I hope not the only one who thinks riot went full retard with the upcoming patch

Yimmortal·Feb 25, 2015·151 votes·6,688 views

people complaining about the jungle being too difficult for tanky/utility junglers adds a cost for switching smite and nerfs chilling smite

Nidalee has a spammable jump that costs no mana LOL better nerf Kassadin

Community agree that Veigar changes will completely butcher him Deal with it son

Also, remove revive, wtf Riot? RIP to all the revive teleport karthus players.

You just went full retard, Riot. Never go full retard.

127 Comments

KING OF MASKSFeb 25, 201537 votes

The Revive removal is doubly bizarre because of the lack of context. I haven't seen anything from rito addressing that particular change. I'm certain that the majority of players (myself included) don't give a damn about the spell, but that's no excuse for a lack of an explanation.

qetzelFeb 25, 20156 votes

They have talked about getting rid of it since URF. Like DFG, the removal has been coming for a long time. I can't remember the context though...

DEFENESTRATl0NFeb 25, 20156 votes

If I remember correctly, it was because it's mainly used as a trollspell by people wanting to irritate the living hell out of their teammates. Though I have to be honest, on EUW I haven't seen it used since season 3, neither by trolls nor serious players.

I would suppose the fact that hardly anybody uses the spell anymore probably contributed to its removal.

BerserkInfernoFeb 25, 201518 votes

You are not alone. Most of us are totally ticked off at riot right now. This patch is going to be hell.

RencithFeb 25, 201516 votes

Used to love Veigar, riot removes DFG and said a compensation was in order I got excited. This isn't compensation, this is bending him over and taking him to brown town. Veigar wasn't even a popular pick at any point, and hell even in SOLO QUE he wasn't common. Not to mention he had obvious and exploitable weaknesses. I'll tell you this much...I may as well throw veigar in the trash now. I got a LEGENDARY SKIN FOR HIM because I enjoyed him so immensely. Nope, all wasted. My mistake for actually thinking riot would be fair with their buffs and nerfs. Guess I may as well go main zed since riot won't dare touch their precious LCS playmaker.

AnonagonFeb 25, 201513 votes

don't forget J4's untouched 120% bonus AD, 26% armor shred, 6 second cooldown AoE nuke

or the lack of Azir buffs

or the absence of Vi nerfs

or how Lissandra is going untouched

ZelnorackFeb 25, 201518 votes

Let's not forget that J4 was PERFECTLY FINE until the jungle got absolutely ridiculous with the difficulty that forced most others out. Like.. This is NES CastleVania or NES Contra without Konami Code.

The only reason J4 was such a good jungler was because his mega-synergy with M.Gnar. That's a wombo-combo of doom right there. Also because he had passive armour on his E. That's about it. His ganks are worse than Vi's, his damage is below average if he only gets 1 damage item, and he is very kill-able if he gets 2 damage items because, believe it or not, he only has 2 abilities that scale of AD. They don't scale so well that he can only get 1 damage item, but he isn't as tanky as he should be with 2 damage items.

VDc0zCqe0wFeb 25, 20153 votes

{quoted}

don't forget J4's untouched 120% bonus AD, 26% armor shred, 6 second cooldown AoE nuke

or the lack of Azir buffs

or the absence of Vi nerfs

or how Lissandra is going untouched

why would you nerf Liss?

the QQ son

junglerboy16Feb 25, 20157 votes

Because she is a top pick right now. She actually doesn't need nerfs though, she is only strong because everything around her keeps getting nerfed. She may need nerfs soon, but not yet for at least a little while longer.

JofeyyFeb 25, 20152 votes

I agree, the only reason lissandra is "on top" is because her competition got nerfed. Its like an ecosystem and shes on top of the foodchain now. If we keep this up no champs will be viable any more.

qetzelFeb 25, 20152 votes

Or rather, new champions will become viable for a similar reason?

I actually think she is "on top" because of a meta shift. What are the best team compositions now? Teamfighting. Who is one of the best teamfighting mages? Lissandra.

CopyratFeb 26, 20151 votes

I disagree, she's played in the top lane, so it's not like her competition is that much different to what was viable last season.

The reason she's played is because she can bully her top lane opponent, and even survive a lane switch, and then mid and late game, she can click-stun the enemy ADC and let her team win the fight.

Liss is perfectly fine, it's just that her expertise, which is similar to Vi's, is much needed at the moment, and she doesn't even have a terrible laning phase to be punished early.

DamnimalFeb 26, 20151 votes

Liss is perfectly fine with a Win rate and pick ban rate in LCS thats over 30% higher than Kass...better nerf Kass

Liss is perfectly fine with a win rate and pick ban rate thats extraordinarily higher than veigar....better gut veigar

Dont get me wrong i think shes in a good place as well and have went back to playing her mid top now that Kass is gone from the game but saying she is healthy with her ability to instantly melt the enemy adc and lock him down or provide herself with around 4 seconds of invulnrability with ult zonyas while Kassadin who has one mobiity spell that can be countered hard by well timed cc right after he rift walks in is crazy

CopyratFeb 26, 20151 votes

She's usually not the one that melts the adc, as her damage is rather low at all stages of the game. She just holds them down.

But when you nerf assassins, buff adcs and release the kangaroo of vengeance, someone has to get the job done. Liss and Vi do that.

Kassadin is another matter, and not surprisingly, Riot dropped the ball. Again. It's not like Akali or Fizz have it any better, though, but since the board hates them and Fizz found a niche top, they don't really care.

HowldoomFeb 25, 20151 votes

{quoted}

don't forget J4's untouched 120% bonus AD, 26% armor shred, 6 second cooldown AoE nuke

or the lack of Azir buffs

or the absence of Vi nerfs

or how Lissandra is going untouched

J4 has a somewhat weaker early game due to lower armor, Azir is getting some buffs back because Roti admitted going too overboard on him, Vi isn't overbearingly broken, and people just need to learn to play champions that Liss has a harder time against in lane.

Antemos XaosFeb 25, 20152 votes

Like anyone who out ranges her.

Krypton1t3Feb 25, 20152 votes

The range would have to be quite big^^ Its still would be hard to counter her because of her q range... On its own its litle but if you fire it through the minions the range grows quite a bit. In adition to that the shards just go through without being blocked (unless you windwall it) this brings her a lot of pocking ability since she can almost spam the q using just a few mana pots... Another point is that high range champs tend to have low life and with her slows (q) she can easily get to you (e) pinning you down (with w or r) and bursting you down immediatly unless you flash away (and since the flash isnt so big she could still hit you with a q)

To counter her i would try to go with Leblanc , again its only good for fast fingers cause you can poke and jump away quickly... Anyway, its just my opinion...

Focus TeemoFeb 26, 20151 votes

{quoted}

or how Lissandra is going untouched

Shhh we aren't allowed to question the frost mage master race( Lissandra )... inb4 Ghostcrawler breaks out the banhammer.

TerffFeb 25, 201512 votes

{{summoner:10}} item 3070 that was my least favorite thing out of that patch, i never even used revive ouside of a few bot games but why remove it?

SquishyArchonFeb 25, 20155 votes

bump. this is a new low for Riot. Their balance team has been slipping with recent patches but this one really went over the top. Not sure what's happening over there but without a doubt it's clear they have favorites at this point. The fact that a champion like Kassadin who probably gets picked/banned/complained about at least half (but probably MUCH more) as often as Lee Sin or Nidalee or someone is getting nerfed while the others aren't getting touched at all is the biggest fucking joke ever.

People have tried being civil with Riot but they don't give the tiniest shit about our opinions. Riot, you guys are morons.

But hey thanks for being on top of that LCS turret bug at least. I really fucking cared about that.

I Main SwainFeb 25, 20155 votes

I GOT IT! ITS PERFECT!

just tell riot that lee sin and zed need buffs, veigar and the tank jungles need a nerf, and kalista needs a buff. foolproof

WutsKrakenFeb 25, 20154 votes

First, they rip out Kassadin's damage and utility in return for more mobility and I was like wtf

Then they gut his mobility with 0 compensation. Ezreal's E has more range than that, Kalista's and Nidalee's FREE dashes have more range. Almost every other assassin in the game has more damage than Kassadin.

It's a conspiracy, Riot has secretly made a pact with the Voidborn to allow them to destroy all of RuneTerra in return for vast riches with the only method they know how: To smack the only man with the guts to stand up to the Voidborn with the nerbat multiple times

It's just sad when Kassadin, historically one of the most hated champions in the league, is pitied and has his most powerful and defining trait compared to and deemed inferior to other champions deemed "balanced"

KaisadiIIaFeb 25, 20151 votes

Nidalee's jump has 375 fixed range. Kassadin's Riftwalk had 700 range and has 450 range right now.

I can't see how Nidalee's free dashes has more range than Kassadin's.

KonidiasFeb 25, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Nidalee's jump has 375 fixed range. Kassadin's Riftwalk had 700 range and has 450 range right now.

I can't see how Nidalee's free dashes has more range than Kassadin's.

Uh... it's more about her engage than disengage... Pounce has 375 range but also has a 75 radius effective landing point... so basically around 400 range to attack.

If the target is marked for Hunt, the jump is changed to a 750 range target ability...

Lapis x3Feb 25, 20154 votes

At this point, I have more faith that the community could balance League better than Riot could Sighs.

LyraSonaFeb 26, 20152 votes

Please no. Fastest way to ruin the game.

Mr Wright IIFeb 26, 20151 votes

yet, season one - early season 3 they DID listen to US and the game WAS balanced so...

LyraSonaFeb 26, 20151 votes

Back then maybe. The paradigm has shifted now, and the playerbase has yet to catch up. Get with the program.

FeathermaneFeb 25, 20153 votes

Save your Veigar tears. He's probably going to be better than before once he is tuned. And it's not like he was the most compelling champion to begin with.

DirewolfiezFeb 25, 20158 votes

That is one of the shittiest excuses to gut a champ I've ever heard.

Kuroi86Feb 25, 20153 votes

Admittedly, I'm hoping they lower the stun delay or remove his cast time on that.

I will say though, the possibilities of his new Q give me some hope. It's very much possible to fully farm a minion wave with just Q's by the fifteen minute mark. It's possible to farm up over one hundred AP with the new Q before the thirty minute mark. Even with the nerf on his ult, this means you can still do as much or more damage with your ult than before. He NEEDS more tweaking, but I like the direction they are going.

DivewingFeb 25, 20154 votes

Thats idiotic, Veigar was supposed to stun you in the face instantly, YOUR FAULT FOR GETTING THAT CLOSE, BE PREPARED FOR THIS KIND OF SHIT! "I cannot spam a bunch of keys on my keyboard because im too stupid to think about my positioning to beat this champion, QQ NERF IT RIOT" What else do you want? Lissandra Annie ults both skillshots? Talon e is skillshot? Why not remove all need for positioning so thinking isnt required in this game at all

ReberuAppuFeb 25, 20154 votes

YOUR FAULT FOR GETTING THAT CLOSE, BE PREPARED FOR THIS KIND OF SHIT!

1025 range

DivewingFeb 25, 20155 votes

Sorry my mistake, you let him farm up, walked up to him, and expected him not to stun you?

ReberuAppuFeb 25, 20154 votes

1025 range

DivewingFeb 25, 20156 votes

Well done you win. Go try for lissandra ult-skillshot and delayed tibbers now. Fuck strategy we dont need that shit, screw thinking about champion's strengths and weaknesses, i want to be able to dodge everything, lets turn this into an RPG.

AnidanFeb 25, 20152 votes

This isn't DotA, this is League. DotA is more strategic, and this game is going to be more reflex-heavy. It's not a bad thing, but that appears to be the way this game is rolling. The move toward almost everything being dodgeable, or missable in the case of fast skillshots, and removal of point-and-click abilities with no counterplay lean toward that. Strategic niches not being usable because the overarching meta generally (but not always) outclasses it, and so on.

Don't expect this game to even look similar in a couple years - everything will be mobile and have skillshots, or be immobile with some sort of large payoff (whether it actually overshadows the immobility is another issue entirely) because that's the kind of game Riot wants, and we can't change that vision.

LyraSonaFeb 25, 20151 votes

Agreed. LoL is finally becoming what it was meant to be. It is turning into its true vision, which is a fast paced game decided in large part by skillshots. This is not a bad thing; it's a stylistic choice that Riot has made, and it's a pretty popular one from the looks of things. This is the roller coaster we are on now, but if you want to get off and go to the ridiculous DotA tent where everyone is slow and serious like a chess competition, you're free to go there.

KaisadiIIaFeb 25, 20154 votes

but if you want to get off and go to the ridiculous DotA tent where everyone is slow and serious like a chess competition, you're free to go there.

That's the most stupid sentence I've read in my whole life.

KaisadiIIaFeb 25, 20151 votes

This is still a sequel from DotA, like DotA2 is. Stop saying "this is not DotA". Well, we can remove turrets because DotA has turrets and this is not DotA.

Saying that "LoL is going to be more reflex-heavy" is stupid, since the main complain from part of the community is that they don't want LoL to be more reflex-heavy.

AnidanFeb 25, 20151 votes

This is not a sequel of DotA. This is a game merely in the same genre, just as Heroes of the Storm and Smite are. It was made in the spirit of DotA originally, however Riot has changed its direction to provide a different niche in the genre, since if it tries to occupy the exact same space as DotA then DotA2 will handily beat it out by nature of being the original, but more refined version with better balance in that specific niche.

This is the reflex-heavy version, that is Riot's vision for the game. It is less strategic, more tactical. Again, there is nothing wrong with that. It's not my cup of tea, personally, but if people enjoy it then more power to them. Saying you don't want the game to be reflex-heavy at this point is like telling a brick wall that you don't want it to be durable - it won't care, and it won't change.

But you can plainly see that with the recent changes the game has undergone that this is the truth. Mobility is on the rise, point-and-click CC tends to be on the decline, and abilities with next to no proper counter (Veigar's E, unfortunately being the latest victim) are changed to add counterplay to fit into this new motif.

Make no mistake: This is not DotA or its sequel; it is its own independent entity, and it's trying to carve out its own niche away from DotA.

VardenSaladFeb 25, 20151 votes

Doesn't mean we have to like it and it doesn't mean we won't stop fighting to change it back.

AnidanFeb 25, 20151 votes

I know. I don't like it either, and that's why I play DotA more. But the problem isn't that you don't like it, but the fact that we've likely all seen game companies take turns people don't like before. And just like their forebears, Riot likely won't change their vision because of people that are upset at it.

Are some of the latest balance changes incredibly stupid? Yes. Does the move toward a reflex-heavy game alienate older players? Yes. However, this is a game meant to appeal to a broader audience than DotA, and broader audiences unfortunately want reflex-heavy gameplay that League is headed toward. Soon there will be larger differences between DotA's strategic gameplay, and League's tactical gameplay. Balls of stats will cease to exist in their current form (people like Jax are slated for yet another rework, iirc), and mobility will be of immense importance. Look at the newest champ, Bard, for example: One his skills blatantly lets his own allies walk through a wall, giving them more mobility for ganks.

DotA will retain the same gameplay, and balls of stats with uber-lategame carries being of primary concern as the game goes on, with heroes more visibly falling off (e.g. Anti-Mage falls off later when heroes like Spectre truly hit their prime), but League will not. League will be more aimed for an almost TV-friendly high-action game with a lot of tactical decisions going on.

Do I like it? No. That's why I only play with friends now, and keep up with the forums and patch notes to get a general view of the state of affairs, rather than play by myself. The game has shifted from my interests, and I dislike that because I used to love the older seasons, but that time has unfortunately passed. Keep fighting, just remember that you're going up against an uphill fortification. I wish you guys luck, because I'd love for the game to change back.

VardenSaladFeb 26, 20151 votes

I think the problem is Riot just has too many champs. They released so many that seem redundant, or have abilities that have since been incorporated with more flow in other kits.

DamnimalFeb 25, 20152 votes

The Kassadin gut is the worste of the lot I think. I felt Kass was in a good place watchig pros play him and messing around with him myself he didnt feel OP because it takes him forever to ramp up compared to other mid laners. But without his mobility I am probably gonna re-fund him. Syndra as well after DFG destroyed her

Bronze ProphetFeb 25, 20152 votes

who cares. you are just going to log back on and keep playing.

j jFeb 25, 20157 votes

The company should care because people won't buy rp for a game they think is turning awful especially when the company disregards the community every chance it gets.

Faith BreakerFeb 25, 20153 votes

I have not purchased RP since last year. Do not plan on it anymore. Nerf sona then release ultimate skin. Lol

ˆPuffFeb 25, 20151 votes

I'm still rather new to league, and the three champions I have had a ball with are Tryndamere, Veigar, and Kha'Zix. Kha'Zix jungle is my bread and butter, I have so much fun with him. I love Tryndamere Top when I can't jungle, and I think I had the most fun nuking with Veigar. But his over power-ness was ALREADY balanced by his hilarious squishyness, so this patch is a bit frustrating... I'm probably going to refund him for a different caster because he just doesn't feel the same. I'd like a fun mid-lane mage, and just as I get used to one this happens. Not quite sure how to adjust lol. Any veigar alternatives out there? Dunno if I wanna pursue veigar as he now is.

Penguin EclipseFeb 25, 20155 votes

{quoted}

I'm still rather new to league, and the three champions I have had a ball with are Tryndamere, Veigar, and Kha'Zix. Kha'Zix jungle is my bread and butter, I have so much fun with him. I love Tryndamere Top when I can't jungle, and I think I had the most fun nuking with Veigar. But his over power-ness was ALREADY balanced by his hilarious squishyness, so this patch is a bit frustrating... I'm probably going to refund him for a different caster because he just doesn't feel the same. I'd like a fun mid-lane mage, and just as I get used to one this happens. Not quite sure how to adjust lol. Any veigar alternatives out there? Dunno if I wanna pursue veigar as he now is.

I wouldn't refund him. Not worth one of your 3 lifetime refunds.