This is why Tryn needs a rework

PhDs Nuts·Apr 3, 2017·2 votes·810 views

There was a 35% chance for my lane phase to be over at level 1, and a 65% chance for his:

http://plays.tv/video/58e2c39bc1dd059f87/tryndamere-rolling-those-dice-almost-got-outplayed-

26 Comments

420 gramsApr 3, 20171 votes

You took a 1:3 risk and died so he needs a rework?

GULAG 4 UApr 3, 20171 votes

Idk why would you play aggressive vs trynd. You could have just farmed a bit, built armor, and he never would have been able to kill you again. you are malphite lol.

Also don't fight tryndamere when his rage is full.

PhDs NutsApr 3, 20171 votes

So neither of you watched the video. Tryndamere died. I didn't. I went 6/0/9 and he spent the rest of the game interacting with minions.

The entire game would have been different if the dice rolled another way, which is a terrible mechanic at level 1.

GULAG 4 UApr 3, 20171 votes

Well it's cool of you to not reply directly so you could talk shit. Ok. I never suggested you died, I simply said you could have easily decided to farm all game. I'm not even saying tryndamere shouldn't be reworked, simply giving advice about how you could have played the matchup.

PhDs NutsApr 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Well it's cool of you to not reply directly so you could talk shit. Ok. I never suggested you died, I simply said you could have easily decided to farm all game.

Idk why would you play aggressive vs trynd. You could have just farmed a bit, built armor, and he never would have been able to kill you again.

It sounded like you were saying I died, and so should have played the matchup differently. When did I talk shit? lol. It sounded 100% like neither of you watched the video before posting (especially the first reply), so I wasn't going to "reply directly" (whatever you expected that to be).

GULAG 4 UApr 3, 20171 votes

Idk why, but orginally, the ending where trynd fucks up and dies didn't play. Tryndamere prolly should have autoed minions twice before going in, and he probably would have gotten FB.

Tbh, good trynda players don't RNG pray (I do but I play tryndamere for the memes). They assume they don't get any crits or only get crits every 3rd auto.

Shuyin178Apr 3, 20171 votes

You killed him But he needs the rework Ok then

Also he's stupid. Why would he waste ignite like that?

PhDs NutsApr 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

You killed him But he needs the rework Ok then

Also he's stupid. Why would he waste ignite like that?

If he landed a crit there the ignite would have killed me, but yeah, he could have easily checked to see if he crit first.

Shuyin178Apr 4, 20171 votes

But he didn't, so why are you crying? Just poke him to hell, don't let him build rage, and stay away when he has about half+.

PhDs NutsApr 4, 20171 votes

{quoted}

But he didn't, so why are you crying? Just poke him to hell, don't let him build rage, and stay away when he has about half+.

I'm not crying, that's fairly obvious. I'm saying that leaving the lane phase entirely up to luck is a stupid mechanic.

"Poke him to hell"? As Malphite at level 1-2?

SasogwaApr 3, 20171 votes

The lane is not always a roll of dice for Trynda. Trynda players aren't all retards that all in and have 35% chance to have a crit and "instantly win the lane" There's much more depth to it. How you position, how you trade considering the creeps and how you handle the wave. The spam about Trynda being only RNG-based is getting boring. A bad Trynd will get shit on no matter if he's lucky or not, a good Tryn will generally do well even if he's unlucky.

Irelia BotApr 4, 20171 votes

{quoted}

The lane is not always a roll of dice for Trynda. Trynda players aren't all retards that all in and have 35% chance to have a crit and "instantly win the lane" There's much more depth to it. How you position, how you trade considering the creeps and how you handle the wave. The spam about Trynda being only RNG-based is getting boring. A bad Trynd will get shit on no matter if he's lucky or not, a good Tryn will generally do well even if he's unlucky.

He eithers wins tradesbecause of crits or loses trades because or crits. YOu can not predict it for sure happening but it either does or does not happen. It is the same logic as what marksmen players use to do with the single crit rune for the once in a great while RNG crit on the enemy champ but much more reliable.

It is still completely reliant on RNG and double and triple crits happen more often than people like to admit.

StealWolverineApr 4, 20171 votes

By watching your aa's you can make it very likely that your first hit on them will be a crit. By paying attention to the animation you can guarantee that it is. (by canceling it if its not) 2 crits in a row without items is rare. 3 just dosen't happen. That's just people making excuses for underestimating and dying to level 2 cheese. Its is only pseudo random.

Irelia BotApr 4, 20171 votes

{quoted}

By watching your aa's you can make it very likely that your first hit on them will be a crit. By paying attention to the animation you can guarantee that it is. (by canceling it if its not) 2 crits in a row without items is rare. 3 just dosen't happen. That's just people making excuses for underestimating and dying to level 2 cheese. Its is only pseudo random.

I have been on the receiving end of both double and triple crits. I do not feel out played when this happens I feel like Crit needs to go the way of Dodge.

PhDs NutsApr 4, 20171 votes

{quoted}

By watching your aa's you can make it very likely that your first hit on them will be a crit. By paying attention to the animation you can guarantee that it is. (by canceling it if its not) 2 crits in a row without items is rare. 3 just dosen't happen. That's just people making excuses for underestimating and dying to level 2 cheese. Its is only pseudo random.

3 crits in a row with a 35% chance absolutely happens. It has a 4.29% chance to happen. It's statistically likely to happen more than once every 25 times Tryn engages with full rage and no crit items. That's probably something like once every 3-4 Tryndamere games (on a champion) now that Cutlass/BoRK is often rushed first. I guarantee it happens almost every game on minions/monsters.

Saying that it never happens is like saying you'll never get a crit by running 4% crit chance runes. I crit at least once per game when I run 1% (not always on a champion), which is more than four times less likely than getting 3 crits in a row at 35%.

StealWolverineApr 4, 20171 votes

So just ignore that last line? Your math would be right if they used a truly random number generator, but they do not. The prng they use modifies your actual crit chance on each attack to normalize the results. Crit and your chance of doing so on the next hit goes down, don't and it goes up.

PhDs NutsApr 4, 20171 votes

{quoted}

So just ignore that last line? Your math would be right if they used a truly random number generator, but they do not. The prng they use modifies your actual crit chance on each attack to normalize the results. Crit and your chance of doing so on the next hit goes down, don't and it goes up.

lol, that's just probability doing what it does. If you have a 35% chance of doing something, you will most likely do it 1 out of 3 times. If you do it once, you will most likely not do it again immediately afterward.

Unless you have a link from Riot about fudging with the probability, because I've never seen the calculation differ from standard probability.

StealWolverineApr 4, 20171 votes

Patch notes V1.0.0.109

We have changed how critical strike and dodge chance work. You will now get fewer ‘lucky’ or ‘unlucky’ streaks where you get no critical hits/dodges in a row, or a lot of them in a row. Your average chance to get a crit is the same as before though – if you have a 50% crit rate, and you make 100 attacks, you’ll still crit about 50 times.

This is where they switched to prng. More than 6 years ago.

StealWolverineApr 4, 20171 votes

one of the better links explaining generally how it works. formula is not public so no one knows exact numbers. https://www.reddit.com/r/summonerschool/comments/3dcczx/how_does_crit_chance_work/

LongHair FoxApr 3, 20171 votes

Tryndamere is classified as in nede of a VGU, don't worry but meanwhile evelyn and urgot are barely playable so they get theirs first.

A Basic IslandApr 4, 20171 votes

Unless the fight was an auto or two, tryn isnt lucky because he crit you.

How many times did he swing with full fury?

Having a 35% chance to crit is fine imo, because usually fights last long enough to satisfy the odds a majority of the time.

1/3 is fine for a random chance imo.

PhDs NutsApr 4, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=A Basic Island,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EXHbeE1H,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2017-04-04T04:24:47.594+0000)

Unless the fight was an auto or two, tryn isnt lucky because he crit you.

How many times did he swing with full fury?

Having a 35% chance to crit is fine imo, because usually fights last long enough to satisfy the odds a majority of the time.

1/3 is fine for a random chance imo.

That's literally the entire point of this thread, lol. It's a level 1-2 fight. 2-3 crits ends the fight and the entire lane phase.

A Basic IslandApr 4, 20171 votes

Uh not at all

I'm saying there's little to no actual rng to trynds laning phase because of how consistent his crit is. A fights gonna generally last long enough for him to fulfill the statics at least twice.

Every so it won't be that way cus hell crit twice or not crit at all, buts that's fairly uncommon

PhDs NutsApr 4, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=A Basic Island,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EXHbeE1H,comment-id=000600000000,timestamp=2017-04-04T04:32:34.943+0000)

hell crit twice or not crit at all, buts that's fairly uncommon

[slayer-jinx-unamused]

That's the point. It's common enough to crit twice. 12% common.

A Basic IslandApr 4, 20171 votes

Then why are there stats in your thread indicating the chances of each result?

PhDs NutsApr 4, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=A Basic Island,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EXHbeE1H,comment-id=00060000000000000000,timestamp=2017-04-04T04:39:17.488+0000)

Then why are there stats in your thread indicating the chances of each result?

...what?