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Riot's bias towards Yasuo, Lucian etc. really annoys me.

HP Crookshanks··64 votes·20,269 views

When Yasuo was weaker after the crit item changes he immediately hotfixed (buffed). Now he's OP again but no hotfixes yet.

Lucian is a ranged bruiser disguised as a marksman. He's OP for months but Riot is determined to not nerf him. His W (his only weak ability) mostly nerfed for later levels but it always stays level 1 in the entire game. (He maxes it last and late game is almost non-existent). He needs real nerfs instead of slight nerf to his early game poke which is only good during laning phase.

Meanwhile there are no changes for mage items instead of nerfing them. Mages keep building the same items over and over. (item 3285 item 3165 item 3020 item 3089 item 3135 item 3157 ) How about buffing weak items ( item 3003 item 3174 item 3102 item 3030 item 3115 item 3027 item 3116 item 2065 item 3907 item 3905 ) so mages can build them if they want and have flexible builds like other champions?

Morgana is a mage who's pushed into support role for years because of the assassin and bruiser dominance in mid lane. But she won't get her deserved gameplay update in her rework because she's just a mage (support in Riot's eyes) and not flashy and exciting like Aatrox Akali Irelia . Many mages share Morgana 's fate like Karma Zyra Brand etc.

Karma is an another mage (support in Riot's eyes) which Riot clearly hates. I can't even remember the last time she had positive win rate and she isn't even a hard to play champion. She was nerfed because she was played in multiple lanes (Yasuo is played in all lanes). Now Riot is planning to push her into support even more.

I wish that Riot was fair and did something about Yasuo (and other cancerous champions) and brought back mages to the mid lane.

69 Comments

DarwinTheory23 votes

The Yasuo love RIOT have is a joke.

People forget when conqueror hit it was such a HUGE buff he got LCS play. Consider that.....

Then they nerfed IE (I think?) And hotfix buffed him. So that's 2 buffs.

Now they buffed a crit item or two and haven't hotfix nerfed.

It's utter bias. But whatever. I dodge or ban that stupid BS champion.

DuskDaUmbreon9 votes

Morgana's kit is basically fine tho. They said they're updating her W and passive. Her Q E and R are all fine.

Also bias towards Yasuo lmao.

HP Crookshanks8 votes

They gave up on Morgana's W and passive update and her R is also unfitting to an immobile and squishy mage like Morgana. Her kit is clearly outdated along with Karma. Because both of them don't have any identity.

MiracleMorg9422 votes

Her kit isn't outdated. The clearly like the strength she provides with it and they see it as a top kit that doesn't need much work.

I do agree about them pushing mid lane mages into the bot lane is horrible though.

Karma has been given up on basically and only given half assed changes thanks to Meddler barely giving any time to work on her, hence the stupid W support type change she's getting soon that literally everyone disapproved of, but he's still pushing it through.

Meddler, if you're reading this, you should be ashamed of yourself for throwing Karma into the dirt and continuing to step on her. This is despicable.

Elewd4 votes

Morg has one of the most basic and working kits in the game, you snare, put a puddle down, then ulti and puddle them again while they are stun'd and she blackshields herself while she does this. its a very basic kit and it works VERY well. also if the rumored leaks are true, her W will have grounded effect after the update making her even better against mobilitycreep.

3ternalkarma1 votes

[{quoted}](name=HP Crookshanks,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EpjYstZ5,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-02-13T13:11:12.075+0000)

They gave up on Morgana's W and passive update and her R is also unfitting to an immobile and squishy mage like Morgana. Her kit is clearly outdated along with Karma. Because both of them don't have any identity.

i wish they would just revert Karma :P i found her more fun back then

General Matty2 votes

[{quoted}](name=HP Crookshanks,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EpjYstZ5,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-02-13T13:11:12.075+0000)

They gave up on Morgana's W and passive update and her R is also unfitting to an immobile and squishy mage like Morgana. Her kit is clearly outdated along with Karma. Because both of them don't have any identity.

Morgana doesn't have any identity? Is that a joke?

HP Crookshanks2 votes

Then what is she? Riot made up a class called 'catcher' and classified her as a catcher because they couldn't find anything to give her and everyone that has checked champion profiles/stats knows that Riot is terrible at classifying champions. Many champion can be classified as a catcher like Ahri Alistar Amumu Anivia Annie Ashe AurelionSol Camille Elise Leblanc Leona Lissandra Lux Malphite Malzahar Maokai etc. and many of them even better cathcers than Morgana .

Serika Zero2 votes

I adcize to stop listening to riot about everything. And think for yourself or now you are going to call: Thresh Blitzcrank and others, hookers? Hahahah

Riot also classifies Diana as a "diver". Gee I wonder what's the win rate for diver/ap bruiser Diana.... Hint she's an assassin the moment you stop playing her as one, your win rate will drop below 50% unless you are better than the enemies, basically surfing.

Morgana is a mage, a mage that supports her team. Similar to Oriana, or karma or lulu or lux. she does damage, she provides cc and she can protect herself or her allies.

Riot made up classes and identities themselves they can put whatever they want in whatever class. That doesn't mean they are right.

HP Crookshanks2 votes

Blitzcrank Thresh can be classified as tanks/vanguards/wardens.

Diana is a diver instead of an assassin because she lacks escape/disengage but there is no AP bruiser itemization so she builds same as AP assassins and has similar burst.

There is a big difference between Morgana Orianna Karma Lux (mages) and Janna Lulu Nami Sona Soraka (supports).

Morgana Orianna Karma Lux have only one ability that helps their teammates and also have some cc but their main job is dealing damage to the enemy and they are decent duelers. Karma and Morgana also have self only sustain.

Janna Lulu Nami Sona Soraka have minor damage and they are weak duelers. They are strong when there are other teammates to support near them because all of their abilities have utility and/or cc. Their sustain is also not self only and can heal their teammates.

Serika Zero1 votes

Like I said, you can classify whatever you want, how you want.

And I get it: no escapes means not assassin. But the reality is, Diana and rengar and two of the best assassins in league with the quickest burst. talon also doesn't have an escape if the land around him is red. Pre rework akali had the same problem, no escape.

And tank ekko and fizz weren't really assassins back when they were meta.

Morgana has two team mate helping abilities. Or better said, had. She had Mr shread on W, and black shield. Now she has black shield. But her snare is quite helpful not just as an offensive tool.

Anyway my point is, relying on riot with roles is like relying with riot in item builds. It works on lower tiers, but when you get it top 50%, things change.

jocomotion1 votes

I think of her as a battlemage. A weak one but still. https://leagueoflegends.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Battlemage_champion

Who Fed Ru5 votes

mages still dominating every role, yet still yas is the problem

guess riot are the biased ones

SweedishGunner3 votes

If by 'mages' you mean Cass then as a mage main I'd be happy to gut Cass to the ground but there's not many other mages crowding out other roles as far as I'm aware.

Who Fed Ru5 votes

Velkoz Brand Zyra are basically the strongest supports

Karthus jng is still busted af

Heimerdinger Ziggs bot is still a thing.

and for mid Ahri Anivia Malzahar Xerath Lux all have >52% wr (where are the "Riot's bias towards Ahri, Anivia etc. really annoys me" posts there?), but there are much more viable.

HP Crookshanks12 votes

Karthus is going to get nerfed like Brand and Zyra . How often do you see Heimerdinger Ziggs Anivia Malzahar Xerath Lux are picked or banned? Yasuo and Lucian are picked/banned in almost every game. Ahri is more like an assassin than a mage but still Yasuo and Lucian are ten times more popular than her.

Who Fed Ru4 votes

so popularity now equals strength? lul.

only because they are picked less doesn't make them weaker, apart from the fact that Lux actually has almost the same pickrate as Yasuo and Lucian with 708,808 games this month to 825,540/864,327.

Plus Ahri Veigar Velkoz Karthus also all have not so low pickrates too while maintaining high winrates.

Banrates are just high for these 2 champs simply because they are popular and the community bans them because chances are high that an enemy wants to pick them when they are on the strong side, instead of wasting their ban on a champion that prob won't get picked. Still, there are stronger champions out there that are just not so popular.

And Yasuo and Lucian have nerfs coming up too, btw.

SpaghettiVase6 votes

[{quoted}](name=Who Fed Ru,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EpjYstZ5,comment-id=00050000000000000000,timestamp=2019-02-14T00:45:04.537+0000)

so popularity now equals strength?

Your first post literally said that mages were dominating every role. That implies that they are all extremely popular dude.

SSW Talon2 votes

The statement might have some truth, however it was exaggerated. Mages are currently viable in top, "adc" and support and they're like most of the time, the optimal mids. Though you can't just straight up pick 4 mages in 1 team because then the enemy will just pick a tank and go full MR, of course.

wolvius1 votes

[{quoted}](name=SSW Talon,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EpjYstZ5,comment-id=0005000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-02-14T11:20:29.425+0000)

The statement might have some truth, however it was exaggerated. Mages are currently viable in top, "adc" and support and they're like most of the time, the optimal mids. Though you can't just straight up pick 4 mages in 1 team because then the enemy will just pick a tank and go full MR, of course.

Unless one of the mages is cassio/good azir player, who will shred tanks and squishies with their builds.

Serika Zero1 votes

Generally speaking, if someone is exaggerating you can assume they are a lier and proceed to ignore them.

Like sorry but if you want change and an actual discussion you can't have it with these type of people. example: omg outside is sooooo hot I could die, #global warming will kill us. So, if you were to listen to that person, you wouldn't go outside except during the night otherwise you'll die. But realty is: just don't wear winter clothes and you'll be fine.

Or: omg omg it's raining everyday here. if you were to listen to that person, you'd always have an umbrella with you and use a car. reality : the weather kind of sucks and it's mostly cloudy. But this means you can have walks outside easy. Without any headaches.

Thats why: omg omg mages in every lane dominating is just a bunch of lies. While true cassio and ryze are issues, even more so with new conqueror. Maybe you should look at why those mages are being played a lot and the rest of 90% mages are pretty much just playing in only one lane (mid or top)

Daddy Ants3 votes

[{quoted}](name=HP Crookshanks,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EpjYstZ5,comment-id=0005000000000000,timestamp=2019-02-14T00:25:47.994+0000)

Karthus is going to get nerfed like Brand and Zyra . How often do you see Heimerdinger Ziggs Anivia Malzahar Xerath Lux are picked or banned? Yasuo and Lucian are picked/banned in almost every game. Ahri is more like an assassin than a mage but still Yasuo and Lucian are ten times more popular than her.

Ahri's a Mage.

HP Crookshanks5 votes

She is assassin/mage hybrid. That's why she's a popular pick in mid lane despite being a mage.

ModAcademy Kayn3 votes

When Anivia, Heimer, Ziggs, or Xerath are pick or ban, it's because they're absurdly strong. Yasuo in particular, is frequently banned, because people don't like playing against him, not that he's strong, and picked frequently, because lots of people like playing as him.

You can not compare much more niche characters, Siege mages, Heimerdonger, etc to folk like Yasuo and Lucian with the only shared variable being "Pick or banned". There are more factors in play.

AirKingNeo1 votes

karthus bot

vlad top

only mages mid

ha ha

SangreDeNoche4 votes

So what you're saying is... We should push Yasuo into support.

I'm game.

hrooza dota 2 votes

wait a sec, you dont play yas support? did not you know death is best CC

Akali is SO HOT4 votes

Yasuo is overpowered this patch, but he isn't hotfix worthy. When the first crit changes went through his winrate tanked super hard so they gave him compensation buffs.

rayzo4 votes

As a Yasuo main, I want him to be weak so people stop banning/picking him every single game. I'm sick of seeing bad Yasuo players that win just because Yasuo is broken right now, not because they're good.

heroikc3 votes

In the case of Yasuo, he was rather easy to clobber with bruisers, tanks and some mages (i.e. Garen Poppy Veigar); he only became a bigger problem when he gained Conquerors and crit rework options (item 3031) and compensation buffs. All in all, Yas may be strong now, but give it time; their probably watching how the tides go with him.

MankeyMadness2 votes

If the current plan goes live, Yasuo is getting turned into a top lane bruiser. He and Urgot are losing tons of midgame damage.

Cant wait for Yasuo item 3006 item 3053 item 3080 item 3812 item 3231 item 3022 builds

Sleepcoma2 votes

Why would you ever buy 3 lifesteal items on a champion that relies on crit.

Stars Shaper1 votes

It's not the first time that this happens, he doesn't get enough damage from crit now to justify a different build. This way you cna still deal a decent amount of damage and keep those knuckups up.

Sleepcoma1 votes

If he doesn't build crit he's useless lol. Imagine playing a champion and just not using their passive. Why would anyone handicap themselves that hard. Think about how bad Brand would be without his passive.

Stars Shaper1 votes

The thing is that he wouldn't get enough raw damage from his crit to justify the squishiness of the build, hence he goes with raw non-crit damage and durability, relying on runes and other parts of his CC to do things.

I mean, it was the nearly same with Tank Ekko with the difference that he relied on his high base damage and passive and disruption in order to be a threat.

MankeyMadness1 votes

{quoted}

Why would you ever buy 3 lifesteal items on a champion that relies on crit.

Because loads of AD does tons of damage? And Yasuo is a diver.

wolvius2 votes

Also "weak" items you mentioned such as rylais can't really be buffed because champs that synergies too well such as cassio,asol, azir get more value which means the item is weak in comparison for other ap users.

Other items such as RoA and nashors are highly efficient (nash 130+%) there just isn't much that synergies well with them or game is probably akready decided in roa case. Nashors promotes Dps but not many build except on hit users due to lack of health or an item equivalent of tiamat upgrade + steraks

They should just revert hextech ice thing the old version had users outside of glacial augment builds it has now.

Lovelle2 votes

Do mages really need buffs right now?

Vekkna2 votes

Honestly, I think it was a big mistake to put the Luden's proc on a rush item.

I think they could have created more build diversity by using Lost Chapter to build:

item 3115 from item 3101 item 3802 item 3100 from item 3057 item 3802 item 1052 item 3030 same build path with Protobelt active (they're unique anyway, so why not?) item 3003 no change [NEW BATTLEMAGE/GENERIC STAT-STICK ITEM] from item 3010 item 3113 item 3108

At least auto-attack effects and active uses require some input and risk. The Luden's proc is all about spamming spells at max range and doing damage even when you miss your target. It's been super unhealthy as a burst power spike, for wave clear, and for poking.

This is coming from a die-hard mage main, btw. Luden's needs a fucking revert because it's bad for the game as it currently exists. It's power is too universal and easy to apply. It crowds out every other rush item. The flat damage on proc only further inflates the power of flat pen on Orb as second item.

It's single-handedly dictating the majority of mage gameplay. A good example of this is Cass going Q max + Comet for no other reason than to leverage the Luden's power spike compared to ROA/Archangel.

Using the Lich and Nashor effects has the exact opposite outcome. They're weaker early and scale better. The actually require some skill to use. They are items you might want to rush but don't because they not currently good enough (adding mana and/or extra CDR helps here). They're also useful to a ton of mages who could use the effects but just don't. Good examples here are Lux, Zyra, Neeko, Zoe, etc - champs who use Lich very well and could use some shifts in risk/reward. Less damage with fishing/poking and more reward with risk-taking.

Hammermancer1 votes

{quoted}

Honestly, I think it was a big mistake to put the Luden's proc on a rush item.

I think they could have created more build diversity by using Lost Chapter to build:

item 3115 from item 3101 item 3802 item 3100 from item 3057 item 3802 item 1052 item 3030 same build path with Protobelt active (they're unique anyway, so why not?) item 3003 no change

that's just a nerf though because of haste

Vekkna1 votes

Not sure I understand your point. Haste already exists on 3 items.

Hammermancer1 votes

{quoted}

Not sure I understand your point. Haste already exists on 3 items.

its a design to make them inefficient to stack, so that would be a nerf to nashors

also the movespeed is better than having hast on LB so that'd be a nerf

Vekkna1 votes

Not sure I entirely agree with that. I think that, on balance, it's a buff when your core items are stronger rush items. Nashor's is essentially non-viable as a rush item, and Lich rush is almost always bad. Moreover, many champs who might rush them would benefit from Chapter in lane phase without it being a 1400g detour.

As for Lich, I was just assuming it would keep some MS. LIke the 5% MS appears from nowhere on Trinity (or CDR on Adaptive Helm or Abyssal).

TyroneWatermelon2 votes

My biggest issue with Lucian is that his entire design revolves around him being able to abuse items, runes and support abilities. all because of that damn passive. he is always either top tier or absolute trash since his release.

QmegaSquadVeigar2 votes

Tbh, the only change item 3030 needs is to be able to go through multiple units again to be decent.

AR URF1 votes

More like the bias that the boards have toward yasuo annoys me. When someone puts a good argument, people just down vote because confirmation bias.

Sorostaran4 votes

[{quoted}](name=AR URF,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EpjYstZ5,comment-id=000c,timestamp=2019-02-14T18:10:13.276+0000)

More like the bias that the boards have toward yasuo annoys me. When someone puts a good argument, people just down vote because confirmation bias.

The confirmation bias here is with you seeing a good argument where none exists.

AR URF1 votes

{quoted}

The confirmation bias here is with you seeing a good argument where none exists.

I've never claimed yasuo was weak or strong. But people won't be satisfied until he's like at a 40% win rate and none existent. That to me is confirmation bias because they hate the champ no matter how op or up he is.

Sorostaran1 votes

[{quoted}](name=AR URF,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EpjYstZ5,comment-id=000c00000000,timestamp=2019-02-14T18:34:46.971+0000)

I've never claimed yasuo was weak or strong. But people won't be satisfied until he's like at a 40% win rate and none existent. That to me is confirmation bias because they hate the champ no matter how op or up he is.

Aside from the confirmation bias in seeing a good argument where none exists, there is also the confirmation bias in seeing confirmation bias in all the people only satisfied with a sub-40%/non-existent Yasuo where few such people actually exist here.

Blitzcrank

Arkhan1 votes

You want to talk about bias? How about Ezreal and item 3043

When you have ONE ITEM for ONE CHAMPION.

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