Nerfs in the past have straight gutted their jungle and frankly the planned changes being done for preseason don't look like they address the problem that riot created, it was one of the many times you made target nerfs to their tanky builds and ended up hitting the AP builds harder.
Marshbouy2 votesThey aren't meant to be junglers. Riot will probably not buff their jungle.
Shadow Hazard1 votesVi wasn't originally meant to be a jungler, Mord was famously made for bot lane, I doubt sion was intended to be so dominant in support. Saying a champ wasn't meant to be in a role when it is showing viable performance in a role for most of the season (and not broken before the nerfs dropped) is a poor mindset.
Marshbouy2 votesVi just functioned better in the jungle. Mordekaiser is just cheesing the jungle camps and doesn't have a good position to be in anymore, sion support is literally nonexistent. Just because 100 people are good at sion support doesn't mean that it's actually viable.
Ekko and fizz jungle were just cheesy ways of abusing a champion.
Shadow Hazard2 votesthey could have simply kept nerfing/changing vi till she was pushed into lane but they didn't. i wasn't even calling mord out for his jungle only but every role but bot lane roles. sion may have a small play rate in support but it is clearly enough to register on stat sites. Fizz and ekko were not cheese junglers, they filled a similar niche that diana (another lane designed champ that jungles) fills.
Penns1 votesWell I suppose Vi jungle was better than lane Vi, so they didnt change it. But jungle Fizz is already kind of trash, at least looking at win rates.
Shadow Hazard1 votesit wasn't trash before, though, not a freelo pub stomper, but not trash.
Erockandroll1 votes[{quoted}](name=Shadow Hazard,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AdqevqV8,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2016-11-06T21:00:21.920+0000)
they could have simply kept nerfing/changing vi till she was pushed into lane but they didn't. i wasn't even calling mord out for his jungle only but every role but bot lane roles. sion may have a small play rate in support but it is clearly enough to register on stat sites. Fizz and ekko were not cheese junglers, they filled a similar niche that diana (another lane designed champ that jungles) fills.
They filled a Niche, but they were not Niche enough.
But seriously though, Diana was designed to jungle, People found that her kit worked better in the mid lane. Riot was forced to balance around the most powerful build, and their isn't enough of a difference to balance both positions at the same time. (Without taking a short cut, like Increased damage to monsters.) Lastly, I'm not even sure what NICHE Fizz or Ekko would fill simply going Jungle, they basically offer the same tools to the team regardless of where they go. It's not like a change of position significantly impacts their play style.
yeah.. although frankly when i asked if riot even planned on making
viable in the lanes again instead of JUST jungle. i DID get an answer from Riot.. it was "No"
so sometimes it is better to not know hope someday they will let it happen again. rather than hear them say "no"
Any Idea what that would actually require? Cause when She was initially reworked, Riot struggled to get her in a Healthy spot, regardless of whether she was building AP Assassin or AD Bruiser. Yet when they allowed her passive to work on Jungle monsters, it gave her a niche that was easier to balance, and fit her Fantasy better.
And that inevitably gave her the opposite problem of Ekko, Diana and the others. They can't buff her lane build without breaking her Jungle build, suggesting that both those builds will end up being mutually exclusive.
SwiftKitten881 votes[{quoted}](name=Shadow Hazard,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AdqevqV8,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-11-06T20:43:55.246+0000)
Vi wasn't originally meant to be a jungler, Mord was famously made for bot lane, I doubt sion was intended to be so dominant in support. Saying a champ wasn't meant to be in a role when it is showing viable performance in a role for most of the season (and not broken before the nerfs dropped) is a poor mindset.
yeah.. although frankly when i asked if riot even planned on making viable in the lanes again instead of JUST jungle.
i DID get an answer from Riot.. it was "No"
so sometimes it is better to not know hope someday they will let it happen again. rather than hear them say "no"
Woook3r2 votesi will agree that a lot of the nerfs to tank ekko make ap ekko much harder to play. and some of the mage item changes, like the one to abyssal also hurt him a lot. Personally, I would like to see an interaction between his q and e. Or a reset on his e. Or both :)