arent changed.

Lady CrayonNov 21, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I suppose it's because Riot wants to display the chosen summoner spells on the loading screen, which would be defeated if the user could swap out one as soon as they load into the game. That could be done intentionally to hide a summoner spell. For example, a jungler could role both exhaust and heal, and load into the game. Once in, they exchange one of them for smite. The enemy team then wouldn't know which one the jungler kept... did they keep exhaust, or did they keep heal? Then when the enemy team tries to invade at level 1, suddenly they are exhausted, or suddenly a heal is popped, and perhaps they weren't prepared for that because they couldn't see which of the two the enemy jungler kept.

And if Riot automatically give smite to the jungler, then the problem is, it's hard for the game to know which of your summoner spells to replace with smite. Suppose in your previous game you had TP and Ignite. Which of those two should it replace with Smite? The TP? Or the Ignite?

One possible solution would be to change smite so that it isn't a summoner spell at all. Rather, it would be attached to the two starting jungle items. However, to ensure that multiple champions on the team don't grab up free copies of smite, Riot could make it so that you must purchase the starting jungle item at level 1, or else if you don't, you'll be permanently blocked from buying it later. You can leave the shop and come back and buy it, but only if you are still level one. That way, if the jungler forgets to buy their items, they can go back to base and still be able to buy it since they'll still be level one. But if a laner buys their starting lane items, and goes to lane, they won't be able to come back later in the game and get a cheap jungle item to give them the power of smite, to use smite in the late game to secure things like baron. They would have to buy the jungle item at level 1, which they could do that, however, that costs 350 gold and it'll make them much weaker in their early laning phase so I think very few champions would do that.

As for the first part of your post, you could just have an announcement if someone changes their summoner spell before the game actually starts, you know before it lets you out of base.

Lord Phazanor Nov 21, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I suppose it's because Riot wants to display the chosen summoner spells on the loading screen, which would be defeated if the user could swap out one as soon as they load into the game. That could be done intentionally to hide a summoner spell. For example, a jungler could role both exhaust and heal, and load into the game. Once in, they exchange one of them for smite. The enemy team then wouldn't know which one the jungler kept... did they keep exhaust, or did they keep heal? Then when the enemy team tries to invade at level 1, suddenly they are exhausted, or suddenly a heal is popped, and perhaps they weren't prepared for that because they couldn't see which of the two the enemy jungler kept.

And if Riot automatically give smite to the jungler, then the problem is, it's hard for the game to know which of your summoner spells to replace with smite. Suppose in your previous game you had TP and Ignite. Which of those two should it replace with Smite? The TP? Or the Ignite?

One possible solution would be to change smite so that it isn't a summoner spell at all. Rather, it would be attached to the two starting jungle items. However, to ensure that multiple champions on the team don't grab up free copies of smite, Riot could make it so that you must purchase the starting jungle item at level 1, or else if you don't, you'll be permanently blocked from buying it later. You can leave the shop and come back and buy it, but only if you are still level one. That way, if the jungler forgets to buy their items, they can go back to base and still be able to buy it since they'll still be level one. But if a laner buys their starting lane items, and goes to lane, they won't be able to come back later in the game and get a cheap jungle item to give them the power of smite, to use smite in the late game to secure things like baron. They would have to buy the jungle item at level 1, which they could do that, however, that costs 350 gold and it'll make them much weaker in their early laning phase so I think very few champions would do that.

All of this makes way too much sense. Which means it won't happen.

AlimentateurNov 20, 20173 votes

Is this one of the "you dont have a free choice" threads?

Then please add the following: ADC are getting locked with Flash & Heal Support are getting locked with Flash & Exhaust Mid are getting locked with Flash & Ignite Jungle are getting locked with Flash & Smite Top are getting locked with Flash & Teleport

Remove all the other Free choices too! Top Laner are no longer allowed to take any Champ, their choices are locked Same ofc goes for Jungle, Support, Mid and ADC. So no more Syndra/Lux Support they are getting locked strictly to Mid only!

#kappa

EinarUlfarNov 20, 20174 votes

No, it's a "Smite is typically mandatory, so have the summoner spells preset Smite for the queued up Jungler" thread. I don't feel you shouldn't be able to change it, I just feel it should be preset to prevent the occasional "oops, forgot smite, remake/gg/lol i'm tilted/ff please" etc.

AlimentateurNov 21, 20171 votes

Know your Meme "Kappa is a graphic emoticon commonly used by trolls as a postscript to a sentence to convey sarcasm"

CatSithNov 20, 201711 votes

Preset does not mean permanent. [zombie-brand-facepalm]

Velzard of KozNov 20, 20175 votes

How can you miss post's point this hard

Jet SettNov 21, 20176 votes

"free choices" How many times do you see junglers intentionally going into games without smite? And they said "preset" not locked, you shouldn't be so hostile and presumptuous when you didn't even understand to begin with.

AlimentateurNov 21, 20171 votes

Know your Meme "Kappa is a graphic emoticon commonly used by trolls as a postscript to a sentence to convey sarcasm"

Jet SettNov 21, 20171 votes

The comment was entirely too hostile and passive aggressive while also using a form of satire that's only effective when there's a major precedence of what you're doing satire on. You need a precedent of people bitching before you do satire on the bitching.

AlimentateurNov 21, 20171 votes

its sarcasm not satire. Know you Memes and learn the difference

Jet SettNov 21, 20172 votes

"the use of humor, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and criticize people's stupidity or vices, particularly in the context of contemporary politics and other topical issues."

I know the meme well enough, you just didn't use it very well.

AlimentateurNov 21, 20171 votes

just cause you dont understand the way its supposed to be used, doesnt mean i used it in a wrong way.

Jet SettNov 21, 20171 votes

I understand fully how it's used, and I did not say you used it wrong. I said you used it poorly. For example: Using your feet to walk on magma isn't using your feet wrong, it's using them poorly.

DurzakaNov 21, 20175 votes

I cant tell if youre trolling, or just an idiot.

It is actually not possible to compete in the jungle without Smite. Flat out, impossible. You might as well go be a support for your top lane, you are that useless.

RaijeNov 21, 20173 votes

There is a pretty simple unobtrusive solution to this. If you are assigned to the jungle and you don't have smite your summoner spells are highlighted in red and a dialogue box opens up that reads, "You have been assigned the role of jungle but you don't have smite selected."

There are plenty of reasons to forget it and it ruins the game for 5-10 people when you don't have it. When I played 10 games in a row and one of them is not jungle I sometimes forget to switch back to smite the next game. It rarely happens, maybe 2-3 times a year, but when it happens the game pretty much ends. You don't have any sustain, get exp, or can heal from smite. The other jungle can just move into your jungle and take it. Your only hope is that you can either go top and keep their top lane from getting any farm or roam between the three lanes and get a bunch of kills.

hhaavviikkNov 20, 20172 votes

it needs ot b changeable, if I'm in a 5 man premade and we want to mess around we don't want to be forced to take smite, that's stupid

DylboScratchinsNov 21, 20173 votes

The post states preset, not locked. The OP is suggesting that if you queue jungle your summoner spells start as smite/flash or something, and can then be changed after if you'd rather have something else.

Linna ExcelNov 20, 20172 votes

I'm going to say that this should be done only because you can't get the jungle item without running smite.

0racle0912Nov 21, 20172 votes

Regarding the argument on "what slot would it go on", what if you could just switch their positions in game? By default, it could replace the non-flash spell you have, and if you don't have flash then random at that point. If people REALLY don't want smite, then I guess it could be given in the lobby automatically, then you can change it there, but prompts you "Are you sure you want to do this?".

I agree that this definitely has caused several losses / bad experiences in game from junglers forgetting it, and by having a difficult system to switch out of smite given this role, then I'd say that would solve this problem reasonably well.

AgentBlackNov 20, 20171 votes

Before Runes Reforged, I would agree, but Unsealed Spellbook makes it possible to start without Smite for some junglers. Fiddlesticks, Nunu, and Shaco can all clear camps without Smite and may value starting Ignite/Flash and switching later once objective control becomes an issue. The jungler should probably get a warning in champ select if they don't have Smite equipped though.

EDIT: Nevermind, forgot the bonus EXP.

HelaNov 21, 20174 votes

{quoted}

Before Runes Reforged, I would agree, but Unsealed Spellbook makes it possible to start without Smite for some junglers. Fiddlesticks, Nunu, and Shaco can all clear camps without Smite and may value starting Ignite/Flash and switching later once objective control becomes an issue. The jungler should probably get a warning in champ select if they don't have Smite equipped though.

smite items give increase exp to monsters killed in jungle, so not having it isnt a matter of being able to clear its a matter of getting behind...[zombie-nunu-bummed] not to mention trying to take baron and dragon

Sewer SideNov 21, 20176 votes

{quoted}

Before Runes Reforged, I would agree, but Unsealed Spellbook makes it possible to start without Smite for some junglers. Fiddlesticks, Nunu, and Shaco can all clear camps without Smite and may value starting Ignite/Flash and switching later once objective control becomes an issue. The jungler should probably get a warning in champ select if they don't have Smite equipped though.

If you don't run smite, you can't get jungle items which have EXP tied to it. Meaning you'll be level 3-4 when the enemy jungle is 6 going on 7.

So no. You will always need to start smite if only for the EXP. otherwise, you are just a mobile ward

AgentBlackNov 21, 20171 votes

Agh. You're right, nevermind.

deadlychuckNov 21, 20171 votes

Well i wouldn't say 8 seasons, more like 4. Smiteless jungle really wasn't bad in most tiers of play until they introduced the jungle items. (Whenever that actually was, I'm not sure it was season 4).