Boards›Gameplay

For all the bitching we do...

Eedat··162 votes·5,042 views

Could you imagine how trash this game would be if the boards actually got their way?

  • First of all, at least half the champion roster would be straight up deleted right off the bat.

  • Azir would be returned to his former glory of demolishing you at every stage of the game. Why sacrifice early game strength for insane mid and late game scaling when you can have all 3?

  • Kalista we'd ignore that we begged Riot to gut her and restore her to being the hands down best pick in all scenarios

  • Strong early game champions Darius Renekton Pantheon would be completely gutted because "OMG SO UNFUN. Absolutely zero counterplay!"

  • Any and all champions with ranged point-and-click damage Syndra Karthus Veigar (or practically point and click Annie) are gutted due to "NO COUNTERPLAY!!!!!"

  • Any champion that exceeds both a 10% pick rate and 50% winrate ever is automatically deleted due to "WOW RITO! OBVIOUSLY BROKEN!!!!! 18% PICK RATE AND 50.000001% WIN RATE! NERF! NERF! NERF!". Period. End of story.

  • Ranged artillery mages Lux Velkoz Xerath Ziggs have all their ranges cut by half because "UNFUN NO COUNTERPLAY!" despite being completely immobile.

  • Supports now have the highest gold income in the game despite not farming because that makes sense somehow.

  • ADCs automatically lose all 1v1s by default. Simply showing yourself within 1000 range of an ADC that is by themself causes them to instantly fall over dead.

  • Yasuo Talon LeeSin Zed Evelynn Kassadin MasterYi Riven Ekko Camille Ahri Fiora Fizz Illaoi Hecarim Ivern Thresh Vladimir Vayne Tryndamere Kennen EliseAkali Shaco Blitzcrank Draven Graves Jhin Katarina Lulu Khazix Teemo Twitch Janna ........see my first point

  • Point-and-click CC Malzahar Nautilus Maokai Lissandra Ryze Janna Camille Fiddlesticks Lulu now causes the user to spontaneously combust for 1000 true damage/sec for 5 seconds

  • Junglers are now detained in fountain until 15 minutes into the game to keep them out of "MY LANE"

  • Entering the Jungle and River is disabled until 15 minutes into the game to prevent "GANGBANG IN MUH LANE!!!" because coordinated team play is strictly forbidden.

  • Mordekaiser would have 3 dashes and 400 base move speed /s

Or how about instead of bitching at Riot 24/7 nonstop we actually give them some credit for keeping the game interesting for all these years? How many games can you say you've dumped hundred, if not thousands of hours into? How many of those let you play the game for free without a $60 box cost and multiple $20 DLC bundles? Or a $10+/month subscription fee? Yet we're going to tar and feather Riot for incentivizing buying some content for cash?

We complain that it take a long time to buy champions with IP? No shit? Do you think the people designing the new champs and reworking the old ones work for free? Do you think the vastly improved quality of skins are done for the same amount of money as the old ones? If you want proof, look at Pulsefire Ezreal. That would straight up be a 1350 RP skin to today's standards. You think quality Graphic Designers are cheap? You think Riot is a charity that doesn't operate for a profit?

Do you honestly think a game thats kept millions of players hooked for years is complete shit?

How about we give the balance team some credit? People only bitch about what went wrong and ignore any and all positives. People only bitch about the mistakes without realizing these are just people doing their best. You think they're infallible Gods or something? Do you think you could actually do better? LOL. People only bitch about champions instead of learning how to deal with them. Then they complain that "Ranked is unfair! Can't climb!" when they only bitch while absolutely refusing to actively try to get better at the game. I know this may be hard to believe, but the game actually isn't over the second one team locks in LeeSin. I know right?! CRAZY!

Riot,

i want to give you a needed and very much earned THANK YOU. Thank you for keeping the game interesting to play for all these years. Thank you for not caving to the pressure. Thank you for not being afraid to change. Thank you for the plethora of awesome new skins. Thank you for all the bonus free content you give to us for free. Thank you for letting me play as many games as I want free of charge. Thank you for implementing features we've been asking for years like Practice Tool and replays. Thank you for keeping the game relatively well balanced and for quickly correcting the hiccups that arise.

And maybe most of all, thank you for taking the constant bitching and bashing in stride. I know for a fact I couldn't do the same.

130 Comments

Malicious Metal56 votes

{quoted}

  • Mordekaiser would have 3 dashes and 400 base move speed

He would have gotten a proper VGU by now and still have zero mobility. Sorry, but had to point that out.

Literally nobody wants Mordekaiser to have any form of dash in his kit.

Eedat37 votes

That was more of a joke to end the list on a more light-hearted note. I'll edit a /s in there

DarkSunSovereign4 votes

Well, whoever designed protobelt...

EDIT: Remembered Poe's law.

#KAPPA

TimX24968B1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Malicious Metal,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Ax5QE5JX,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-05-16T14:52:31.571+0000) Literally nobody wants Mordekaiser to have any form of dash in his kit.

Right. We wouldn't want him to be viable now, would we?

Malicious Metal13 votes

You don't need mobility to be viable.

Lyndris7 votes

Syndra agrees

Mecha MaIphite29 votes

While I agree that Riot does deserve credit for a lot of what they've done for us, it's still important that we point out their mistakes. Ultimately, we are the ones playing the game, and we should have some degree of input in what happens with balancing and updates.

However, that's not to say that we've been doing a good job of it. There are a lot of constructive, well crafted threads with a lot of thought into them that sink away after maybe 10 or 15 upvotes, while threads filled with hateful rhetoric rise to the front page. Angry rants just seem to be more in tune with what people are feeling, and consequently, it's harder to take a more moderate, rational stance. The more constructive threads that do make it up are usually either very well done, and/or are posted by someone who's fairly well known.

I fully admit that I'm guilty of this as well, making "clever" threads as opposed to insightful ones, just because it's easier to get upvoted and seen. I just think it's a problem intrinsic to the boards, and I don't really have any kind of solution.

Eedat12 votes

There are a lot of constructive, well crafted threads with a lot of thought into them that sink away after maybe 10 or 15 upvotes, while threads filled with hateful rhetoric rise to the front page.

A major point to this thread.

I don't know how many more "RITO IS TRASH BECAUSE LeeSin" threads I can take on the front page

dunder kill14 votes

"DID SOMEONE SAY LeeSin?! GET THE PITCHFORKS BOYS! ITS TIME FOR A LYNCHMOB!"

Cowseed4 votes

^^^^^ More tired of seeing him on boards than in game to be honest.

undesirable team10 votes

tyler1 would be unbanned hehe xd

Kirius Dark8 votes

They really need to implement this into the rotating game mode as PLAYER'S CHOICE game mode that comes once a month with totally fucked up changes from scrub level mass bandwagoning QQs, then after playing will see how stupid many of those whines are and that something else will come to the top as the main champs/picks/skills to cry over

Also they need to implement spam pings of "HEY JG FUCKING HELP ME RIGHT NOW" for whichever lane pings the hardest gets the jungle champ automatically teleported to them to gank because nothing else the jungler does matters except for helping your lane

Volibear Boss6 votes

We need a extra server where the game is balanced around what the boards say. I would play rather on a server with only 50 champions that has more champion pick diversity than on one with 130+ champions and you always see the same 20.

Edit: i was joking

Volphi8 votes

[deleted]

DarkSunSovereign21 votes

The mexicans.

Eedat5 votes

Fake news

Nik Nikerson6 votes

ADCs automatically lose all 1v1s by default.

Except against tanky characters, because they should do no damage, and it's outrageous that they should be able to kill an adc 1v1, even if the adc is three levels behind and shouldn't allow the tank to get into melee range and remain in melee range long enough to kill a squishy target.

Tobias Brackner5 votes

I never realized how sick it would be if Morde had 3 dashes and 400 base move speed.

TimX24968B1 votes

he might have a chance of being viable then.

Tobias Brackner3 votes

Nah he's still viable. Hell he was viable when they first reworked him.

dunder kill3 votes

He was game-warping OP when they first reworked him lol

Ahristocats6 votes

he's already viable

Who is Taliyah5 votes

At least Taliyah would finally get an indicator that shows when her Q worked ground ends.

ChargeItDownMid3 votes

[deleted]

TEA Nietzsche 1 votes

{quoted}

Honestly, the game would probably be more balanced for high elo and pro play if the board had their way (although low elo would probably be a complete shit show).

Really? I always had the impression that the boards want to balance around low elo and especially not pro play. Remember all these Shen buff and Yasuo nerf threads?

ChargeItDownMid1 votes

[deleted]

TEA Nietzsche 2 votes

Sure, but those who bother to bring up statistics are not in the majority. Just think of the numerous Shen buff threads, they were certainly coming from a low elo perspective. Then there have also been a few Tryndamere nerf threads, all these Lee Sin threads where people complain that he'd be easy to play and all the matchmaking complaints show a clear low elo bias aswell.

When it comes to actually super OP champions like Ivern/Lulu the boards tend to take quite a while - while the Yasuo complaints are just a constant stream that won't stop even when he is actually weak.

ChargeItDownMid1 votes

[deleted]

TEA Nietzsche 1 votes

{quoted}

Again, you are confusing the champions with the most topics with what the board consensus on a champion is. The consensus on shen was that he needed the nerfs due to lcs even though there were 1-2 people spamming shen topics (and honestly, where are you getting the numerous shen topics? He is not a hot topic by any measure). The consensus on lee sin and yasuo is that there is no consensus and there are people making topics both for and against nerfing those two champions.

I really don't see how you'd judge the board consensus on a champion then. Also, I am pretty damn sure that the "consensus" was that he most definetely did not need the nerfs: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/3jsu1IoU-so-riot-you-actually-are-going-to-live-with-these-shen-changes

The overwhelming majority of the boards has been wanting Yasuo and Lee nerfs for basically.. Nearly all their existence? Honestly, I can't see how anyone would even attempt to deny that.

Remember, we aren't talking about buffing or nerfing based on the number of topics any given champion has, one person could just spam 100 topics about any random champion being overpowered and still not represent the opinion of the majority of the boards. The board consensus is far stronger on champions like ivern and lulu than it is on yasuo or lee sin.

But if these threads were to regularly reach the front page while comments that disagree get downvoted.. That is very indicative of the opinion of the majority.

Also, the number of people who immediately bring up statistics from plat, diamond, and lcs are hardly a minority on the forums. Those statistics are brought up multiple times in almost every discussion topic (and they have been brought up far more than nerf trynd or buff shen topics).

Yes, statistics get brought up very often but they do also get downvoted very often unless it's the pure playrate of certain champions on champion.gg And while there is usually someone arguing with statistics in every thread they do often get downvoted without any response while it's always comments like "Yasuo xx% playrate" that are at the top.

Lastly, where do you get the sense that the lee sin threads are in anyway fueled by low elo players? He has always been a significantly larger problem in lcs and high elo than he has been in low elo. The people defending lee sin on average are at a much lower elo than the people asking for nerfs. Hell the vast majority of the champions that are discussed are champions that are a large problem in high elo or lcs. Trynd topics are far and few between in comparison and shot down immediately.

That wasn't my point, I quote: "Lee Sin threads where people complain that he'd be easy to play" Saying that Lee Sin is easy to play is a typical low elo notion - I was not talking about strength. And this notion is constantly upvoted to the top on the boards.

ChargeItDownMid1 votes

[deleted]

TEA Nietzsche 1 votes

Lee sin being easy is a high elo notion. In low elo, champions like master yi and shyvanna are considered easier to play than champions like lee sin and Elise. In high, elo conversely, lee sin and Elise are considered easier to play than master to or shyvanna.

Oh no, you confuse champion strength with champion difficulty. Imagine we'd live in a world were Garen just got nerfed and Azir just got buffed: sure, Azir may be much stronger than Garen and maybe even beginners might perform better with him than with Garen, simply because Azir is stronger. But with that being said, making the most of Azir's kit is still exponentially harder than with Garen, regardless of how strong Azir is.

In high elo it's probably easier to succeed with Lee Sin (in the long run) than with Shyvana - but fully using Lee's kit is still much harder than fully using Shyvana's. When people on the boards complain about Lee Sin they imply that using his kit is very easy by saying "R-Q-Q and enemy donezo" which is something every pro player would disagree with, as Lee Sin is undoubtedly difficult.

The thing about Lee sin and yasuo topics is that those topics are never unanimous, there are always people on both sides of the argument. This is not the case for ivern or lulu, the topics never reach the front page because there is no dispute.

There is no unanimous topic, there are people who defend Ivern aswell. You can't define consense on the boards as everyone agrees, that's just impossible. That's why I am talking about the overwhelming majority - and the overwhelming majority wants Yasuo and Lee Sin nerfed, even back when they were not that strong (s6 Lee, Yasuo up to recently).

Finally, you have to realize that a topic reaching the front page has nothing to do with how many people agree with the comments. If anything, the fact that there is enough discussion for a topic to reach the front means that there is a dispute on the topic.

Are you aware of how echo chambers work? Why do you think we see this typical 100+ upvote "PSA: Wards are important" topic? Simply because it doesn't get downvoted at the start (which would kill it) and gets upvoted by everyone.

ChargeItDownMid1 votes

[deleted]

TEA Nietzsche 1 votes

{quoted}

You basically answered the problem yourself in the bolded statements. When people say that lee sin is easy to play, they specifically mean that he is easy to climb the ladder with. This is because lee sin has so much in his kit that all a player needs to do is use a fraction of its power to do well. As a result, he is widely considered easy to play in high elo.

Firstly, they clearly do not, most genuinely think that his combo's are easy to pull off (as I already mentioned). Secondly, he is not especially easy to climb the ladder with, as any statistics page proves. And whenever I see a Lee Sin they usually have a pretty shitty winrate. And I've never seen a pro call Lee Sin easy, they always say that he is "good for carrying" - but that's completely different from what those boards people are arguing.

Compared to lee sin and yasuo, there is a far clearer consensus on ivern being broken. There is a much higher% of players who believe ivern and lulu should be nerfed now than yasuo and lee sin. Even at the height of lee and yasuo hate, there were always dozens of people defending those two champions.

But the majority would prefer Yasuo/Lee nerfs over Ivern/Lulu nerfs - the small minority that does the defending is irrelevant for what the majority thinks.

You are getting volume and percentage mixed up. There is a higher volume of people posting about lee sin and yasuo specifically because there isn't an agreement on those two champions.

Pure speculation. Your argumentation evades anything measurable.

How are ward topics at all relavent? Those are PSA topics for new players and far rarer than topics about any of the champions we are discussing.

Don't miss the point. You know very well what I was referring to when I was talking about circlejerks.

Sire Hippington3 votes

To be honest, that doesn't even sound that bad. Everything would be gutted so in the end, we come out some what even just with a great decreas in overall power. It's revers powercreep, which really sounds like something we could use right now.

Do you honestly think a game thats kept millions of players hooked for years is complete shit?

No, it's still a solid game. But it used to be an amazing game, and atleast for me and every single person i know it has become alot worse eve since S5, and especially the S6 changes tunred it from our go to game that we enjoyed on a daylie bases to a solid game we play from time to time and by now it's barly more than the shade of a game that we sometimes play for nostalgic reason while complaing about it's current state. The issue is not that it's a bad game, but that it's a worse game than it once was, that it's way behind it's potential.

TimX24968B5 votes

sir, that is a process called "aging", and nostalgia starting to kick in.

Unpaladin1 votes

Season 5 really wasn't that long ago

TimX24968B3 votes

I've seen alot of complaints about the league community and certain seasons ruining things for them.

Reminds me of world of warcraft: "no, wrath of the lich king ruined wow" "no, cataclysm ruined wow" "no, mists of pandaria ruined wow" etc.

Except their playerbase was crumbling. League's isn't.

2 years ago. Alot of the game has changed since then, and its more likely that you have just found another game and gotten bored with this game in general, too.

Unpaladin4 votes

Nah. You can ask plenty of folks and they'd tell you Riot went crazy with making games shorter during Season 6 and took an odd approach to weighing their balance decisions. It's entirely reasonable to critique Riot on what they did after Season 5 because it's just so different from the rest.

It was a honestly a total disaster, taking them up to Season 7 to address the crushing imbalance that they put up themselves. Roster reworks pretty much took off at that point, which are the biggest thing to warp the game period.

Not sure why people bring up playerbase fluctuations, this game will gain attention no matter what. A controversial storm would hardly dent it.

Also Season 5 really wasn't that long ago famalam, are you trying to tell me it is?

Eedat2 votes

You can ask plenty of folks and they'd tell you Riot went crazy with making games shorter during Season 6

Well since you asked,

Thats because we begged them to make them shorter. Not too long ago there was that meta that I like to call "League of Waveclear" where matches consisted of a combination of Ziggs/Xerath/Anivia on opposing teams waveclearing at each other turtled under towers for 50 minutes until everyone was full build. People bitched that it was impossible to close out a game and begged Riot to make games shorter.

As far as this season goes, average games times are actually longer than season 6.

You dont have to take my word for it. Check for yourself here.

Khelb3 votes

I'll jump on board for this. I still love this game and probably always will <3 u rito

Aeszarck3 votes

I'm really glad you wrote this out. There aren't nearly enough positive posts in Gameplay. I agree, I think Riot's balance is by no means perfect but it isn't terrible either. Considering how many variables there are just on one Champion, not even considering buffs or items or teammates, it's amazing that this game has so Champions that are close to 50% winrate, or at least close to their balanced winrate if that's not 50% (because of a high skill floor). It's so hard to determine what to nerf and how to nerf it to keep the Champion healthy. Like, if Riot saw that Zed was overperforming and decided to cut away 300 base health in return for 40 base attack damage, that would be stupidly unhealthy, even if it were somehow a way to get Zed back to a balanced state. Riot has to toy with all these different variables like base health regeneration, attack speed on items, base damage per level, and more, and by toying with them, they need to make their Champions fun to play and relatively fun to play against, and that is no easy job. Almost nobody on the Boards has any real clue on how to do it, at least consistently.

I think that we all on the Boards in fact love Riot's game, even if we keep it to ourselves, which is why we're so passionate about getting it perfect, but I think in that passion we can forget why we are so passionate in the first place. League of Legends is a great game, and while it can always be improved, sometimes we need to thank those who made it so.

Lord Desert2 votes

The thing is the 1%, or to be more realistic the 0.001%, of post that actually would improve the overall game are completely ignored... But things like "nurf this, broken that, weak af something else" are ALWAYS in the top spots.

There should be something like a "technical/advanced" icon for posts/wall of texts that go the extra mile and accutally analyse the problem and present possible solutions!

Segius2 votes

Great post! +1

Rengooo2 votes

Rengars ult would tell you from half the map away when he is coming... wait..

Shit.

InivtesPreeze1 votes

Point click CC needs to be nerfed to the ground.

deadlychuck2 votes

No, riot just needs to stop putting so much stock into mobility.

InivtesPreeze1 votes

mobility creep has gone off the rails

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