Remember when everyone said Ahri was toxic "bc of her kit"?

Eedat·Oct 24, 2015·8 votes·914 views

Remember how hard people cried that Ahri's kit was super overloaded and toxic and it's very existence ruined the game? Isn't it weird now that nobody complains about Ahri now that she isn't popular even though her kit is exactly the same?

Isn't it funny how people people only complain about popular champs? Like seriously. Nobody complained about Veigar's "toxic kit" until he became more popular. Nobody complained about Sejuani's "toxic kit" until she became popular. Nobody complained about J4's "toxic kit" until he was popular. Nobody complained about Vayne while she was getting dumpstered by Lucian and Graves.

So why do people try to pull the "toxic kit" argument on champs who have had the same kits for a long time only when they become popular?

34 Comments

dunder killOct 24, 20159 votes

Could you imagine what LoL would be like if Riot listened to all the QQ on the boards?

What a horrifying thought

Cenobite AzazielOct 24, 20155 votes

People complain about Ahri all the time. The Q MS buff especially.

OperationDEEZ1Oct 24, 20154 votes

They pulled it with Viktor too, 9 months after his rework with no changes to him whatsoever and people started complaining after he become popular.

EedatOct 24, 20152 votes

Yup! Missed that one. With literally 0 changes he became "broken OP". Just like how Vayne hasn't had a major change since season 3 and is now "broken OP" out of nowhere again.

ChargeItDownMidOct 24, 20151 votes

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EedatOct 24, 20153 votes

Lol no. The "OMG VIKTOR OP QQ" came many, many months after his rework

ChargeItDownMidOct 24, 20151 votes

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OperationDEEZ1Oct 24, 20151 votes

Replace "Toxic" with "Good", and I'd agree with you.

TNHA BaritoneOct 24, 20153 votes

I agree with your argument somewhat, but there is a reason why they are popular. People never knew about them and now that they do they abuse the hidden sleeper op parts of their kits

lightdragoon88Oct 24, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Remember how hard people cried that Ahri's kit was super overloaded and toxic and it's very existence ruined the game? Isn't it weird now that nobody complains about Ahri now that she isn't popular even though her kit is exactly the same?

Isn't it funny how people people only complain about popular champs? Like seriously. Nobody complained about Veigar's "toxic kit" until he became more popular.

Yeah...going to have to stop you right there.

Back when Ahri has "toxic" she had higher range on her spells, damage amp on her charm, and bigger healing from her passive. Her Kit when "toxic" and her kit now is not exactly the same. All the "toxic" was taken out.

Veigar kit wasn't "toxic" because there were many flaws on him. Now they made it were his W comes out faster and he gets AP from assist instead of just kills now. This created a "toxic" to his kit cause even if he goes 0/20/50, he is getting tons of free AP that no other champ can get. His kit now is not exactly the same as before.

EedatOct 24, 20153 votes

Back when Ahri has "toxic" she had higher range on her spells, damage amp on her charm, and bigger healing from her passive.

Wrong! She was "broken OP" right after the damage amplification from her E was removed. If by "higher range on her spells" you mean 50 more range on her W and 100 more range on her Ult then thats a crap argument. The healing from her passive is the same too

lightdragoon88Oct 24, 20153 votes

sigh

How little you know....

People clam Ahri was "broken OP" back when Charm had the damage amp and we still had DFG (R.I.P.)

Then Patch 5.2 changes happen: She lost DFG and she lost her charm amp damge. But what did she gain? Bigger base damage, bigger AP ratios, and the new Luden item was REALLY good on her.

ALL THAT...made her toxic. Now let see what happen between that patch and now:

Passive: Healing reduced

Q: Mana cost increase

W: Damage and range decreased

R: Range reduced

Luden: Cost increased, AP decreased, movement bonus decreased, passive damage decreased.

All this lowered Ahri kit from "toxic" to "annoying but can deal with"

101100111000Oct 24, 20152 votes

A correction, the Movement Speed stat on Luden's was actually increased to 10% from its 5-7% since then.

Just an aside.

lightdragoon88Oct 24, 20151 votes

Indeed it did thanks for reminding me about that.

EedatOct 24, 20154 votes

Then Patch 5.2 changes happen: She lost DFG and she lost her charm amp damge. But what did she gain? Bigger base damage, bigger AP ratios, and the new Luden item was REALLY good on her.

LOL WHAT. Shes gained 30 base damage on her max level W and 0.15 ratio on her E and gained zero damage on her Q and Ult. This is one of those posts that tries to mislead people by the way they word things. I mean if you wanted to complain about the move speed on her Q that would be a legitimate point. But you are seriously going to say that 0.15 AP ratio on her E meant anything? Real?

"Bigger base damage" apparently means 30 at rank 5 and " bigger AP ratios" apparently means 0.15.

lightdragoon88Oct 24, 20151 votes

30 per hit so that was an additional 90 on base plus the AP ratios.

0.15? That is a 15% increase. So yes...bigger damage on both her W and E and movement speed on her Q.

EedatOct 24, 20152 votes

This is exactly what I'm talking about. You are wording things to make your argument sound valid when it isn't

That is a 15% increase. So yes...bigger damage on both her W and E

It was actually a nerf of the damage on her E because you know that part you left out? The part where Ahri's E used to give +20% damage amp but they removed it completely and only gave it a 0.15 APbuff? Why couldn't you just say they increased it 0.15? I know why. It's because you wanted to make your argument sound valid. So by just saying "OMG BIGGER AP RATIO QQ" and conveniently leaving out the part of the damage amp being removed you could mask the fact that it was actually a damage nerf

lightdragoon88Oct 25, 20151 votes

Ahri charm wasn't boosted from the 20% boost, so it a flat buff to her E.

And if you could never land her charm, the added damage to her base spells was a buff.

And besides my point still stands: When Ahri and Veigar both when their kits was "toxic" and not, were not EXACTLY the same. cost, damage, range, and even items have changed.

EedatOct 25, 20153 votes

ARE YOU KIDDING

This is a real response? Guess what else? You never get the extra .15 ratio if you can't land the charm either

This has to be the stupidest counter argument I have eveer heard. Ever.

lightdragoon88Oct 25, 20151 votes

Take a nap, you're cranky.

RalanrOct 24, 20153 votes

Except people still complain about Ahri .

People complain about Pantheon .

People just complain in general.

LuggOct 24, 20153 votes

She is the 3rd most played mid in the game and everyone still hates her kit. Not sure what crack you are smoking.

PrinceOfStormsOct 24, 20152 votes

Because champions with "Toxic kits" can be less toxic by having bad numbers. When their numbers are good, they get played, because they have toxic kits. When their numbers are bad, they are weak, so no one plays them.

But Ahri is still cancer, because no champion with a big pickrate should have a >50% winrate. Take Lee Sin- widely regarded as OP, but has a sub-50% winrate because of all the bad people playing him. There is a snowball's chance in hell that every Ahri player is just that skilled; they're getting carried by their champion.

SwapShadowsOct 24, 20152 votes

Ahri is one of the most easiest midlaners to play while also being the safest and having reliable damage and CC.

yea lets actually make her a skillfull champion again and not braindead easy like she is now

WhismurmurOct 24, 20152 votes

coming from a zed player EleGiggle

BluePolarizerOct 24, 20151 votes

I still ban Ahri every game when I'm captain.

FasmodeyOct 24, 20151 votes

I really can't deal with people's argument that includes Ahri is more toxic than Veigar lol. 2.5 seconds AoE stun, 2k (and may be more) single target and targeted ult, 320 + %100 AP ratio on a basic skill. His W has better scaling and base damage than nearly all champions' ultimates.

Ahri is strong, I know. Something is wrong with Ahri, I agree for that one too. But it's not her toxicity, probably because her super safe game style and being easy to play.

We rarely see Ahri in Worlds, lesser than her pre-rework status. Even when Kennen is overperforming, do you really think Ahri is that strong? So why don't teams pick her in Worlds? If she was so overpowered, do you really think teams would give that advantage and wouldn't use it?

RebonackOct 24, 20151 votes

The hell are you talking about, OP?

Ahri is still in the top five most picked mid-laners.

The only thing that has changed is that buffed Veigar ends up with enough AP to turn her into confetti with his targeted doom Ult.

Summonerrr 1Oct 25, 20151 votes

Funny how the most seemingly illogical arguments are the most prudent.

I personally think indeterminate scaling mechanics ( Nasus and Veigar Q, Thresh passive, Kalista 's fucking horrendously stupid infinite rend stacking passive, among other things.) are impossible to balance and are thus toxic, but no one seems to care about that until one of them cough Veigar cough has hugely increased visiblity that actually draws attention to said thoughts.

EedatOct 25, 20151 votes

No, less people care about Nasus because Nasus can't farm 2 stacks at a time from 950 range to make up for his pathetic laning phase. Kalistas rend isn't "infinite stacking" because eventually the enemy will die. It also resets every fight. And if you think that Thresh's passive has close to the same impact as the other 3, then I don't know what to tell you