Azir: Thoughts and Discussion

Stacona··4 votes·664 views

Let's get into general things with Azir first:

~ Azir has a lot of fluff about him, and I am not talking about his feathers, we need to reduce/remove what he doesn't need and really focus in to what makes Azir, well, Azir; i.e. building turrets, sand soldiers, walls, and an easier to use "shurima shuffle" for ALL skill brackets and not just high elo. That last example being crucial to help balance Azir to not be trash in low elo and god tier in high elo/competitive play like he has been in the past / still is now to some degree.

~ As a very high damage hyper marksmage (he is a spell weaver, but his damage is from basic attacks because of the soldiers) he should probably not be so mobile. What I am thinking is remove a dash from the base kit and allow him to choose to dash before his ultimate on the ultimate cooldown. This allows for an easy time for low skill players to do the shurima shuffle simply by holding down R to fly for a duration or upon skill release that then releases the wall of soldiers, or just tap the R key for the wall of soldiers like how it works now; flight would be an always motion thing that follows the mouse cursor, with the dash still stopping upon hitting an enemy champion (so need to fly AROUND everyone for the high-risk and high-reward play).

~ As far as the base kit goes, we need to see what he needs and does not need, taking away the fluff that he has and really focus for his damage to be on the sustain damage of sand soldiers rather than feeling bursty at all. What I am thinking is something like remove the slow on Q, reduce the damage, and emphasize it even harder for soldier repositioning with an even bigger cooldown per rank reduction; the damage reduced will be moved to the soldiers' stab damage to have his damage over time and less upfront.

~ His shield should scale with ability power and not bonus health, this scaling never made any sense especially for a squishy mage. Instead of a dash Azir's soldiers will slow enemies on-hit while the shield still holds, so the slow is removed after the shield duration ends or the shield is broken (similar to Janna's shield mechanic). Reason for a slow here is because if Azir feels really Rylai's dependent then it makes more sense to give him some kind of persistent slow on his kit, this way it is also easier to balance on an individual champion level if it needs to be made weaker or stronger and you cannot do that as an item since it would effect all the other Rylai's users.

~ Of course aim to have a champion fun to play as and not frustrating to play against.

~ Just to really confirm something, Azir's tower building is super unique to him and something that should always stay on his kit.


EXAMPLE KIT BELOW! NUMBERS ARE VERY TENTATIVE AND ONLY THERE TO SHOWCASE A BETTER EXAMPLE OF ON-PAPER IDEAS, DO NOT TAKE NUMBERS SERIOUSLY AT ALL!


Base Attack Speed: 0.644 +2.5% [from 0.625 +1.5%; just emphasize more on his AAing sustain damage ways]


Shurima's Legacy (Passive): Static Cooldown: 180 seconds Azir places a marker above the ruins of all destroyed turrets outside the enemy base.

Disc of the Sun: Azir raises the Sun Disc from the selected marked ruins after a brief delay. The Sun Disc functions like a standard turret but gains (+15%AP) bonus attack damage. It also grants Azir any gold it earns. The Sun Disc loses health over 1 minute and loses its armor if Azir dies or moves too far away.

Conquering Sands (Q): Cooldown: 10/8.5/7/5.5/4 seconds; Cost: 40 mana; Range: 900 units Passive: Azir permanently gains 15/20/25/30/35% bonus attack speed.

Active: Azir orders all Sand Soldiers to dash to the target location, dealing 70/80/90/100/110(+40%AP) magic damage to enemies they pass through.

Arise! (W): Cooldown: 1 second; Cost: 40 mana + 1 Sand Soldier; Range: 500 units Passive: Azir stores a Sand Soldier every 10/9/8/7/6 seconds, up to a maximum of 3 [from 2] at a time.

Active: Azir summons an untargetable Sand Soldier to the target location for 9 seconds that replaces his basic attack to command the soldier to attack enemies within range, dealing 60/85/110/135/160(+60%AP) magic damage to enemies that they pierce, applying any on-hit effects Azir has.

Multiple Sand Soldiers beyond the first attacking the same target deal 25% damage.

Royal Guard (E): Cooldown: 14/13/12/11/10 seconds; Cost: 70 mana + 1 Sand Soldier Azir consumes a stored up Sand Soldier causing it to shield himself for 90/110/130/150/170(+80%AP) shield for 5 seconds and causing the attacks of Sand Soldiers to slow down struck enemies by 10/20/30/40/50% for 1.5 seconds while the shield still holds.

Emperor's Divide (R): Cooldown: 140/120/100 seconds; Cost: 100 mana Hold Down Skill Key: Azir dashes towards the mouse cursor for up to 2 seconds, stopping upon hitting an enemy champion or letting go of the skill key.

Upon Skill Key Release: Azir summons a charge of 4/5/6 soldiers in the direction that he is currently facing knocking back struck enemies and dealing 150/225/300(+70%AP) magic damage. This wall of soldiers remain in play for the next 3 seconds that stop enemy dashes on contact.


(Two big changes I did with the Sand Soldier damage:) (1. Scales with Arise! rank rather than per level so you are not getting soldier damage when maxing Q.) (2. Implement on-hit damage to soldier stabs, makes Nashor's Tooth that much better with its passive being used all the time. This is worth testing out at the very least.)

11 Comments

Vęrtęx7 votes

You just made his kit more overloaded it looks like. Still has turret, free dash with ult to anywhere (enemy could tell you were gonna have to dash to a soldier and left him completely vulnerable after combo because he had to use everything in his kit to shuffle now you're just pressing r, holding down for the ult would feel clunky because it's not instant when you want to dash with ult, free shield and a free rylais when toggled on. His kit needs things taken away not added

Stacona1 votes

He is way more immobile and less safe because his dash is only attached to his ultimate, so he becomes gankable, I also gutted his burst damage to focus in on soldier's sustain damage. Now his kit revolves around ordering soldiers around. When you have a sustain damage kit you need either a shield or heal to keep you alive since your damage is over time rather than in the first few seconds.

He definitely has power taken away and focused entirely around his soldiers with shurima shuffle being easier to use for everyone to have it easier to balance in the future.

Ultimate is tap to use it exactly like how it is now, hold to dash towards the mouse cursor (constantly updates movement), as soon as you let go of the hotkey the soldiers come flying out in the direction Azir faces. It won't be clunky at all, you probably won't be able to Flash ult anymore but that is for the better honestly.


The probably with Azir's E is not him having a shield, it is him having an always available dash, and his slow is moved to his E as its second utility (all the ability shields in the game have something else to go with them and are never just a shield, the second portion could simple just be that fact that it is an AoE shield as well).

With the dash removed Azir is a lot more gank-able, especially pre-6, and his soldiers being linked to ability rank and not per level also helps shave off fluff. The aim was make him easier for low skill player and less tools for high skill play, so his win rate is dropped in high elo and raised in low elo making it easier to balance Azir for the long term so we don't have an extreme of super dominant in one area and shit tier in another area.


Also I think people would be upset if you got rid of his tower building passive and soldier wall since they are so unique to Azir. Again, the removal of his on-demand dash will make him feel like an appropriate immobile hyper marksmage and have a proper weakness to kill an Azir that miss positions.

Also the charges being 3 instead 2 and E consuming a charge for its cost makes it an option to go all out in raw damage with all your soldiers on the field at a time, but expose yourself with no slow to help the soldiers get off attacks and no shield to keep yourself alive. It will allow for cool decision making and trade-off scenarios that he currently does not have.

Vęrtęx1 votes

I assume you have seen my post but I will restate what I want from the rework. The turret offers more in pro play, it is situational, and it is noninteractive in regards to the player controlling it. The new passive could be the attack speed passive from his w. Azir should be rewarded or punished based upon if he is autoing his enemy with his soldiers. Q damage should be gutted to be a repositioning tool and his soldiers autos should get more power due to the q nerf. If Azir hits an enemy with a soldier auto, part of the q cd is refunded everytime the soldiers auto ( can't get 2 refunds for 2 soldiers hitting at once, only 1 refund per auto) if he can't auto then he can't reposition his soldiers to do damage. Another interesting reward would be for him to gain a small ms buff when a soldier lands an auto on an enemy champion in order to duel by dodging spells and kite as any DPS mage has ways of kiting. What do you think of that?

Vęrtęx1 votes

One more thing I have to say is why should he be reworked to be easier? The only thing that needs to be balanced is the level he can play at when mastered. Azir is a fun champ because he is a complex champion that rewards time and dedication. That is one of the biggest reasons he is my favorite champion. It is not the reason he is being reworked. It is because he has so much utility with turret, wall, q slow. He has burst poke with DPS which is an unhealthy combo. You can leave the mobility of his e if you transform him into a DPS mage without the burst poke and extra utility.

Stacona1 votes

He needs to be easier for players and be able to be played at higher pings so that his win rate balances out a bit and not be awful for the majourity of player and be god tier for the 1%.

He will never come to the point of being the easiest champion ever, he will still retain his difficulty to play with how soldiers function and move only with Q, plus Azir has a greater emphasis on proper positioning with his on-demand dash removed.


There is no possible way to have this high damage hyper marksmage be balanced with an on-demand dash, he has to have a meaningful weakness with all of his power and utility and removing his on-demand dash is the way to do that. Now suddenly his power makes sense and is more fair and balanced being classified as an immobile mage, but still can shurima shuffle that is fully implemented into the kit and can work on high ping in low elo games.

Shurima shuffle is so strong it has to be either removed completely or allowed for even low skilled/high ping players to be able to do it consistently, this allows Riot to easily balance the high-risk and high-reward play in the future. I am sure players and Riot would want to see it kept in for Azir so it is better to have it easily accessible to everyone and then be able to balance it easily enough for the future in patches.

Stacona1 votes

Q cd on soldier autos is impossible to balance, it will be an extreme feast or famine element. If Azir can auto you then you are screwed until your death, if he cannot auto you then Azir is screwed until his own death.

Also Azir's problem now is giving him mobility, we need to remove mobility not give him more, the mobility is where most of his fluff is at.

Vęrtęx1 votes

What you are saying does not make sense because their are many champions like this. First one that comes to mind is Cassiopeia. Her q is feast or famine. She gains mobility from her q to kite like Azir would with the soldiers autos. If she doesn't land q she can't do damage and kite yet you are saying that would be impossible to balance. What fluff????? He has one mobility spell with a long cooldown knock up ult and a barely noticeable slow on his q. So one dash and a knockup to defend himself is nothing. No one ever gets frustrated with Azir's mobility because he has one spell to do that and then he's a sitting duck. Your opinions seem to make me think you do not play Azir or are even familiar with ins and outs of mid laners.

Vęrtęx1 votes

I stand correct you have no games on Azir.

Asayake 5150glow1 votes

Q needs to lose all of it's burst so Azir can no longer burst people, same with R.

Giving Q and W low CD's completely destroys his main form of counterplay, which is avoid soldiers. I like the loss of the slow on Q - not liking the slow on E. Azir's already got massive range, a slow is just redundant.

Shield is a little strong, generally don't wanna give long range hypercarries great defenses.

Q's mana cost is incredibly low, meaning it'll be spammable as hell. However, reliability is something that should never be said about Azir's DPS, as his counterplay is avoiding the soldiers, which a low CD Q just doesn't let you do.

Although it would mean less sick plays by Azir, I think his R should start from in front of him instead of behind him. As a long range hypercarry, if Azir ends up behind his targets, something is wrong. Instead I think his R should just be reworked - it's a unique skill... except that it isn't, really. Mostly what it does is prevent the enemy front line from getting to you. I think the wall itself should be reworked.

Stacona1 votes

The problem without a slow on his kit its too hard for him to get in consecutive hits with the soldiers after they charge on in. Since we are working Azir into sustain damage he needs ways for the soldiers can actually output damage, the slow breaks if the shield breaks as well.

Numbers are irrelevant, still isn't that strong and should be focused on its AP ratio.

Less damage, no slow, probably should have less mana. His damage should not be unreliable, it just shouldn't be bursty.

His ultimate damage isn't that high, and long cooldown ultimate should deal some kind of damage with them in this regard. His wall and passive make sense for Azir, he is an emperor and things need to fight for him and protect him. If anything we remove the dash altogether and have Azir strictly an immobile emperor that uses his troops to do all the work for him, I just felt people really wanted Shurima Shuffle (the play making makes zero sense for an emperor theme however).


So I keep the wall of soldiers regardless for Azir, too required for playstyle and theme. So the decision is if we want to keep the option to play make at all, if we want to go all out on the emperor theme then we just remove the dash outright instead of only removing the on-demand dash.

Asayake 5150glow1 votes

{quoted}

The problem without a slow on his kit its too hard for him to get in consecutive hits with the soldiers after they charge on in. Since we are working Azir into sustain damage he needs ways for the soldiers can actually output damage, the slow breaks if the shield breaks as well.

Well if you opponent is moving to stay out of soldier range, they're effectively both silenced and blinded (for many spells, in terms of damage done) unless the spell is a dash. If they kite with autos or spells, that gives you more time to hit them.

Numbers are irrelevant, still isn't that strong and should be focused on its AP ratio.

Azir Q does a decent chunk of damage, it's part of why Azir's burst is still very good.

Less damage, no slow, probably should have less mana. His damage should not be unreliable, it just shouldn't be bursty.

Of course it should be unreliable, otherwise he would just able to attack everything within ~900 range. The unreliability comes from enemies leaving the range of your soldiers. If you're good, you'll hold Q to reposition and kite with W spawns as well, instead of spamming Q for burst and repositioning.

His ultimate damage isn't that high, and long cooldown ultimate should deal some kind of damage with them in this regard. His wall and passive make sense for Azir, he is an emperor and things need to fight for him and protect him. If anything we remove the dash altogether and have Azir strictly an immobile emperor that uses his troops to do all the work for him, I just felt people really wanted Shurima Shuffle (the play making makes zero sense for an emperor theme however).

So just keep the knockback. The wall is just shit to play against and is always gonna make Azir extremely strong in high elo. Something that completely denies bruiser/tank access to your back line even if your own front line isn't there? That's so good.

Plus Azir has a lot of burst, and a good portion of it comes from his Q and R. His DPS is insane enough that I feel he doesn't really need damage on his R - I mean, it's already a really powerful utility spell (AoE displacement!)

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