How does Bard's Q actually work?

Eeyore··1 votes·3,111 views

EDIT: Reworded since people seem to think I'm complaining that Bard can stun you to terrain as a general thing.

The tooltip says "seeks out a secondary target" but... does it actually "seek" like Chain of Corruption or Double Up? Because I always assumed it was just flavour-text for an ability mechanically identical to Baleful Strike and Light Binding...

But after watching one of my friends main him next to me in lane, as well as watching the few other Bards out there... I actually can't tell.

  • If you have an ally nearby, it behaves like Light Binding. This is fair - it means you need to position yourself away from your allies or terrain and be safe.
  • If you're isolated (i.e. no secondary targets nearby or have successfully positioned yourself away from your allies) - the ability seems to select the nearest wall up to 90-degrees, meaning you can get stunned at right-angles to your positioning with Bard. Some other bug reports for right-angle stuns : 1 and 2 (most of the responses are along the lines of "Bard needs every help he can get"). One of the comments states "Bard's Q selects a secondary target - they don't have to be behind you. It's not a bug".

I'm going to try and take a screenshot when one of my friends logs in.

Is it intended for the ability to have two different (heck, contradictory) second-target-selection mechanics? Maybe it used to be like a mini Chain of Corruption at one point in development (i.e. the ability used to bounce to/choose a secondary target and moved slower, so the counterplay was moving apart before they hit) and there's still a chunk of code attached to it? The combination of the two mechanics seems to remove the logical counter play of the ability (you might even say an anti-pattern)... you and your ally are running from Bard and you separate, then he still manages to stun you to the wall NEXT to you (not in a straight line, at a right angle). It'd be like Vayne's Condemn was just "knocks you into nearby terrain or, if none is nearby, straight forward" and moots positioning.

But I know some champions are balanced around bugs. I don't know how much of his power is tied into his ability to stun you at right angles. But there's some interesting "compensations" that could be added, if this is a bug and does get fixed and does hurt his power:

  • Cosmic Binding could be able to hit terrain first and an enemy second.
  • Cosmic Binding could form an impassible wall (for the stun duration) if it strikes two pieces of wall and no other targets.
  • Bonus/fixed range between the first and second target, regardless of how far into the range the first target was.

4 Comments

Eeyore1 votes

Answering a question with a question. Classy.

Inphernal2 votes

{quoted}

But that's an unfair mechanic, in my opinion - both for the Bard player and their opponent. It means his Q has different best-cases depending on whether he target is isolated or not, which kinda conflicts with the core identity of a bond-two-targets ability. It also, as stated above, removes the logical counterplay of the ability (you might even call it an anti-pattern... dun, dun, duuh!).

the logical counterplay would be to move away from your teammate, therefore avoiding the bind. it's both a rewarding skill to avoid as well as a rewarding skill to land properly. It's a skillshot as well so it's not the same as a poppy E/condemn as it can be juked in the brush even when it's warded. I think it's pretty balanced especially considering the rest of bard's kit, Magical Journey and Caretaker's shrine are very inoffensive as well as his ult. It's not really overloading a skill if it's that champs only form of harass (Zilean, Blitzcrank, GP, etc) since options>raw power every time anyway.

Eeyore1 votes

... maybe you missed the part I was calling unfair?

You say that logical counterplay is moving away from your team mate - but being isolated has a different behavior. If you're isolated the bind just targets the nearest terrain, seemingly up to a 90-degree angle.

EDIT: Updated the main post. I am not complaining that you can be stunned against terrain. I'm complaining that you can be stunned against terrain regardless of positioning when isolated.

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