Average AP per item

RocketRelm·Apr 8, 2016·26 votes·1,664 views

Is it just me, or is the average AP of competed items sinking?

I remember when 'Top Tier max AP' item was 120. This tier is now occupied solely by Deathcap and 'occasionally' Seraphs Embrace (Factoring in changes here).

Now, it seems 80 AP is the new "Standard" for AP items, and even 100 AP on an item will be a rarity (Ludens, Rylais, RoA at full stacks). Not all champions want Rylais, or to first item rush RoA, or are poke oriented for Ludens. It won't be uncommon for champions to be unsuited for more than 1 of these items optimally.

Presuming one of the above 100s, Deathcap, and 3 80 AP items, the new Expected Max AP is… 621. Huh.

I guess Jhin'll get to taunt "I have more AD than you have AP." now.

25 Comments

Very Hard EngageApr 8, 20169 votes

just re release DFG, give it a new active if they have to. 120AP and 10% CDR was huge for mages who wanted to deal magic damage for a team.

ShadragonApr 9, 20166 votes

AP Ratios are lower than AD ratios, and yet AP is becoming harder and harder to get in large amounts. Meanwhile AD is becoming easier to stack than ever before.

Honestly I don't get why it's ok for an AD champion to get a total AD ratio of 6.10, but your average AP champion gets a ratio more like 2.90. It's ridiculous.

Weasel KenseiApr 9, 20162 votes

Iv been saying for a while, the balance team is biased toward AD. They dont like mages, they like AD champs.

There is no "getting it" you just have to realized "balance" isnt the goal, they want the game/champs to play the way THEY LIKE over some notion of balance.

yoniameApr 8, 20163 votes

full stack ROA gives 120 ap, but yeah,, reaching 75ad items is a lot easier and have bigger variation than 120ap items, also have no requiriments, and masteries give a lot less ap than last season, We need another 100+ ap item even if it has some special circumstances or a hard to use passive (I'd like to say a counter part to item 3147 , but drakhar and all max ad items have strong passives, but it would be enough for the new item to just give ap and a lowscaling side stat , like 10%cdr, +mana or hp rege, or sthing)

LeeerzeichenApr 8, 201621 votes

ROA looses 20 ap with the mage item rework

yoniameApr 8, 201614 votes

oh crap, why they want to ruin mages so much? Overall they are already the hardest to play, have extremely gold ineffecient items, and they are now a lot weaker than adcs/fighters even in their specialities (late game team fight nuking and kiting). I just want dfg back along with low cd trinkets and mana pot.

Vistha KaiApr 9, 20163 votes

RoA won't be a mage item once the Midseason Update rolls out.

It will be an AP tank/bruiser item. Think Nautilus and Sejuani.

SerBlaiseApr 8, 20162 votes

I believe it is reverting to where it used to be a season or so ago...

WolfBVApr 9, 20161 votes

Bruh I just thought of something.

Name 80-120 AP Cost Passive: When taking damage that would result in death, grant a shield equal to (% of your ap). Cooldown 90 seconds(can be changed)

yoniameApr 9, 20161 votes

would be too op on some champions and too weak on others. I'd rather recommend something like this: price 3300 90 ap Stacks give 1 ap, reaching max stack (15) gives +5% ap and armor based on champion lvl Can get stacks from getting epic monster buffs assists and kills.

yoniameApr 9, 20161 votes

or 100 ap +20% cdr +60 armor

Oerba No NajaApr 8, 20163 votes

i miss s4 , when i could have 850 ap late game as a Syndra i was able to one shot squishys

MarshbouyApr 8, 20163 votes

thats unhealthy gameplay but a miss fortune can kill you in 3 autos...

YumaS2AstralApr 9, 20162 votes

{quoted}

thats unhealthy gameplay but a miss fortune can kill you in 3 autos...

One-shotting late game by itself is not unhealthy at all. The problem is when you are able to do it very early even when you are not fed.

MarshbouyApr 9, 20161 votes

*at 20 minutes into the game (she was only 3/2)

Vistha KaiApr 9, 20163 votes

That was a joke.

An ADC can oneshot a squish, but god forbid an AP does that.

yoniameApr 10, 20162 votes

who needs autos, 2 bf+an ulti=free penta

TalinisApr 9, 20162 votes

Zhonya's is a 100% garbage item now. Average AP for a pitiful amount of armor that does nothing vs ADs, worthless amount of CDR (there is SO much cdr on everything else, you'll overcap) and a double edged sword active (no damage but you can't move or do anything either) with a very high cost. Meanwhile, ADs can double up with MAW and Scimitar and hexdrinker is VERY powerful in lane, shutting down any low range burst mages.

There are too few AP items for AP champions. IF they want to reduce AP items than they need to increase low range burst champions and melee assassins AP scalings to compensate as they rely on a high AP count to do anything as APs have VERY few defensive options compared to ADs. These changes are horrible as they buff long range pokers who can spam abilities all day and now get healing like nidalees while the champions who have very low range and were already much less useful in a siege get nerfed as any return trades now get healed up from and of course from the lesser AP values already mentioned.

yoniameApr 10, 20161 votes

Even with fully stacked item 3041 many of the mages are still at a bad spot

ViashinoWizardApr 9, 20161 votes

They've already acknowledged this and said they're planning to put some more AP in.

Arakk01Apr 9, 20161 votes

The drastic difference here is that at the end of the post, two of the top MR items have become weaker. item 3102 item 3065 are both 'oh crap, <mage> is getting fed, time to shut them down!' items. Spirit Visage is now slightly less one of those items, while Banshee's and its build path have both become more expensive and less efficient, not to mention weaker (the value on BV passive being raised somewhere toward where Zhonyas currently is).

Weasel KenseiApr 9, 20162 votes

{quoted}

The drastic difference here is that at the end of the post, two of the top MR items have become weaker. are both 'oh crap, <mage> is getting fed, time to shut them down!' items. Spirit Visage is now slightly less one of those items, while Banshee's and its build path have both become more expensive and less efficient, not to mention weaker (the value on BV passive being raised somewhere toward where Zhonyas currently is).

not sure why this is getting downvotes...

Its true those are being reduced, and maw was nerfed a bit just recently.

The main problem I have so far with the released item specs is the nerf to mana regen. They just have a hate on for mana champs. I could almost understnad this if they were INCREASING AP on items with a "You wont be able to spam as much, but what you do cast will hurt like hell."

Instead were getting mages mana treated like some mana users got together and peed in the balance teams soda as kids and made them drink it, and now theyre out to get back at all mana users.

Some toning down on the major MR items will help, but with less AP and less spamability on mages, they will have to hit more than they do now, and will have to back more often from going oom because of the combination of mana regen nerf and AP reducing.

Arakk01Apr 9, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Weasel Kensei,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AlAGb2Wb,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2016-04-09T16:51:08.270+0000)

not sure why this is getting downvotes...

Its true those are being reduced, and maw was nerfed a bit just recently.

The main problem I have so far with the released item specs is the nerf to mana regen. They just have a hate on for mana champs. I could almost understnad this if they were INCREASING AP on items with a "You wont be able to spam as much, but what you do cast will hurt like hell."

Instead were getting mages mana treated like some mana users got together and peed in the balance teams soda as kids and made them drink it, and now theyre out to get back at all mana users.

Some toning down on the major MR items will help, but with less AP and less spamability on mages, they will have to hit more than they do now, and will have to back more often from going oom because of the combination of mana regen nerf and AP reducing.

Not at all. On average, Mages already have higher base values than AD champions and more flat penetration available to them. The higher scaling via AP is to compensate them for the fact that they don't push towers as hard. The thing is, since mages also usually pack CC, both of these nerfs make it easier for a mage to play from behind- as do the changes to mana regen.

yoniameApr 10, 20161 votes

most mages have 2 cc, a soft cc, and a hard cc adcs have range, higher scaling, mobility, tankiness, better self heal (warlord/lifesteal), attack speed, more easily avaiable cd, more mastery options, and more gold effecient items. They often also have cc. Overall the problem is with itemization and new mastery system.