Tanks are still probably going to do damage

Big Lincoln·Mar 29, 2017·53 votes·3,452 views

After the rework, the three main reworks might even do more than currently

Riot is stressing that they want them to do less reliable damage, meaning Sej Mao and Zac aren't going to just sit on you and beat you to death with WE or WQ spam with Sunfire or Cinderhulk ambient damage. I don't expect them to have delayed damage on the level of Sion or Illaoi but it likely won't be instant AOEs and the like, probably more like Galio.

it's very likely that they'll still be able to kill a squishy champion in the right circumstance, as it should be. They'll just have to work a little harder for it

134 Comments

MannnyMar 29, 20176 votes

A huge problem with tanks can literally be nerfed into a balanced state by simply nerfing item 3068

RalanrMar 29, 201749 votes

Leave my sunfire alone or I will gut you like a pig as if I was the father of a starving family in the middle of winter.

MannnyMar 29, 20172 votes

The sunfire would probably kill me before you even get to me.

RalanrMar 29, 20172 votes

Fire does do that.

MannnyMar 29, 20172 votes

That's not normal fire. That's sun fire.

RalanrMar 29, 20175 votes

Jam packed with the power of SunnyD.

Lordk0zMar 29, 20172 votes

Praise it .[T]./

AirKingNeoMar 29, 20176 votes

"Leave my overpowered item alone"

Why? It gives too much for one item. Waveclear? Tankiness? Damage? It's just plain broken. Ask a top tier player, they can tell you sunfire is the problem.

EDIT: Why do people hate when people are correct? Can't they just handle the truth for once? It is that hard to think about what is actually going on in the game? Sigh

RalanrMar 29, 20171 votes

Bias from favorite item talking: I WILL BLOODY GUT YOU IF YOU TOUCH IT YOU WANKER!!!!

But yeah I could see it getting nerfed a bit. I just don't want it gutted.

5000000000000000Mar 29, 20173 votes

I'd be okay if there were other items that help you waveclear without having to spam all your spells.

RalanrMar 29, 20171 votes

Shiv and runaans.

5000000000000000Mar 29, 20172 votes

For tanks, I mean. Titanic is good on some tanks, but certainly not all can use it well. Ravenous on a tank is not really building as a tank. Shiv and Runaan's are also not really for tanks (unless we get a tank that scales off of crit chance, but that's gonna be a balance nightmare). As for Runaan's, there's like one or two ranged tanks, so...

BlåbæretMar 29, 20173 votes

{quoted}

I'd be okay if there were other items that help you waveclear without having to spam all your spells.

item 3748 item 3074 item 3025 ?

RalanrMar 29, 20176 votes

{quoted}

?

item 3025 does require spell spam.

KnoyleMar 29, 201736 votes

item 3156

item 3165

item 3814

item 3078

It's almost like there is a really good/reliable item for each class or something.

EDIT: replaced Zhonya's With Morello since Hourglass was gutted.

AirKingNeoMar 29, 20173 votes

Maw has a trade off of less damage.

Zhonyas is barely gold efficient and slot efficient stat wise.

You got me at Edge of Night and Trinity, but still Sunfire is really stupid right now. Just because you point out another item doesn't mean Sunfire isn't any less stupid.

KnoyleMar 29, 201713 votes

I'd argue Maw's trade off is barely consequential but I'll admit it's still a trade off. You got a point on Zhonya's as well. However, I was saying that it's not fair to look at one high tier item of one class and call it stupid and broken without also acknowledging the other offenders that are possibly just as if not more so stupid and broken. If we have to kneecap one wonder item for a class the other classes should get the same treatment. Looking at you item 3107

AirKingNeoMar 29, 20172 votes

Sunfire is what is making top lane a tank like right now. All tanks do top lane is sit and waveclear and either don't fight you for force you into fights while you have a wave disadvantage. They build Sunfire so no bruiser can damage them while the bruiser takes a ton of damage from the tank's normal stuff + sunfire. Of course Sunfire's power is invisible.

Again, I know redemption is stupid, but that still doesn't make Sunfire any less broken.

AnagsMar 29, 20179 votes

If sunfire isn't good tanks just won't be played. It's not like everyone in the game is building it even in top lane. There are a lot of viable non tank tops in soloq especially right now. The only reason you don't see more non tanks in competitive is because they have a carry jungle, mid, and don't normally run tank supports.

Seriously sunfire is as balanced right now as it has been probably at any time.

Also in your last 20 games sunfire was built like 6 or 7 times total. In 20 games. Yep, sounds like a busted item for sure.

GayFluffyUnicornMar 31, 20171 votes

Depends on what kind of "bruiser" we are talking about since that term is definitely outdated. A riven doesn't give two shits about it and just melt through you anyways.

AirKingNeoMar 31, 20171 votes

Well for starters, tanks counter Riven. No actually no, Riven doesn't melt through them.

Talking bruisers, you know: Irelia, Aatrox, Jax, Kled, Wukong, Yorick, Kayle (to an extent), ect. Of course I could mention Camille and Fiora but they're the broken ones.

ThalassaMar 30, 20172 votes

item 3165

MelledoneusMar 29, 20171 votes

What position do you play? Because I will ditch the spoon and give you the whole fucking bottle of your own medicine.

AirKingNeoMar 29, 20171 votes

Don't you mean what champion? If I say top, you say Sunfire. I say mid, you say Morello. I say jungle, you say red smite. I say support, you say Redemption/Locket. I say ADC and you say IE or LW.

I play Kayle. What? Rageblade? Item is shit everywhere but Kayle and I think it should keep the same build path and be reverted to season 6 beginning effect wise. (Also lower AS bonus per attack to 4% from 8%, still 8 stacks and still base 25% AS.)

MelledoneusMar 29, 20171 votes

If you play Kayle then you are on a whole other level of "don't get me started." On-hit items are the most volatile of all items and I hope you haven't forgotten about the Devourer meta so soon.

AirKingNeoMar 30, 20171 votes

Yeah onhit items are soooo good. /s

I mean we have Nashors, which only 3 champions build.

Rageblade, which requires you to have a need for 4 thing: AP, AD, AS, and onhits. IT IS TOO MUCH OF A SPECIALIST ITEM (Best part is some Rioter when talking about Gunblade didn't want Gunblade to be a specialist item and now look here...)

Hurricane? I don't even use the crit?

Wit's End? Not gold effective late game.

Oh the devourer meta? So two-three patches for kayle and then unviable on her? Got it.

So so so so very volatile. /s

RalanrMar 30, 20172 votes

To be fair, whenever on hit builds are good Kayle tends to spiral out of control because of her ranged harass (combined with hurricane) immunity ult, and her mixed damage high dps (not to mention her resistances shred).

It's not like she's on the rework list for no reason.

AirKingNeoMar 30, 20171 votes

Yeah well that's because she's a late game carry. No shit she deals a ton of damage.

Yeah well they better not fuck Kayle up or probably the entire community of Kayle mains would be pretty angry. I'd actually enjoy if they went out and asked us what we like and what could be changed.

Obvious I just want +5 AD and an impactfully feeling passive (Still needs to be a tank killing passive).

RalanrMar 30, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Yeah well that's because she's a late game carry. No shit she deals a ton of damage.

While also harassing anyone who is melee from a decent distance. Isn't the lane of a hypercarry supposed to be difficult?

Yeah well they better not fuck Kayle up or probably the entire community of Kayle mains would be pretty angry. I'd actually enjoy if they went out and asked us what we like and what could be changed.

Doubt they would.

Obvious I just want +5 AD and an impactfully feeling passive (Still needs to be a tank killing passive).

They'll probably remove her ult.

AirKingNeoMar 30, 20171 votes

She's can harass melees, but most melees can just shit on her right back. Tanks just get so tanky and force fights she can lose to Naut and Maokai 1v1.

To be fair, if they change her ult, which I wouldn't like since that's her identity (and they let Malz keep his ult), they have to do something cooler.

RalanrMar 30, 20171 votes

{quoted}

She's can harass melees, but most melees can just shit on her right back. Tanks just get so tanky and force fights she can lose to Naut and Maokai 1v1.

Considering you're a dps champion that shreds resistances, I doubt this. Though it's not like those guys aren't supposed to force fights anyway.

To be fair, if they change her ult, which I wouldn't like since that's her identity (and they let Malz keep his ult), they have to do something cooler.

I'd argue that she actually lacks an identity. The ult is just one of the more frustrating things on her kit that leads to a lack of counterplay when fighting her. It's as frustrating as Tryndamere's ult.

AirKingNeoMar 30, 20171 votes

MAGES HAVE STUNS, YOU CAN'T KAYLE ULT WHILE STUNNED

Taric + Sivir/Kled, there you go.

RalanrMar 30, 20171 votes

{quoted}

MAGES HAVE STUNS, YOU CAN'T KAYLE ULT WHILE STUNNED

Taric + Sivir/Kled, there you go.

Ult before the stun.

Two ults? Ok. Still gives that delay to warn the enemy to disengage. And you're using two ults for massive effectiveness.

AirKingNeoMar 30, 20171 votes

If you ult before a mages stun, they see and can just burst you after ult.

Yes and if single target invul is broken, then surely single target oneshot and even AoE oneshots are broken. Or eveyr ult is broken because being unique is bad for the game.

RalanrMar 30, 20171 votes

{quoted}

If you ult before a mages stun, they see and can just burst you after ult.

And then why not just disengage or kill them while your ult is up?

Yes and if single target invul is broken, then surely single target oneshot and even AoE oneshots are broken. Or eveyr ult is broken because being unique is bad for the game.

No ult is automatically a one shot by design, unlike invulnerability which itself is not well balanced on Kayle or Tryndamere.

AirKingNeoMar 30, 20171 votes

You can't disengage if you're stunned. You can't ult if stunned.

No ult is a oneshot by design? Syndra? Orianna? Annie?

RalanrMar 30, 20171 votes