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its laughable how easy it is to get magic resist vs armor

Rozair··6 votes·619 views

heres a good example Irelia typically builds item 3156 item 3065. so my mid laner builds item 3135 to try to deal some damage to them combined with item 3020. Its doubtful than any mage will be able to burst irrelia down before she kills them. Spirit visage gives bonus healing (basically means lifesteal because spellsteal doesnt exist anymore. So while irrelia is fighting she is actually healing basically all the damage you dealt to her. If you did somehow manage to burst her down till maw passive procs she then gains an aditional 10% lifesteal. Now in the oposite side on the ap. Irrelia dives onto a Syndra and she knocks irrelia back. Irrelia can then walk back closer because she probably has a friggin item 3078 andSyndra movement speed is shit. Then she gets on Syndra again and syndra item 3157 . So now irrelia can perfectly set up a kill. item 3157 is such a useless item its laughable. The only thing its good for is to cancel zeds ult. But even then, a good zed will wait until your item 3157 ends and you are in perfect position for hi to aim his shit at you. Oh yeah and btw he built a item 3156 so you cant burst him down anymore. gg ad wins... everytime. Notice an all ad team comp can win games while an all ap team connot.

25 Comments

GULAG 4 U4 votes

Isn't it the opposite? I mean it's true if you're a bruiser or assassin, but for legit tank items I'd say it the opposite. I depends on what class you play IMO.

Nahui4 votes

It's due to the nature of AP and AD.

AP is mostly burst, so building MR feels more impactful because you see large numbers resisted all at once. However, building MR won't feel as good when fighting someone like Amumu or Rumble since their kits are more about drawn out magic damage.

AD tends to be lest burst and more drawn out. Where someone like Viktor or Veigar can dump their whole AP kit on you at once, ADs tend to take longer. That's why armor seems to be less effective because you tend not to see these massive numbers reduced since they're smaller and less significant.

No, you cannot build a zhonyas and expect to be face tanking AD. It's got an extremely powerful active for many scenarios. And armor items tend to have higher armor values than MR items due to the flow of AD damage to AP.

Zhonyas is not useless, it's finally just not an overloaded AP item. A "Good" zed will wait till it's on CD, but at the same time, a good mage will wait until Zed ults. The logic works both ways. League is a game of seconds, and Zed can't always afford to simply wait.

Your post originated on MR vs Armor, but it seems this is just an anti-Irelia thread. Your problem here isn't MR or armor, it's Irelia. She's frustrating and admittedly good right now, but let's try and keep the content and title on the same track here.

In terms of Irelia, yeah. Her synergy with the new Triforce is great. She's a bit overbearing. Triforce works well with her ult, as well as the attack speed and sticking power. Spirit Visage synergizes with her W. It's not as great as you make it sound, but you can't delete someone who build 95 MR, you know? Not counting runes, masteries, and the probability of Merc Treads which is 35 more MR plus any other MR items, she will require kiting.

However, on the flip side, building 95 armor or more will prevent AD champs from bursting you down too. Doesn't mean they can't hurt you obviously, but they won't just steam roll you necessarily. And again, MR seems more potent as most AP damage is burst, so you see larger reductions than the smaller streams of AD that don't have as large reductions per shot. That's the advantage AD has over AP. Constant stream. AP has the advantage of hard burst, allowing the AD to be removed before the stream can finish.

Irelia can do lots of damage, but it's not your whole health bar in one big burst. It's a stream typically over like 5 seconds or so. If it's a 1v1 scenario, well she functions as a duelist so she naturally has an advantage. But in a team fight, your push will fuck Irelia harder than you make it out to.

Rozair1 votes

ok and then theres Diana where there are no items that give her what she needs to duel someone. She is forced to burst and it doesnt work when they have mr. Shes not tanky and she gets bursted down by ad

Nahui1 votes

She actually does sustained burst. It's an odd classification. If she plays her kit correctly, she can keep bursting over and over and over again. She has her initial burst, then every 3rd auto, then Q-R-Q-R resets, and a lich bane if built.

She has plenty of items. Abyssal scepter is godly on her. Gives her an edge on really any AP. Nashors gives her CDR allowing her to Q-R more often, increase attack speed for her passive, and on hits. She can alos build sorc shoes and void staff like anyone else. Her AP naturally gets her tankier with her shield, and items like zhonyas and abyssal give her armor and MR. She can forego some damage and pick up something like a deadman's or banshees veil if needed. She has lots of options.

WoonStruck1 votes

If you build her properly, she's got good burst, dps, and is relatively tanky; about as good as Irelia.

Her problem is that her laning is much weaker, which prevents her from scaling as efficiently, and she doesn't have as significant of an item spike as Irelia does.

UberAffe1 votes

there are way more armor options than mr options. You can get items that give armor and reduce ASitem 3110 /reduce Crititem 3143 /reflect damageitem 3075 /deal nearby damageitem 3068 /slow enemy msitem 3025 item 3143 /increase your msitem 3742 all of which can be used by ad and ap champions. While MR has bonus healingitem 3065 /shielditem 3156 /remove debuffitem 3139 /invulnerableitem 3157 /reduce enemy mritem 3001 and only 1 of them can be used on both ad and ap champions. Am i missing anything?

Rozair1 votes

your missing the fact that any of these armor items are not for mages

UberAffe1 votes

item 3157 item 3512 item 3056 item 3110 item 3050item 3026 can all be built on mages and will help them survive. Yes you sacrifice some damage but so what you aren't bursting people anyways, they let you survive and do more damage overall.

ActivatingEMP2 votes

{quoted}

item 3157 item 3512 item 3056 item 3110 item 3050item 3026 can all be built on mages and will help them survive. Yes you sacrifice some damage but so what you aren't bursting people anyways, they let you survive and do more damage overall. Yay! Someone remembered ohmwrecker

Rozair2 votes

lmfao show me a mid laner that builds that ever. plus once someone builds item 3036 45% of that armor is fucking useless compared to item 3135 35%.

acording to your logic 330 armor 120 ap

vs item 3156 item 3091 item 3139 item 3065 item 3102 item 3105

i mean banshee veil blocks a whole fucking ability.

UberAffe3 votes

Just because you don't like the option doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

DrCyanide1 votes

Buying 6 boots is an option as well, doesn't mean either of them are worth it.

Ralanr3 votes

The mage mains won't listen. They want builds with no weaknesses. They can't even consider not building an AP item.

WoonStruck2 votes

i mean banshee veil blocks a whole fucking ability.

Wow! A whole fucking ability! Like that Preyseeker was going to get something done if it landed...

99% of the time, it doesn't block an ability that would have made a significant impact.

Sylvant1 votes

why would you build armor as a mage. They are supposed to do damage first and foremost. If you really want it, there are defensive items, but you dont really need that. You are also not supposed to 1 on 1 Irelia. With the example of Syndra, you are supposed to deal some good team fight aoe damage and take down squishies, poke the rest, provide CC. On the other hand Irelia is supposed to soak up some extra damage and be able to peel and dive for carries. If we get the ultimate diversity, where there is all kind of stats combinations for every role and class, it will become a sandbox mode, you are offered only a few paths

Rozair1 votes

why would you build mr as an assassin item 3155

Sylvant1 votes

one offensive item which provides extra defense is fine, item 3157 is there, but you cry out for more armor; are you building mage or a tank

Rozair1 votes

I'm playing Diana the only ap bruiser in the game who doesn't really fit well with Any item aside from nashir tooth

DeathBurst1 votes

Agree with you, but you made a typo. Zhonya doesn't give MR.

Also, you forgot Locket Solari and Banshee's Veil which can both be used by both AD and AP, so the picture isn't as imbalanced as you make it look.

But overall yes, I tend to agree that Armor is easier to get than MR, it's just that there are more semi-offensive items with MR than semi-offensive items with Armor.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

people need to stop being closed minded to items and build paths. if im a "ap champ" who is vs alot of ad instead of getting item 3158 item 3020 blindly every game maybe just maybe item 3047 are worth... and get your cdr/magic pen else where. just as i have been mid before vs a champ like Veigar and ill get item 3111 .

also you scale with armor all game long per lvl.... except Thresh so if you are vs alot of ad take flat ad seals on your ap mage page to get +9 flat armor or since your solo lane and you level faster armor per lvl so you have +27 armor @ lvl 18 + your armor per lvl scaling and if you get item 3157 will give you 27 armor + 45 armor + base armor per lvl for 72 armor and lets use Cassiopeia for example who has 85 armor at lvl 18 will be a total 157 armor and if your vs a hard lane instead of going 18-12-0 or 12-18-0 take 12 points in resolve tree and you can take either +2.0 hp regen or +5% bonus armor /mr your choice 2 less damage from autos or +15 ms in bushes and river if you roam alot you can take +50 hp for just extra hp for early game harass and + 15% cdr on summoners. there are ways to build and play defensively with out having to be a full tank. just think and adjust accordingly based on match ups and team comps.

i wouldnt run armor on a mage if i see all ap comp with a solo adc. id run magic pen reds, hp lvl seals, ap quints , either cdr blues, mr blues flat/scaling depending so i get hp and mr to help survive the ap burst an the base armor and armor per lvl you get with the hp from runes should be decent enough the adc

Rozair1 votes

buying armor is useless because you deal less damage. dealing less damage hurts so much because every single ad champion in that game that deals any damage at all can heal from lifesteal while ap champions cannot

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

{quoted}

buying armor is useless because you deal less damage. dealing less damage hurts so much because every single ad champion in that game that deals any damage at all can heal from lifesteal while ap champions cannot

If you cant sustain the damage and die then no matter how much damage you buy will be worthless if you're dead. You can take spell vamp runes, spell vamp items and even take vapmirism in masteries to have healing on your damage also if you invest into the resolve tree you can take the mastery that increase all self healing therefore getting more out of spell vamp. But when it comes to mages you arent doing sustain damage over time majority of mages are about burst

Rozair1 votes

exactly and it becomes impossible to burst once an enemy builds mr hence the whole purpose of this post.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

how does a full ap mage with magic pen runes , flat magic pen from boots which is 23 magic pen + 35% magic pen from void staff with about 600 ap not do burst to a champ who has 150 mr? and im not including masteries

so X champ has 150 mr and you have 23 magic pen +35% so 150-23 leaves 127mr -35% reduces it another 45 so 127-45 = leaving a target with 82mr and you typically have 500-600 ap on a full build mage such as item 3020 item 3157 item 3165 item 3089 item 3135 and a def item item 3026 giving you 70+100+120+80+ 35% (passive of item 3089 ) for total of 370 + 35% (130ap) 370+130=500ap and and lets say your Q is a .7 ratio with a flat damage max rank 275 so 275x0.7ap(350) = 625 damage before magic pen so your target is left with 82mr after magic pen so 625-82 will deal 543 magic damage. and for a target who has 3000 hp (typical tank with mr of 150)3000-543=will reduce their hp to 2457 so one ability hit do roughly 18% of the targets hp in damage. and we are including bonus from masteries at all. which depending on how you do your mastries is +2% damage on abilities +1.5% damage net gain from double edge sword +15ap from natural talent lvl 18, +2.5% damage to targets who are slowed or cc , +5% damage if target is below 40% hp , + 8 flat magic pen + proc of thunderlords decree key stone.

i think you can do plenty of damage.

Axe2Handle1 votes

You're talking about Irelia vs a Syndra, but you failed to mention where the rest of your team is at. Its a 5v5 game not a 1v1. Your immobile midlaner shouldnt be alone. What I got from your post is your Syndra got caught alone and got eaten by the Honey Badger. Now if a friendly Alistar was standing next to Syndra I'm pretty sure the fight would have ended differently.

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