LeBlanc: Thoughts and Discussion

Stacona··2 votes·595 views

First let's point out that the assassin update did not at all accomplish what it set to do, which was create all the of assassins unique elements outside of insane mobility and burst damage to kill their target as fast as possible, I don't think a game like league has healthy assassins when they are about insane mobility and damage (doesn't feel fair for the receiving end). So it would be better to do focused single larger changes on the assassins, one at a time, to really get down an unique identity that preserves their mobility of dipping and dodging in and out of fights, but not in the terms of raw damage (if they are about killing their target then it comes down to an arms race of which champions is better than the other, rather than a true reason to pick them).


What I see LeBlanc SHOULD be and is on a thematic level, but does not match her gameplay at all:

~ LeBlanc is an old lady that deceives everyone by looking like she is in her early 20s. LeBlanc should be more about deception and not brute forcing her way to a kill or zoning her opponent laner away indefinitely because of how strong she is.

~ LeBlanc should play on trickery with dipping and dodging in and out of fights and slowly chipping away at health bars, really has to think on a strategic level to take down her prey in a clever fashion, which does not evolving dashing or double dashing and maybe throwing a flash in their to come out of no where to go for the brute force one-shot. Yes, I am repeating myself here, but I really want to drill home the fact that LeBlanc does not play on her cool theme at all.

~ LeBlanc obviously needs better counter play when against her, this can lead to buffs for her on occasion if she is too weak rather than always nerfing her when PROPER counter play is set into motion - and no you cannot just factor into counter play for 1% of the population since the 99% is what gives Riot money, and they are more important to please and grant an enjoyable gameplay experience.

~ LeBlanc should be fun and rewarding to play as. This should be obvious, just wanted to put that out there. Also it is super easy to have LeBlanc be fun to play as since mobile champions are innately fun for the player, so the focus should be on making an experience that allows the opposition to have fun in that game since the LeBlanc player will be having fun.

~ LeBlanc's unique characteristic for her team would be the distraction (still would hold a good sum of damage, but not in the form of burst of any kind), which redefines assassins to be more than super mobile burst bots which takes away their damage for their super mobility and adds usefulness outside of damage in some form - LeBlanc can be the distraction mage-assassin, but this won't be every assassin's unique characteristic obviously.


BELOW IS A VERY ROUGH CONCEPT. BESIDES BEING A ROUGH CONCEPT, THE NUMBERS ARE FOR EXAMPLE PURPOSES ONLY AND DO NOT MEAN MUCH IN THE GRAND SCHEME OF THINGS AKA THE LONG TERM.

Mirror Image (Passive): Upon casting an ability, for the next 0.5 second the next movement command creates an identical clone of LeBlanc that moves to the mirrored target location. Clones last for up to 5 seconds.

Champion attacks or abilities that affect the clone will cause it to disappear and deal 10(+5 per level)(+20%AP) magic damage to the attacker.

Feint (Q): Cooldown: 9/7.5/6/4.5/3 seconds; Cost: 45/50/55/60/65 mana; Range: 500 units LeBlanc becomes hazy for 0.5 second causing enemy attacks and abilities to miss her for the duration and then pulses out magic around her dealing 60/80/100/120/140(+50%AP) magic damage.

If a Mirror Image or Irresistible was already currently active then LeBlanc can swap places with the target Mirror Image or Irresistible instead of becoming hazy, pulsing out magic around her upon arrival.

All Mirror Images and Irresistible in play will pulse out magic around them at half damage, only the greatest damage will apply against the same target.

Distortion / Return (W): Cooldown: 18/16/14/12/10 or 0 seconds; Cost: 80 or 20 mana; Range: 800 units Distortion: Leblanc dashes to the target location, leaving behind a stream of magic for the next 2.5 seconds. If LeBlanc returns during this time then the magic detonates dealing 90/120/150/180/210(+65%AP) magic damage to enemies on the magic.

Return: If LeBlanc dashed or teleported, excluding Return's teleport, in the last 2.5 seconds then she returns to her previous location. Return takes priority over Distortion if Distortion has yet to be cast.

Irresistible (E): Cooldown: 16/14.5/13/11.5/10 seconds; Cost: 70 mana; Range: 400 units 1st Cast: LeBlanc creates an irresistible copy of herself at her location for the next 2/2.25/2.5/2.75/3 seconds charming enemies that get near it for 1.5 seconds, 1.75 seconds for male champions.

2nd Cast: LeBlanc commands this clone to move to the target location.

Sigil of Malice (R): Cooldown: 5/4/3 seconds; Cost: 60 mana; Range: 750 units LeBlanc launches an orb of magic to the target enemy dealing 30/45/60(+30%AP) magic damage (300% damage vs non-champions), increasing to 120/180/240(+120%AP) magic damage against champions damaged by a Mirror Image in the last 1.5 seconds.


(Okay there is some burst left here, but the Sigil of Malice here is rewarding LeBlanc for tricking her opponents into attacking a Mirror Image and capitalizing on her successful deceit. Rather than brute forcing her way to a kill, she has to work for it and properly use her kit to deceive her foes!)

(Other change is returning from Distortion is no longer a free cost, but a low mana cost instead (casting Return will also trigger the passive to potentially spawn a Mirror Image), this is two different abilities since Return can trigger from swapping locations with a clone or using Distortion, which is why Return takes priority over Distortion. Distortion also does not deal damage with the initial pass anymore to delay its damage, instead creates essentially a line skill shot of where ever LeBlanc went to during the dash and then detonates if LeBlanc Returns to her previous location (the anchor will only be shown to LeBlanc for trickery, W gives away the location still with the magic).)

(Mirrored location would be there is a vertical line (like a line skill shot) from LeBlanc's location which acts as the "mirror" with wherever LeBlanc moves to the Mirror Image will walk to the same location but on the opposite side of the "mirror" so both always walk away from each other but either both towards or both away from your enemies [technically there is a way where you can move away and the clone moves semi-towards, you should get the point though]. E clone is fully controllable, initial spawn is where LeBlanc is standing, charm is towards the clone and not LeBlanc.)

18 Comments

DonatellaVersace3 votes

LeBlanc is an old lady that deceives everyone by looking like she is in her early 20s. LeBlanc should be more about deception and not brute forcing her way to a kill or zoning her opponent laner away indefinitely because of how strong she is.

Just to clear this up, LeBlanc isn't an old woman, rather a title passed down to those worthy within the Black Rose. The original LeBlanc used her magic to enclose herself within the mantle (The crown LeBlanc wears) so that when the next worthy leader is chosen, she manifests and takes control so she forever leads the Black Rose.

Stacona1 votes

LeBlanc is in her 40s to 50s, so more like middle aged woman and not exactly super old, and then makes herself look like she is in her early 20s

DonatellaVersace2 votes

{quoted}

LeBlanc is in her 40s to 50s, so more like middle aged woman and not exactly super old, and then makes herself look like she is in her early 20s

No she is not. Evaine, the current matron, was a young witch belonging to the Black Rose. LeBlanc, who was within a Evaine's predecessor, chose Evaine as the next matron since the host LeBlanc was in at the time was old and dying. The original LeBlanc's physical being is dead, but her spirit, which she placed within the mantle before she died, is still within the living realm. This can be clarified and confirmed within the journals of justice and LeBlanc's wiki page.

HalcyonDweller2 votes

I really like the concept, your rework idea seems pretty legit. I can see a lot of opportunities for trickery and fun with it. Interesting ideas, but it can get rather complex. Can you give some example spell rotations for how you think it would behave in-game?

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

My only concern is gating her damage behind tricks, if her opponents are too smart to be tricked then there has to be a way for her to still contribute somehow. Maybe there is and I missed it in your post, but yeah that's my only concern.

Stacona1 votes

I think LeBlanc should have never been an easy to play champion and I want to bring her back as a complex and hard to play and master champion, there are other simple champions if you want something easy like Annie or Blitzcrank.

You can W in, throw out the P clone and E clone choose to Return or not, if they hit the P clone then go all in with the charm, jump to it with Q, and blast them with R.

Also Return would work with Flash and Teleport, but obviously not Recall, so you can do a quick false gank to help a laner with TP out of sight, throw out a P clone and jump back to mid lane --- this would be a scare tactic.


Q is on a 0.5 second delay, so you can always harass with prepped Q into W dashing past your target then Return after Q goes off. My values may be a little too good, or a lot too good, but there is still an active way to get off chip damage - and this R can still be used for chip damage, just ideally it is heavily rewarded for tricking the opponent to hit your passive (by the way all clones have LB's current health visually, passive has no health since damage-less abilities can kill them and E clones is actually just invincible)

Azureee2 votes

The kit sounds cool especially the E and distortion doing damage but everything else I disagree with especially the point of her burst being removed and the kits ult. Swaying away from her kit to fit a theme alienates the fanbase behind her even more. She is a bursty ap assassin. Mimicking abilities is what her ult should always do so she can be super mobile (mimic distortion) not move her Q to ult.

Removing her burst gets rid of her identity and just makes her garbage and will make her a support just like the other reworks. Like why would I play a champ mid of all roles to meme with distractions?

Moving to the kit right now, it just needs waveclear removing with her W nerf reverted so it does damage and chain length nerfed.

Also, touching on the reason you made this thread for the most part, shall I tell you what doesn't feel fair and normally isn't? Dying in League. But too bad, it's gonna happen, whether that fed LB killed you or that Veigar / Syndra pressed R on you. Or the 10/0 Fiora popped you. It won't feel fair but that is there job as a champion. Alienating the champions fanbase to make the champ more noob friendly is dumb and lowers the skillcap within the game. Like what's next, Annie should not be allowed to flash tibbers because 0 counterplay? A line must be drawn. Sounds to me like either an assassin or LB wrecked you so you want her entire kit to be changed due to TOXIC NO COUNTER PLAY HURR DURR XD

Stacona1 votes

The mimick ultimate i think is actually something that is too hard to balance, and high mobility shouldn't have burst to be healthy for league.

Veigar and Syndra have more of a fairness because they are immobile. And Flash should be removed from the game, it will make the game more enjoyable overall and easier to balance the game.

My ideas will far from make her useless, actually if you go off the raw numbers she be overtuned (which is why they don't matter since that is the easy part to fix), she will be even more useful and not need to snowball to do that, unlike her current state. Also LeBlanc is severely overpowered right now so "alienating her" is something that needs to happen then because if all people want is a super mobile champion that one shots and has no real counter play is not good for the game at all. The other assassins need a large scale changes as well and no soft shit, pick an identity to go off of that doesn't involve damage and builds assassins from that, it will allow them to be played in meta then and not be so feast or famine as they are now.

HalcyonDweller1 votes

Your comment was succinct and thoughtful, I would have agreed until you went and ruined it:

{quoted}

Alienating the champions fanbase to make the champ more noob friendly is dumb and lowers the skillcap within the game.

You could have stopped after saying this, it would have conveyed your point. But you went further and attacked the OP's character.

Sounds to me like either an assassin or LB wrecked you so you want her entire kit to be changed due to TOXIC NO COUNTER PLAY HURR DURR XD

This response was inappropriate in this context. Just because somebody is frustrated about something, doesn't mean they can't come up with good ideas and make solid points about it.

OP was careful, and thoughtful in their post. They didn't cry about LB and they didn't bitch and moan or make any fallacious claims. Accusing them of being biased is redundant and needless. Everyone is biased. I'd rather see a well thought-out biased argument instead of a poorly worded and whiny one. Next time just address their argument, you only hurt your own argument by stooping to ad hominems and straw mans.

I suggest you take your misplaced condescension and go bop some heads in a real QQ thread.

HalcyonDweller1 votes

Ur literally doing it again right now. Proving my comment right. Legit shitting up my thread because I downvoted ur comment in another thread, get a life already lmao.

I legit just said I had no idea it was you...? Ok then...

Maybe when u get out of bronze /silver I'll care about ur opinion hun.

Gamplay skill is irrelevant to morals.

That aside though, rank shaming... only serves to show you can't argue properly and need to discredit the opposition in order to try to beat them in an argument.

I can even give u tips to not intentionally feed on Camille, my other main if u want.

You just accused me of stalking, yet you look up my match history to try to find ammunition to insult me with? Pfahaha you hypocrite.

HalcyonDweller1 votes

A small suggestion / question:

Do you think it would give her too much trickery if the line of magic didn't detonate right away after she returns? This would allow her to still pull off the sneaky trick where she would dash then run one way then return to the initial point without the enemy noticing.

Stacona1 votes

creating a further delay after the return makes sense - but would a delay on a delay be too hard to land the nuke on something not a minion? Since she has to finish the dash before she can cast Return

It would be a strategy adding a further delay on the Return only when dashing from fog of war - like put out your E, then Return, then come back in with Q from the W's mirror image - be very cool for the tricks. Only question is if you want her gameplay to lean towards using the fog of war or not.

HalcyonDweller1 votes

I see what you mean, I think I misunderstood, there is already enough tricks on the kit as you designed it.

I definitely wouldn't want the gameplay to lean heavily on fog of war, although using it for tricks can be fun.

A side note: the downvote fairies seem to have been lively this weekend. I wish people had the courage to come out and actually argue their points. It's so cowardly and lazy to just downvote you and not say anything. I'm sorry your post got killed this way.

Stacona1 votes

People who downvote are either trolls or "try-hards" who exploit when a champion is currently in an "OP" state (and want to continue abusing it), so they will never contribute to a discussion - this showcases the flaw to the downvote system.

HalcyonDweller1 votes

I wouldn't say they are 100% always those kinds of people, but I agree that those types do abuse the system available to them.

Stacona1 votes

There are also the vague people who just type things like "no" which does nothing, is not precise, and tells me nothing

The thing about downvoting is that I have zero idea to why they are downvoting since there are way too many points being brought up, so downvoting because of 1 point when there are 10 or 20 tells the creator nothing; even if there are only 2 or just 1 point it still says nothing and gives no feedback so I know what to changes and/or improve on.

HalcyonDweller1 votes

AKA Trolls. Wastes of space.

Don't let it get under your skin, they ain't worth a bean, let alone your attention.

Stacona1 votes

problem is though the trolls gain power with the downvoting because if the post goes to 0 or lower then everyone ignores the post. Everyone else either is neutral or upvotes

So either downvoting is removed altogether or only the creator of the post can see the likes and dislikes to remove negative opinion of something before reading the post

HalcyonDweller1 votes

I agree, it's frustrating to lose an audience due to a few rotten tomatoes.

Hopefully the boards will change sooner than later. People who are close to those with the power to change things are already aware of the issue and trying to solve the problem. They need solid direction for it and approval from Riot though.

You can help by downloading and testing the boards-plugin for browsers. They have it for Chrome, but I'm uncertain about other browsers except to say that they are working on it and hope to have it available in the future.

{quoted}

If you have Chrome, give this a go: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/league-of-legends-boards/infahnbhpbfhabjcepjndgfgdcjpifgm

I'll probably be posting this tomorrow, but I'd love to get your feedback before then!

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