Thresh too much utility power???

Darth Sidiouss·Jul 7, 2017·25 votes·2,040 views

I would say he out performs most of the supports in every way. He provides too much utility while not even being vulnerable himself.

42 Comments

SEKAIJul 7, 20179 votes

Thresh is like what happens when Blitz and Leona have a kid, who gets the best of both worlds as well as having new great stuff from positive mutations.

Unparalleled supremacy. Utterly disgusting balance.

Who came up with ideas like this champ in the first place? checks Oh nvm, can't say I'm surprised.

AhristocatsJul 7, 20173 votes

yeah, thresh definitly has blitz and leona burst and tankiness

oh wait, i remember already having this discussion with you already pointless to do it again

AL000Jul 8, 20171 votes

how can robot sex... oh nm...

Subject 5Jul 7, 20176 votes

The more I read the comments supporting Threshs kit the more I begin to understand that some people aren't exactly capable of taking apart a kit and comprehending the strengths that make a champion strong. Don't know what I expected though - this IS the boards. Thresh has probably triple the amount of 'kit' that Leona has - at one point somebody said that Thresh had a long CDR for hook? Do you even play this guy? I literally couldn't even help but chuckle at the comment, it was at that point that I just assumed you don't even play him nor have you experienced him enough to say such a blunt lie.

Thresh Q: (Most supports will have 45% CDR) 20 / 18 / 16 / 14 / 12 Hitting an enemy reduces Death Sentence's cooldown by 3 seconds.

So at lvl 5 Q and 45% CDR - Thresh can use his Q every 5.5 seconds - if you land Q that ability goes down to about 2.5 seconds per hook! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLJwa3oUm3Y Say 2.5 seconds with Angry Joes 4 HOURS MEME)

We ain't even done with Thresh though, you know why? Because people have the nerve to compare Leona to Thresh. LMAO. 2.5 Seconds per hook is completely reasonable - you know what, let's put some icing on the cake - how about we tack on a 99% slow that can prock 5 times! That's 5 times you can be slowed by 99%! Oh yeah don't worry though, at least it's got 55 seconds of CDR at rank 3 with your standard support build (Rolls eyes) Don't worry though, it only last 5 SECONDS and scales with 100 PERCENT OF THRESHS AP (So yeah - come end game his ultimate will do about 700-800 damage - yeah - great.)

That's not good enough though - you know why? Because CertainlyT said so mother fucker - let's give him some displacement with his Q - and then give him some displacement with his E - then let's give him some poke power, then a slow - (40% slow at max rank!) The CDR on his E is 9 seconds - at the standard 45% cdr most supports have, his E can go off every 4 seconds!

Not good enough? Aight - how about a shield that scales with a 220 base shield at max rank - then scale it up with some souls. I bet your adc will enjoy a 320 shield when you get that at max rank - let's compare that to somebody that is literally just a shield: Janna Who literally is literally identified as just being a shield, that's what and who she is. Just a fucking shield. Guess what though - it's 240 at base! Wooooowwwwww alrighty then stanley-

Wait- wait- wait- wait- wait - hold the phone fuck-O you can't have a CertainlyT champion without more bullshit, okay? You need more stuff in your kit. You need mobility to come along with that shield, you should be able to just LEAP the entire lane away and over terrain.

Let's count what Leona has though - surely she should have a kit that is justifiably acceptable in accordance to Thresh:

Passive: Do an extra 20 - 105 damage WOOOOOOOO sooo fucking good - 20 damage at early levels guys - ALRIGHTTTTT! LOL

Q: Increased range on AA - Stun somebody for 1 SECOND <---------------------------------------- Pay attention to this mother fucker

https://puu.sh/wEbCX/1d21a4791c.png

Did you miss it?

https://puu.sh/wEbEG/336a87e044.png

Why does Thresh stun LONGER than Leona? Why is his ranged and stuns longer - AND has more DAMAGE!?

Look:

Leona Q: 30 / 55 / 80 / 105 / 130 (+ 30% AP)

Thresh Q: 80 / 120 / 160 / 200 / 240 (+ 50% AP)

??? Only one of these champions naturally scale with free AP ???

Okay? So the justification is that Leona can be more aggressive early on but NOBODY engages over, and over, and over, and over again - that's literally what a bronze game is. You either engage, both survive and back off for 20-30 seconds or one or two of you die. So?

Leona w: Bonus Armor And Bonus MR - So basically you scale with items, good luck getting items after your item 2049 item 3047 item 3190 because the games already over with, your team has already stomped or your team has already been stomped - and that enemy Thresh has a kit that just blows yours right out of the water.

Leona E: In every way shape and form inferior to Thresh Q. You can't decide to just say: "Woooooahhhhh I kind of don't want to go in anymore" after it lands - because after the enemy jungler poofs out of nowhere - that's it. You're dead. And you won't be able to get back up because this game is snowballey as fuck, and you're playing Leona, you WON'T catch up unless if somebody extremely bronze happens. CDR 13-9 Seconds, so basically Thresh Q.

So? Your Q-E is just your average Thresh Q - He just has it on one ability.

"But Subject phive - Leona has an AOE Ulty!"

Uhhh yeah, it does like 70% less damage than Threshs - you know what it's better at? Stunning a group of players - that's it. It can't be re-applied 5 times in a row, give off an AOE pressure 'box' that enemy players need to play around - it's just a stun. I guess it's good because it's got a 60 second CDR? Yeah I guess . . . look on the bright side though, at least it stuns just as long as Threshs Q. So. Yeah. That's. You know. That's something.

AhristocatsJul 8, 20173 votes

you honestly compare thresh Q that has 20/18/16/14/12 cd, with leona Q that has 4 sec cd?

i don't think you understood how supports work, i don't think ANYONE on the board understood how supports work

thresh is overpowered AT THIS PATCH and was perfectly fine before patch 7.9, he needs a nerf, but you don't get to talk shit about how supports work, because the power of a support is not how much he has in his kit, but also his base stats, his cooldowns, his range, his delays, his damage, his overall numbers and how reliable the support is

so yeah, it's kinda fcking dumb to see people going "lol look at thresh he has this this and that" when EVERYONE agreed that this is not a correct way to say if a champ is balanced or not

hope it helped, but i'm sure it didn't because the amount of IQ in this thread is low

[{quoted}](name=Subject 5,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9a38B8W3,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2017-07-07T23:18:03.544+0000)

Thresh Q: (Most supports will have 45% CDR) 20 / 18 / 16 / 14 / 12 **Hitting an enemy reduces Death Sentence's cooldown by 3

Thresh takes courage of the colossus again, this shows your TOTAL IGNORANCE about how supports work

beside i'll enlighten you, thresh Q cd used to be insanely low, they increased it and made it reduced by 3 sec if he hits a target to punish thresh hard for missing a hook

again, inform yourself

sobi999Jul 8, 20176 votes

He is overloaded and is one of the most popular support pick with a really good winrate across all elos. I think the person you replied to knows his kit far too well and i am not sure what you are trying to get across but thresh is in serious need of nerf otherwise i am afraid you're the one with low IQ.

AhristocatsJul 8, 20171 votes

{quoted}

He is overloaded and is one of the most popular support pick with a really good winrate across all elos.

yeah, that's what i LITERALLY said, since 7.9 thresh needs a nerf, but was fine before, you just had to read what i said you know

{quoted}

I think the person you replied to knows his kit far too well

he doesn't know anything, else he wouldn't just compare leona Q to thresh Q like that people do not know what's power budget

he didn't compare leona Q cd to thresh Q cd he didn't do anything except reading spells

it's lame, just lame, people thinking a support is all about what he has in his kit you know why rakan isn't overbearing? because of his FREAKING LONG CD, same with thresh except that since 7.9 it isn't enough anymore to balance him

also, he didn't even take a look at base stats

Subject 5Jul 8, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=WTF DARIUS ADC ,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9a38B8W3,comment-id=000b0001,timestamp=2017-07-08T00:19:25.504+0000)

you honestly compare thresh Q that has 20/18/16/14/12 cd, with leona Q that has 4 sec cd?

i don't think you understood how supports work, i don't think ANYONE on the board understood how supports work

thresh is overpowered AT THIS PATCH and was perfectly fine before patch 7.9, he needs a nerf, but you don't get to talk shit about how supports work, because the power of a support is not how much he has in his kit, but also his base stats, his cooldowns, his range, his delays, his damage, his overall numbers and how reliable the support is

so yeah, it's kinda fcking dumb to see people going "lol look at thresh he has this this and that" when EVERYONE agreed that this is not a correct way to say if a champ is balanced or not

hope it helped, but i'm sure it didn't because the amount of IQ in this thread is low

Thresh takes courage of the colossus again, this shows your TOTAL IGNORANCE about how supports work

beside i'll enlighten you, thresh Q cd used to be insanely low, they increased it and made it reduced by 3 sec if he hits a target to punish thresh hard for missing a hook

again, inform yourself

I think you need to close that thing you call a verbal device - just look up on google the kits and READ my fucking post, before you come across as intelligent as your "OMFG TWITCH IS OP" Posts okay? Inform yourself. Oh, and look up the two kits - and compare CDR's. They are basically the same CDR. So. Yeah. Soooooo.

Yeah.

AhristocatsJul 8, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Subject 5,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9a38B8W3,comment-id=000b00010001,timestamp=2017-07-08T00:28:04.384+0000)

just look up on google the kits and READ my fucking post,

i read it and replied to you, didn't you see the reply? talking about how you didn't compare anything else than reading spells?

[{quoted}](name=Subject 5,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9a38B8W3,comment-id=000b00010001,timestamp=2017-07-08T00:28:04.384+0000)

They are basically the same CDR. So. Yeah. Soooooo.

XD??????????????

Subject 5Jul 8, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=WTF DARIUS ADC ,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9a38B8W3,comment-id=000b000100010000,timestamp=2017-07-08T00:33:24.676+0000)

i read it and replied to you, didn't you see the reply? talking about how you didn't compare anything else than reading spells?

XD??????????????

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Thresh

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Leona/Abilities

My post pointed out the differences in CDR - please dude, just look. Like, you just need to click on the link and see for yourself.

Second of all, how do you compare and contrast things without educating people on the spells themselves? ? ?

AhristocatsJul 8, 20171 votes

there is NO WAY they have the same cooldown, what the hell Every single support since 7.12 gets 40% cdr, they both take colossus, you're telling me that leona won't get knight's vow+glory+relic shield and an other 10% cdr item? god stop being so ignorant, if anything they both have the same itemization

thresh Q is 12 sec cd, leona Q is 5 sec cd it doesn't matter that it has a cd refund, because it's taken in account in the power budget, it isn't certain that thresh hook will hit a target goddamnit

stop acting like they have the same cd, this is th worst thing i ever saw

Subject 5Jul 8, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=WTF DARIUS ADC ,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9a38B8W3,comment-id=000b00010001000000000000,timestamp=2017-07-08T00:44:36.725+0000)

there is NO WAY they have the same cooldown, what the hell Every single support since 7.12 gets 40% cdr, they both take colossus, you're telling me that leona won't get knight's vow+glory+relic shield and an other 10% cdr item? god stop being so ignorant, if anything they both have the same itemization

thresh Q is 12 sec cd, leona Q is 5 sec cd it doesn't matter that it has a cd refund, because it's taken in account in the power budget, it isn't certain that thresh hook will hit a target goddamnit

stop acting like they have the same cd, this is th worst thing i ever saw

Lmao, you're talking about a power budget. Lmao.

LOL. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CijmtuDZbZ8

Rofl. https://youtu.be/_k9cZHvJAZM?t=3m4s

I think Thresh has been beyond Leonas power budget since release, and he has been, since release, the king of supports. It's unfortunate that you think you can only play a champion a certain way. I'm not gonna argue though, I'm gonna just continue playing some Shogun 2 while you toss around the word Ignorant like it's a rare baseball card.

AhristocatsJul 8, 20171 votes

thresh power budget has been fine from 2014 to now as he had between 44 and 48% win rate during this time NOTHING made him broken except 7.9

you're more ignorant than me, and yet you're still talking, everything you said DIDNT MAKE A SINGLE SENSE, saying that they have the same Q cd, and yet you tell me that i'm ignorant

What on earth is this? do you think you can manipulate me that easily? or something that you can't understand? you think that putting some videos on your post will make it better?

wow, just wow

Subject 5Jul 8, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=WTF DARIUS ADC ,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9a38B8W3,comment-id=000b0001000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-07-08T01:08:47.229+0000)

thresh power budget has been fine from 2014 to now as he had between 44 and 48% win rate during this time NOTHING made him broken except 7.9

you're more ignorant than me, and yet you're still talking, everything you said DIDNT MAKE A SINGLE SENSE, saying that they have the same Q cd, and yet you tell me that i'm ignorant

What on earth is this? do you think you can manipulate me that easily? or something that you can't understand? you think that putting some videos on your post will make it better?

wow, just wow

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Gv0H-vPoDc

warmcorntortillaJul 8, 20172 votes

I ban him all the time because a decent Thresh can LITERALLY do it all. You don't even need to have a good ADC. Your ADC can be utterly braindead, it doesn't matter. They're bad at positioning? Can't punish it because of lantern. They're bad at cs-ing? Get relic shield and make sure they get every cannon creep. They have bad damage? Guess what, Thresh has damage to compete with pretty much anybody except mage supports that ought to be in mid but have crept down to bot to be obnoxious.

People say support is the hardest lane to carry from, and I say that's crap. I think it's the easiest lane to carry from, especially in my elo, because being able to predict and outplay your own teammates stupidity is priceless. So much of low elo is capitalizing on the enemy raging, or being stupid, or overstaying, or positioning badly, and Thresh makes sure you can't do any of that. He peels, he picks, he saves, he does it all, extremely well. No other support can compare with him. The only lane I can play into him is Soraka, because the silence fucks him, and her movement speed on Q makes it hard for him to land hooks on support or ADC.

I'll be honest, I'm not good at clutch plays. I play much better when I'm not under pressure, which is why I play support, because I'm good at it, and that's why Thresh is pretty much unplayable for me, because when it comes down to it you've GOTTA hit those hooks and I just can't, cuz I freeze and suck the most when I need to be good.

But it's kinda bullshit that he gets to squeeze out every other support from botlane. I think Nami has the same problem in a way, she's good at SO many things, but her kit doesn't come close to being as overloaded as Thresh's.

Also, thank you, this was a hilarious post and gave me a chuckle :D

It Hertz When IPJul 8, 20171 votes

Not to nitpick, but the "5 times in a row" thing would only apply if the target in question was attempting to walk in a circle deliberately hitting all five walls of The Box. I live in Bronze, and that doesn't even happen down here; even Bronzies don't do that. The most you might see is two procs if someone decided to just yolo-charge straight through his ult (which does in fact happen down here). Leona's ult is also castable at range, whereas Thresh can only drop his box around himself.

Mind you, I agree with the rest of what you said; Thresh is BS levels of utility compared to Leona. Just don't sell her ult short/oversell his.

AhristocatsJul 7, 20174 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dry Your Tears,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9a38B8W3,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-07-07T15:20:17.780+0000)

while not even being vulnerable himself.

??????????????????????

PartholonianJul 7, 20174 votes

Yeah, I don't get this part either. Thresh is squishy in lane, he needs defensive items and stacking his passive to become even slightly tanky (and even then he won't get to Nautilus/Maokai/Galio levels of tankiness basically ever, because he's on a support's budget and has no defensive steroids in his kit).

The difference between trying to catch out a Thresh and trying to catch out a Braum/Tahm/Ali/Taric/Naut is huge. Because those other champs are genuinely inherently tanky.

And while he can provide extra mobility to a teammate beyond what's already built into their kit (which can be VERY strong if used well), he has very little for himself -- Q2 to get in, if you hit a slow skillshot, and nothing at all to get out.

TooLucidJul 7, 20174 votes

Yeah Thresh is outright overpowered through his utility alone. He just packs way too much CC and his lantern on top of that is ridiculous. He can make a pick and save a carry. Come on. Nobody else can do this.

5000000000000000Jul 7, 20173 votes

Isn't being able to pick and peel pretty common for supports?

Power CosmicJul 7, 20171 votes

Usually, in a fight, a support will have to pick one or the other. Thresh has a hook, lantern, and ult.

Captain AishiJul 8, 20173 votes

and flay, and his passive also makes him the tankiest and highest DPS champion that a full support build can offer

PePsiLemoNNJul 7, 20174 votes

What are you talking about? He only has 4 utility/cc spells jeez /s

He is called the Lee of supports for a reason :^)

l Dárius lJul 7, 20172 votes

then leona is a nother issue

FireDrizzleJul 7, 20177 votes

Leona doesnt give a teammate a huge dash, Leona cant hook herself to safety and Leona cant flay you into a turret you are miles from.

l Dárius lJul 7, 20175 votes

{quoted}

Leona doesnt give a teammate a huge dash, Leona cant hook herself to safety and Leona cant flay you into a turret you are miles from.

leona has 1 stun on an auto reset, 1 skillshot stun in her ult, and a "skillshot" root dash and is signifigantly tankier than thresh. at level 6 leona has the ability to basically gaurantee someone sits in one spot for 3 seconds simply by landing her r.

not saying leona is op, but she has a shitload of offensive utility i would say is onpar with thresh, and i dont see many people complaining about her because she isnt "flashy" like thresh is

jmp231Jul 7, 20174 votes

I second this. I would rather face a thresh all day then face Leona once

LankPantsJul 7, 20173 votes

Leona can only really do one thing, lock down a target at melee range. That's great when you're winning but if you ever get behind she becomes dead-weight.

Thresh on the other hand has ranged pick potential, he doesn't have to close to you when he hooks. He also has fairly good lock down, not on Leona's level but good enough and unlike Leona he has defensive utility with his W. Even when behind Thresh can still throw in Lanterns to save people and disrupt fights with his hook fairly safely.

Ahri Body PillowJul 7, 20172 votes

Leona -Root -2 Stuns -A Slow -(might provide vision with ult?)

Thresh -One stun -Displacement in any direction -A pull -2 slows -A shield -A gapcloser -Provides vision with lantern and hook -Gives a teammate a dash

I'm sorry but I believe Thresh has more utility. I'd hardly call an AA reset "utility" and I'm on the fence about her passive and defensive steroids. We are not arguing that Thresh is godtier at locking someone down, because there are many champions that do that way better. Morgana, Leona, and even Alistar all come to mind for that. OP is simply stating that he has too much strength in his utility overall. Leona is indeed much stronger in terms of offensive utility. However, Thresh is simply much more flexible due to his kit. He can engage or disengage with any ability in his kit. There's not really a situation where Thresh is weak.

Also, in terms of your last statement about "flashiness"... Thresh is not very fun to play against. His hook hitboxes are absolutely bullshit and the free dash that is SUPPOSED to be blockable is absolutely infuriating. Whenever Leona lands her abilities on me I never really feel cheated. I genuinely feel like she outplayed me. I can not count the times when I've been hit by a thresh hook and the next words out of my mouth were "Really? That hit me?". Thresh throws curveballs with his Q sometimes, I swear.

TL;DR

Thresh's strength comes from his flexibility and ability to perform well in any situation. Some of his abilities feel unfair to interact with.

Tobias BracknerJul 7, 20173 votes

Thresh -One stun (That is way harder to hit than both of Leona's Stuns) -Displacement in any direction (A literal lie, unless you are talking about another move) -A pull (Teeny tiny pull, should be combined w/ the slows you listed) -2 slows (Only one of which you have hardcore control over. The other can be played around depending on how many people are boxed) -A shield (That is extremely tiny and way overpriced for the mana you spend on it. Tbh I don't think it should be listed here) -A gapcloser (Attached to an easy-to-dodge skillshot) -Provides vision with lantern and hook (Extremely situational when this is good) -Gives a teammate a dash (A literal lie)

The only thing that pros want Thresh over Leona is that they want someone to fix their bad positioning and poor plays for them.

IcyPepperJul 7, 20171 votes

She's also not played as often. People tend to complain more about prolific champions because their issues are seen more commonly.

Less popular champions' flaws are obscured as a result.

ArakadiaJul 7, 20172 votes

The support who isn't a tank, but has to gap close and get in close range yet not die is not vulnerable? He cannot control where his lantern will take the ally and where he casts his ult if he is not moving around. If he wants a useful ult, he needs to get in range.

He isn't a tank support and has to build it, and he's completely immobile if he is unable to hook to an enemy nearby (which is very situational, telegraphed, blockable, and delayed).

Thresh does need nerfs, but he is vulnerable.

Devilreaper XIIIJul 7, 20171 votes

i disagree with you Arakadia, Tresh is definatly tanky, but the worst problem is that tanks these days cause the same damage as other champions.... and on top of that have more CC, believe it or not Tresh/Leona can easily 1vs5..... and get kills out of that @.@ Tresh = grab immobile + hook up + slowdown + adc level damage + tanky Leona = SPAM grab root + stun + slow down + the damage taken is bonus damage done + tanky blitzcrank = grab + hook up + silence + immense damage + shield + dash + tanky

i find these three the most obnoxious supports if you ask me O.O

DaNinadJul 7, 20171 votes

I know thresh is annoying, but Blitz will always annoy me.

KVbqbFsC8eJul 7, 20171 votes

Thats been known for years. Its kind of his thing.

Devilreaper XIIIJul 7, 20171 votes

try to 1vs1 a Leona top.... i'm telling you she's a monster .-. sunlight + 110% of her ap as bonus damage if she does her combo..... she also gets bonus armor/resistance base stats below for Leona and Thresh.

Leona base stats: Health 576 – 2055 Attack damage 60 – 111 Health regen. 8.43 – 22.9 Attack speed [*] 0.625 (+ 0 – 49.3%) Mana 302 – 982 Armor 27.2 – 88.4 Mana regen. 6 – 19.6 Magic resist. 32.1 – 53.4 attack distance 125 Move. speed 335

Thresh base stats: Health 561 – 2142 Attack damage 47.7 – 85.1 Health regen. 6.92 – 16.3 Attack speed [*] 0.625 (+ 0 – 59.5%) Mana 274 – 1022 Armor 16 Mana regen. 6 – 19.6 Magic resist. 30 – 38.5 attack distance 450 Move. speed 335

Romans VI XXIIIJul 8, 20171 votes

lol, yeaaaa 110% of her AP......you forget to mention threshes ratios, which im 100% certain would be higher than 110% LOL gj tho.

ChompyWulfJul 7, 20171 votes

Going to echo some people about some Thresh points. First, the hook is a strong engage, but it is a long CD and telegraphed. The lantern is a strong way to save an ally or bring a teammate along after a hook travel, and also has a fairly long cooldown. Odds are you won't land a hook, bring an ally in with Lantern, and also be able to get them out of it goes bad fast. Flay is a decent little utility, but doesn't displace much and if you mind your place in a teamfight you will probably won't die because of it. If he lands flay after hooking you that's just his combo as work. Box is manageable. And because of his passive and scaling, Thresh IS vulnerable early game and never as tanky as true tank supports. Furthermore, he doesn't even benefit half as well from Relic Shield as others because he is ranged and must last hit, no easy proccing multiple stored executes like melee tanks.

deadlychuckJul 8, 20171 votes

Just want to point out, that on release, the only champion who could hold a candle to Tahm Kench was thresh. Tahm had more damage, but Thresh had more utility. Since then, Tahm has been nerfed appropriately, thresh hasn't.

RozzetaJul 8, 20171 votes

I remember back when Sona, Soraka, or JAnna would reach 15/20% play rate, and Morello would nerf them the fuck up in an instant.

Then Thresh is released, has 35% play rate, gets a nerf to reposition damage passive from Q to E, still 30% play, and nothing done about it for years.