I mean honestly it turns an already power buildable heal into an even more massive one. It's pretty much the sole reason that assassins have to be able to 1 shot squishes now, and there is already cases where it doesn't apply the bonus physical damage as lifesteal 
REMagic427 votesI totally agree that AD Carries are in need of serious changes. Not necessarily in terms of that they give an unfair advantage to one team, after all they can still be bursted and each team gets one of them, so it's fair, but that there are so little options to outplay them other than straight up killing them, which really narrows down the pool of viable champions to those that are AD Carries and those who can kill AD Carries. This would be one interesting idea that needs testing during pre season, but I don't think it's quite enough, since the Melee vs. Range interaction is flawed.
I'd go one step further and say that AD Carries are not broken, they don't need fixing, what they are doing is exactly what they were made for. After all Riot gave multiplicative scaling to arguably the strongest stat in the game (Range) and it's their identity to dish out tons of damage by automatic attacks. There's no way of changing them without taking away most of their core strengths.
My suggestions to Riot are:
Remove the slow from red buff on ranged champions. An AD Carry with an Escape shouldn't have a slow. No matter how much you nerf the true damage on it, it's still the slow that makes it broken on ADCs. Ashe should be one of the few ADCs to get a slow, along with Kog'Maw, MF, Varus and the likes.
Remove, or seriously impede, the ability to kite in teamfights. At the moment, you don't give up on DPS when you kite backwards, which makes no sense whatsoever. Dota2 has turning speeds for that, but I don't think that's the solution. In my opinion, an ADC should position at some place and start shooting, Twitch isn't supposed to kite a Riven to death (Doublelift vs Megazero anyone?), if he repositions, that should happen with a dedicated spell like Ezreal E, or in combination with a serious lack of DPS while doing so.
Fix Last Whisper. This item was supposed to be an anti-tank item, not the go-to item in every single game. Make it penetrate %bonus armor! Alongside with that, it is necessary to address the Crit / Lifesteal interaction, as mentioned in this thread. %Damage based sustain attached to multiplicatively scaling damage, who on earth thought that this would be a great idea?
AD Carries are great at pushing turrets, clearing waves, taking Dragons / Barons, while also being absolute beasts in teamfights. So if you engage against AD Carry you are just as bad off as you are when you don't, since he'll be great in any possible situation come late game. I don't think that their role should excel at everything. Make them weak at pushing turrets, or taking objectives, or clearing waves, or poke, or teamfights. But don't let them be the center of everything. The fact that there is a class designed to keep them safe, one to distract the opponent's AD Carry and one to kill said ADC is just sad.
Yes, there is going to be an outcry among AD Carries for taking some of their strengths and adding meaningful weaknesses, I am sure DL will say once again that there's no reason to be AD Carry main now and Tabbz will say on facebook that Supports should go back to being a wardbot, but think of all the power you could give them in their strengths once you have defined what an AD Carry should not be good at. As of right now, they have the best itemization, the highest damage, an entire class dedicated to make up for any potential weakness (did it ever occur to you that it's not normal to see Mikaels Crucible every single game?), in-combat sustain attached to Damage dealt (either you burst them, or…), high mobility, a permanent slow and the highest range in the game. The only reason this is balanced and doesn't show in winrates or anything like that, is because every team picks one of them, keeping the winrate of ADCs at about 50%, with the current FOTM at the top and the recently nerfed at the bottom. But nerfing individual ADCs doesn't solve the problem, it just pushes other champions to the top. The class as a whole is inherently flawed, and if Riot intended to fix them, they had to start from scratch.
ParinoidPanda2 votes
- Fix Last Whisper. This item was supposed to be an anti-tank item, not the go-to item in every single game. Make it penetrate %bonus armor! Alongside with that, it is necessary to address the Crit / Lifesteal interaction, as mentioned in this thread. %Damage based sustain attached to multiplicatively scaling damage, who on earth thought that this would be a great idea?
1 & 2: yes, they are powerful in the right hands, but that is why you have buff control and counters.
3: Really good point. 
is a very strong item. Riot wanted it to keep countering armor stacking tanks so that games wouldn't continue lasting forever. Some math to see how this works out:
So, 
is my favorite go-to jungler so we'll use him.
Here's an example build against this 
and her AD heavy team:
Total HP: 3197hp Total AR: 452 Bonus AR: 361 Base AR: 91
Using to see how much effective HP I have before and after (Maths):
Effective HP base
3197hp x (1 + (452 / 100)) = 17647
Throw on :
452AR x (1 - 35%) = 294 3197 x (1 + ((294 / 100)) = 12590
That's a difference of:
158 Armor 5000 HP
Now, let's use your idea of only affecting bonus armor
361 x (1 - 35%) = 235 235 + 91 = 326 3197 x (1 + ((326 / 100)) = 13608
That's an increase of:
30 Armor 1000 HP Or, a 7% increase in effective HP
I guess that would be one extra second of AA you could endure. Maybe if both this and the OP suggestion were both implemented, it would be two tweaks on ADCs that would bring them down, 7% damage wise, and 160 HP lifesteal a second. It's a very interesting idea and would bring them down a nice notch. I'm actually liking both ideas done together now. .....
Earl Eulrich4 votesI disagree on the kiting thing...runing backwards and keeping fireing isn´t that easy to pull off and is absolutely necessary to keep adcs playable on higher levels. The problem is not them being able to kite, but the amount of dmg they dish out overall - if a tank could force them to kite him for some time it would be kinda alright, but a lategame carry kills a tank 1v1 within 5sec even while kiting unfortunately.
I think the biggest issue are the crit-rng/scaling, leading to absurd spikes in dmg (or to unlucky adcs being useless, especially midgame) and the arp-system...which you already addressed. And yea, redbuff-slow as melee-only would be quite a good idea I think.
deadlychuck1 votesThe thing is, if you reduced lowered the list of things ADCs excel at without making other changes to other champion archetypes, then you would just be killing the effectiveness of ADCs. What i mean is that because they are so strong (for reasons you mostly listed) they have no meaningful counters, but if you removed some of those things which made them so strong, then all of the bruisers who can assassinate them in a single burst or assassins who can survive long enough to assassinate (namely fizz) would make them absolutely useless. So if you nerf the marksman archetype, you'd also have to nerf (probably the burst damage) of bruisers and the survivability of assassins. Which honestly, i see no issue with any of that.
ParinoidPanda4 votesIt's an interesting idea. Here's some thoughts:
Lifesteal is currently maxing out at about 20% given some builds. Most ADC builds will have either or 
which give give most ADC's a mid game 15-20% lifesteal total. Let's just say 20%.
Most builds have about 300 flat AD with 
giving the crit a total addition of 150%. This crit is usually every 2nd AA.
Maths:
300 * .2 = 60 hp
750 * .2 = 150 hp
Make that an average for each AA (shared work maths):
60hp * 45% = 27
150 * 55% = 82
27 + 82 = 109 avg hp per AA
So, without crit factored in, each AA returns 60 hp. With crit factored in, each AA returns 109 hp.
Having said that, here's the real problem with Crit: It does crazy damage to everything except buildings. That is nuking you for 750 AD and 300 AD every second for about 1000 damage every second: do you really care that she's getting 200 HP back every second with crit factored in, or 120 without it factored in? That's a WHOPPING difference of 80 hp. If you can't do that kind of damage to her anyway, you got bigger concerns.
deadlychuck6 votesYes i'd agree the problem has more to do with crit, but lifesteal is actually just the most powerful sustain stat in the game, before crit strikes even. Also if you've never tried max lifesteal trundle you haven't lived.
+ 
i've literally out healed an ezreal's DPS for a good 5 seconds while attacking a single wave of minions, while getting hit by every Q.
Seriously though compare lifesteal to Hp5 and Spell Vamp. They do the same thing, but lifesteal functions as durability when your DPS gets high enough, but unless you're 
then Hp5 isn't durability, it's sustain. Same goes for Spell Vamp, with the exclusion of 
.
ParinoidPanda1 votesI haven't lived. Trying this out tomorrow.
deadlychuck6 votesOh, and it's more the issue that if you stop focusing the high AD carry for a 2 seconds they go from verge of death to high enough to fight in the span of about 4 auto attacks
Grimraust4 votesSo the lesson to be learned here is "take out crit = fix the game."
12tales4 votesYou could just as easily ask why attack speed gives life steal. The two stats are functionally identical.
Life steal is applied by auto attacks. If you get bigger auto attacks, you get bigger lifesteal. It'd be a bit odd if only some AA multipliers worked with LS and others didn't.
FishAreFriendsss1 votesWell for starters to get a crit you normally have to basic attack, Amd life steal applies to basic attacks, and not all squishes suffer from this. If you play teemo and a yi full build comes to you Q him right after his Q and you can kill him in 2 seconds because of teemos blind.
deadlychuck2 votesthat was the point of me using and 
as examples of items that normally apply to basic attacks, and then don't get calculated into lifesteal
ParinoidPanda1 votesThat's a good point, they don't. That makes a lot more sense now. So crit is the only on hit stat that does work with 
.
Sire Hippington3 votesThats more cause crit isn't a on-hit, if anything it's an on-attack(like runaans or kayles splash)
The5lacker1 votesYes they do. Stop being blatantly, provably wrong.
deadlychuck3 votesNo they don't, botrk does give you lifesteal, but the bonus % damage you do isn't calculated in the heal you get, the same goes for the toggle on muramana.
The5lacker1 voteshttp://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Life_steal http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/On-hit_effect
Life steal is an offensive stat that converts a percentage of the physical damage dealt by a champion's basic attack or ability that applies on-hit effects to health regained.
Life steal applies to all physical damage dealt on-hit, including any sourced from on-hit effects (with a few exceptions). Sheen item.png Sheen and NasusSquare.png Nasus's Siphoning Strike.png Siphoning Strike is a renowned example of powerful sustain as life steal not only applies to the basic damage on the attack, but the bonus damage on Sheen and the stacked damage on Siphoning Strike.
Life steal is an offensive stat that converts a percentage of the physical damage dealt to health regained. A champion's basic attack, abilities that apply on-hit effects, and abilities that modify your next basic attack all benefit from lifesteal.
Yes it is.
The5lacker1 votesMuramana and BotRK both apply lifesteal. Assassins always had to be able to insta-gib squishies, that's literally their entire job. Carries are supposed to out-scale everyone, that's literally their entire job.
deadlychuck2 votesHello 5lacker it's been a while. Also again, no they don't, crit is treated as a damage modifier like arhi's charm, swain's torment, or talon's cutthroat. I'm not sure if it's programmed that way exactly, but that's how it appears on the surface anyway.
Also yes, carries are suppose to outscale everyone, but that doesn't explain why AD carries get such a massive advantage over AP ones through lifesteal and crit. In both terms of damage and survivability/sustain.
The5lacker1 voteshttp://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Life_steal http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/On-hit_effect
Life steal is an offensive stat that converts a percentage of the physical damage dealt by a champion's basic attack or ability that applies on-hit effects to health regained.
Life steal applies to all physical damage dealt on-hit, including any sourced from on-hit effects (with a few exceptions). Sheen item.png Sheen and NasusSquare.png Nasus's Siphoning Strike.png Siphoning Strike is a renowned example of powerful sustain as life steal not only applies to the basic damage on the attack, but the bonus damage on Sheen and the stacked damage on Siphoning Strike.
Life steal is an offensive stat that converts a percentage of the physical damage dealt to health regained. A champion's basic attack, abilities that apply on-hit effects, and abilities that modify your next basic attack all benefit from lifesteal.
You are provably wrong by a single look at the Wiki.
Sire Hippington2 votesLife steal is an offensive stat that converts a percentage of the physical damage dealt to health regained. A champion's basic attack, abilities that apply on-hit effects, and abilities that modify your next basic attack all benefit from lifesteal.
this is the true part of it.(besides it beeing a defensiv stat rather than offensive imo, as it increases durabillity and not damage)
it doesn NOT apply on on-hit effeckts
The5lacker1 voteshttp://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Life_steal http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/On-hit_effect
Life steal is an offensive stat that converts a percentage of the physical damage dealt by a champion's basic attack or ability that applies on-hit effects to health regained.
Life steal applies to all physical damage dealt on-hit, including any sourced from on-hit effects (with a few exceptions). Sheen item.png Sheen and NasusSquare.png Nasus's Siphoning Strike.png Siphoning Strike is a renowned example of powerful sustain as life steal not only applies to the basic damage on the attack, but the bonus damage on Sheen and the stacked damage on Siphoning Strike.
Life steal is an offensive stat that converts a percentage of the physical damage dealt to health regained. A champion's basic attack, abilities that apply on-hit effects, and abilities that modify your next basic attack all benefit from lifesteal.
No. You are wrong. Read the factual information I just linked.
Life steal applies to all physical damage dealt on-hit, including any sourced from on-hit effects (with a few exceptions). Sheen item.png Sheen and NasusSquare.png Nasus's Siphoning Strike.png Siphoning Strike is a renowned example of powerful sustain as life steal not only applies to the basic damage on the attack, but the bonus damage on Sheen and the stacked damage on Siphoning Strike.
ALL PHYSICAL DAMAGE INCLUDING ON-HIT EFFECTS. Do you understand what those words mean? No, of course not, you're dumb as a post. BotRK has always applied Lifesteal. Lifesteal USED to only apply on basic attack damage, crits, Sheen, and some other specific abilities. This was changed back in PRESEASON 3. You have had two years to get with the program.
Sire Hippington2 votesit's from a wiki, not official riot, so not all in it is neccesary true. Just go, play a bot game with muramana, attack an jungle creep with and without toggle and see how much life u gain back each(little hint, it will be the same as the toggle does not work with lifesteal)
The5lacker1 votesOne, if you think that the insanely meticulously maintained wiki is wrong about basic game mechanics and has been for the past two years, you're delusional.
Two, how about YOU find some evidence other than tests you haven't done and get back to me, as your only evidence is...nothing. Find me some youtube vidoe that proves your point.
And if that video is from 2011 and you use that as evidence you have lost any and all right to intelligent discussion as you have shown a complete lack of the primary facet of that concept, intelligence.
Sire Hippington2 votesso u are afread that u are wrong and therfore don'T try it ur self in a botgame? It's realy easy to check ingame if it works or not, and even if the wiki is maintained well, some mistakes always apear.
But if u belive more in a wiki than in an in-game evidence....
The5lacker1 votesCan't play on my laptop. And how about YOU find some evidence.
Oh, wait, evidence only supports facts, not delusional, egotistical dipshits. Of course you'd avoid that.
The5lacker1 voteshttp://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Life_steal http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/On-hit_effect
Life steal is an offensive stat that converts a percentage of the physical damage dealt by a champion's basic attack or ability that applies on-hit effects to health regained.
Life steal applies to all physical damage dealt on-hit, including any sourced from on-hit effects (with a few exceptions). Sheen item.png Sheen and NasusSquare.png Nasus's Siphoning Strike.png Siphoning Strike is a renowned example of powerful sustain as life steal not only applies to the basic damage on the attack, but the bonus damage on Sheen and the stacked damage on Siphoning Strike.
Life steal is an offensive stat that converts a percentage of the physical damage dealt to health regained. A champion's basic attack, abilities that apply on-hit effects, and abilities that modify your next basic attack all benefit from lifesteal.
You are provably wrong by a single look at the Wiki.
Bronze Never Die1 votesit is really a good question!