tell me if youve heared this before.

Critmaster Garen·Jan 20, 2016·2 votes·254 views

riot overtunes marksmen. people are running hard engage comps and assassins to deal with them. the game is now assassins vs. marksmen.
mages get shit on by the assassins on midlane, so riot overreacts and buffs mages. theyre now able to stand up against assassins but start pushing out melee bruisers out of top lane. you see 2 mages every game top and mid.
mages get nerfed. bruisers get buffed. tanks havent been seen since the first weeks of the marksmen buffs.

instead of going through this whole ordeal all over, can we instead this time just take a step back and tune down marksmen until there are not 3 to 5 every game? which would make assassins less important to have, and compell people to pick up mages for their utility?

10 Comments

RalanrNov 15, 20162 votes

You'd have a point if Zac didn't have his power moment a few patches ago.

Critmaster GarenNov 15, 20161 votes

{quoted}

You'd have a point if Zac didn't have his power moment a few patches ago.

ill say this prediction was not 100% accurate, but it hit the spot to describe the general state of the game.

it is almsot exactly what happened.

first marksmen buffs, then mage buffs, with mages like mazahar, swain, kennen dominating top and pushing melee bruisers out the moment the mage update hit.

then they buffed item 3078 which in turn buffed certain bruisers.

from there the game is still pretty much a mess. the mages were nerfed, and a mix of ranged ad and ap champs took over top. the melees that are being palyed are almost exclusively those who have kits designed to shit on ranged champions.

tanks werent as irrelevant as last time, and theyre getting buffed now.

theyre slowly getting around to buffing other bruisers 1 by 1.

RalanrNov 15, 20161 votes

I'm really having problems seeing that it ever stopped being a mess.

Also, did you know that Reddit thinks it's a tank meta right now? And that ADCs are weak?

I don't get it at all and I'm starting to not get our side of the argument either.

Critmaster GarenNov 15, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I'm really having problems seeing that it ever stopped being a mess.

Also, did you know that Reddit thinks it's a tank meta right now? And that ADCs are weak?

I don't get it at all and I'm starting to not get our side of the argument either.

my argument right now is that this is a repetitive cycle, and that marksmen should have never been buffed.

i fully agreed that they all needed their individual identity, to give them each their own strategic nieche. i think its even fine if some of them jungle, or solo lane in mid and top if that becomes part of their identity.

but only if they give up their complete dominance over the duo lane. this is the part that riot simply didnt do. they also buffed them with their update for no reason, because they were already decent when it came to general strength.

riot did the marksmen update without doing the most important job they had to do first before doing anything else. evening out the melee vs. ranged matchup to not make it always a complete stomp to either side.

but this would also mean theyd have to accept melees (or anything other than marksmen really) starting to show up bot when they can suddenly compete with ranged champs early on.

the fact that they didnt do it, led to a chain of events that is almost identical to what happened when they buffed marksmen before. i remember something similar happening in season 4.

RalanrNov 15, 20161 votes

So basically, the rework generally succeeded to diversify the class, but failed to diversify the role.

Then again, can't be a failure if that was never the intention in the first place.

Critmaster GarenNov 15, 20161 votes

{quoted}

So basically, the rework generally succeeded to diversify the class, but failed to diversify the role.

Then again, can't be a failure if that was never the intention in the first place.

if its not the intention, then were doomed to repeat this cycle over and over again.

RalanrNov 15, 20161 votes

That's probably the case. I don't think Riot is confident they can support full lane diversity like that.

1st MovementJan 20, 20161 votes

Pick ryze the only Mage who hasn't been hit :)

Critmaster GarenJan 20, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Reaver MHX,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EAhArG0f,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-01-20T23:07:36.020+0000)

Pick ryze the only Mage who hasn't been hit :)

oh dont worry. people are going to pick ryze on top as soon as the mage rework hits. and lyssandra and other mages who are decent top laners.

weve been through this shit a bunch of times. the game was in a better state just at the end of season 5 when almost all types of champions were equally relevant. it wasnt perfect, but a better basis for individual champion balance than now. it wasnt like the whole game was out of whack, but just certain champions were too strong or too weak.

maybe this time it would be nice if they went into the other direction and nerfed marksman items, so we dont have to wait 2 years again until everything evened out.

Critmaster GarenNov 15, 20161 votes

fucking.

called it.

by the way.

i think were in between stage 2 and 3 now, only that this time marksmen are still op, and you have a mix of ad and ap ranged top laners.

at least they buffed some tanks this time with the new keystone.