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Ways to tone down Yasuo before you inevitably rework him

DeusVult··41 votes·2,226 views

  1. Make it more difficult to build up his passive shield than just walking around lane. When you call CotC cancer for lane because it lessens trades but Yasuo exists and can block a solid chunk of his opponents damage every minion wave is just absurd. He should actually have to interact in order to build his shield rather than just run around while its down.

  2. Get rid of 2 mechanics that he really doesn't need:
    A. The ult mechanic that places him as far away from a tower as possible so that he won't be hit by the tower while having the animation go off. B. How his wind wall spawns slightly behind him and pushes itself in the cast direction, so that it blocks projectiles that have literally already hit Yasuo. Also, his wind wall blocks projectiles from all angles, even behind. It should only block projectiles from the direction it is cast to, in the same way that braum shield works. So that he can't pull the dodging from 1 side of the wall to the other and negating all ranged damage for 4 seconds.

  3. Make his free double crit passive scale with levels as you have done with literally every other champ in the game. So he gets 10-100% increased critical strike chance based on champ level, scaling from 1 to 18.

All of these would help reduce Yasuos early game dominance, since he is currently an early game monster with one of the best late-games in the whole game

54 Comments

Oleandervine16 votes

These are solid suggestions.

RlP K0BE9 votes

I like 1 and 2 but his crit passive needs to stay the same. It's the only thing stopping people from building him as a complete bruiser. Also if they did make it so his crit chance scaled they would have to buff his ultimate.

I feel like the problem withYasuo is that he is too safe. When you think of a high risk-high reward champion Yasuo should be one of the first to come up. Right now he can access a lot of the reward while also staying safe. I think that his base stats play a part in this. His base stats are actually really low for a melee champion so Riot gave him his shield and wall to compensate for that. A lot of people suggest nerfs while forgetting this.

He has no scaling MR so he relies on his dashes and shields to defend himself vs mages.

xevi2 votes

{quoted}

Right now he can access a lot of the reward while also staying safe.

Could you elaborate?

They way I see it, Yasuo isn't "too safe". He lacks any innate escapes and easy crowd control while still being a fairly squishy champ. On top of this, his defensive abilities are on pretty high cd

AceGeo1 votes

He lacks escapes? Have you seen a skilled yasuo dash through an entire wave back to his own turret?

YumScrumptious961 votes

Have you let a skilled Yasuo get past your entire minion wave for free without using his dashes? If so, you probably deserved to lose that kill.

RlP K0BE1 votes

{quoted}

Could you elaborate?

They way I see it, Yasuo isn't "too safe". He lacks any innate escapes and easy crowd control while still being a fairly squishy champ. On top of this, his defensive abilities are on pretty high cd

I mean during the laning phase where people have the most frustration with him. If the player is smart Yasuo is able to win most trades because of his passive shield and wind wall mitigating damage.

Mogarl2 votes

I may be wrong but I'm fairly certain that Yasuo's base stats were hit by nerfs over time. So saying that he was given the shield and wall to compensate that wouldn't be quite right. his base stats have slowly been taking hits due to the massive amount of defensive power in his windwall and passive shield.

Personally I think the shield should simply be removed with compensation added elsewhere in his kit, even if it ended up being something like a parry at the beginning of windwall, slight buffs to his hp/5 or other base stats, or lowering windwall cooldown.

RlP K0BE1 votes

{quoted}

I may be wrong but I'm fairly certain that Yasuo's base stats were hit by nerfs over time. So saying that he was given the shield and wall to compensate that wouldn't be quite right. his base stats have slowly been taking hits due to the massive amount of defensive power in his windwall and passive shield.

Personally I think the shield should simply be removed with compensation added elsewhere in his kit, even if it ended up being something like a parry at the beginning of windwall, slight buffs to his hp/5 or other base stats, or lowering windwall cooldown.

His stats have always been low and are one of the lowest of his class. Its like this because Riot intended for Yasuo to use his windwall, shield, and dashes in order to protect himself. I'm all for nerfing those but he would need a buff to his base stats and also given an mr scaling.

KiritoErenMikasa5 votes

All Yasuo needs for him to be toned down is his tornado's, meaning dont give him a tornado till he hits lvl 6 and dont let him use tornado's till he has his ult ready or available. Simple as that.

KiritoErenMikasa2 votes

It will also benefit players that go up against him letting them know he has his ult available when you see him start using tornado's, why not they implemented the same thing with annie to see her stacking her stun.

Kaioko4 votes

These are actually really good suggestions. The scaling crit chance would probably hit him a little hard but you could always buff his bases a little bit if he's suffering after that.

More importantly - it would keep Yasuo fun for the players who like him while making him less frustrating to play against.

YumScrumptious961 votes

Do you play Yasuo often? Nerfing him heavily and rewarding him with some base buffs are not exactly gonna make Yasuo players have fun.

Danjeng4 votes
  1. Atm, Yasuo has an alternate resource, flow, which only functions with a single part of his kit, the passive. Seems out of place how no other abilities interact with it. Make windwall consume flow, increasing in duration per flow consumed.
IronwallJackson2 votes

His E generates a fixed amount of flow, since it causes him to move, and his W used to passively increase the amount of flow his E gave him, but that got nerfed ages ago for being too strong. It's kind of a shame, actually, because that passive made it so that each of his abilities interacted directly with another, and that's some elegant design, yo.

ReZisT Lust3 votes

1-when hes qing stuff or autoing just auto him before you cast spells (spoiler alert Same for Malzahar passive) 2- A-The out of tower bug is weird let him do what kat hunpo does choose where he blinks to reletive to where the cursor is B-Its fucking wind it doesnt matter which way it blows from it just blows up and braums shield is a god damn shield so of course it sgoning to hit braum if someone bootyslaps braum, its fine to block stuff from either side. However if you give it a d&d approach- Arrows and bolts((autos)) are deflected upward and miss, while any other normal ranged weapon passing through the wall has a 30% miss chance scaling the higher its level or his since he levels it last. 3- Technically its not free sinceitem 1051 costs 400 g lol hes just paying half as much :p and iv got nothing else for this section

Dont hate me too much iv been drinking a wee bit [slayer-jinx-catface]

Sraeg20133 votes

Make it more difficult to build up his passive shield than just walking around lane.

Early game cooldown of Yasuo's shield is higher than any non-ultimate shield in the game, with the sole exception of Thresh's Lantern.

The ult mechanic that places him as far away from a tower as possible so that he won't be hit by the tower while having the animation go off.

Compensation: Now Yasuo can use ult anywhere in range of the target and he gets to choose on which side of the target he will appear.

projectiles that have literally already hit Yasuo

If they "literally" hit him, then he got hit. There is no other way around.

Make his free double crit passive scale with levels as you have done with literally every other champ in the game

Tryndamere "literally" gains up to 35% crit chance at level 1 and it doesn't scale.

Hèntaî 2 votes

Savage

Sraeg20132 votes

And brutal.

EndlessSorcerer2 votes

If people need examples of the mechanics detailed in [2]:

Windwall blocking abilities when cast in the opposite direction https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OuN3HNCf0c

Ultimate positioning him outside of tower range (0:33 to 1:00) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YINsRtqipk&feature=youtu.be&list=PLsL7hqZ-1QGQhF_QV2ZyTm0Rp0DrhTuq1&t=33

DunkinNoobs2 votes

He's already getting nerfed when he doesn't really deserve it. How about you wait a bit before demanding even more nerfs.

PokladnicaZla1 votes

The problem with Yasuo is not that he's strong or not,it's that he's godly annoying.Even if he were Urgot tier people would still likely ban him so they don't have to deal with him.

DunkinNoobs2 votes

Except that's not true. Yasuo had like a 4% banrate for pretty much all of season 5. Hell, Yasuo even saw some LCS play during season 5 and people still didn't ban him. Hating Yasuo is just the trendy thing right now; it will pass, like it always does.

PokladnicaZla1 votes

If you believe it.It depends where you looked at the statistics. I always found him annoying.Since his kit was revealed,with no gameplay footage I knew he would be an issue for the gameplay balance.

DunkinNoobs2 votes

I managed 546 Yasuo games during season 5. He was hardly ever banned and most people considered him trash, especially during the first half of the season. Remember "Yasuo is Science"? That was season 5.

PokladnicaZla1 votes

Yasuo is science?Never heard of it?

On EUNE he used to banned,not to the extent he is now,but he used to be banned.

YumScrumptious961 votes

Just because you found him annoying always doesn't mean everyone did. That's anecdotal evidence.

PokladnicaZla1 votes

I did find him annoying,but so did people,since they banned him.

YumScrumptious961 votes

And is he universally banned by everyone? No. Is he hated by everyone (discounting Yasuo mains)? No.

PokladnicaZla1 votes

Currently his banrate is around 15% (statisticfrom all servers) and the 12th highest. 15th on NA 9.1% banrate 13th EUW 8.4% banrate 8th on EUNE 28.2% banrate 8th on BRAZIL 25.1% banrate Couldn't fin the KOREAN statistic (Info is taken from lolking -> All ranked games). If you google Yasuo lolking,the statistic by his name suggest a banrate of 60.5%(cant find circumstances,so normal games and modes might taken into account).

Well,he is hated by a decent part of the community and that's putting it lightly.

YumScrumptious961 votes

12th highest. Didn't know that meant he's hated. Guess you learn new things from boards members every day.

PokladnicaZla1 votes

Do you usually fall back to sarcasm when you run out of valid points or ignore statistics?

It doesn't mean that he's hated.It means people dislike playing against him for either he's such a kit that's unfun for the people facing him or he's OP in the current game or both.

He's hate comes from the forums where people QQ about him.Saying people don't hate him as a champion is ignorant.He's not that most hated champ in the game,but he's hated nevertheless.

YumScrumptious961 votes

You literally said he's hated by a decent part of the community using ban rates as proof.

PokladnicaZla1 votes

He is.

YumScrumptious961 votes

Not even my point but I love your evidence behind it. Must be a visual bug on my end because its hard to see though.

Sire Hippington2 votes

All of these would help reduce Yasuos early game dominance

people keep saying that, and yet Yasuo has one of the worst <20min winrates and a clear weak early, strong lategame powercurve in terms of winrate.

Simply nerfing stuff will only end in gutting him. He needs atleast a small scale rework, or he either gets gutted or stays annoying if not overbearing to lane against, because his early is despite some serious powerspikes in the early lane actually not that strong in the context of the overall game. If you play properly vs him, he can't cheese him self a snowball, and then he needs a long time to scale up for anything that isn't a 1v1 near a minion wave.

The changes nerfs you suggest without any compensation would just put him down to urgot tier and beyond. One might argue that this is a fine thing to do till a proper rework, but it sure isn't ideal.

Two nefs that i think would make him fairer to face without hitting him to hard would be a lower Q stack duration, and directional blocking for his windwall.

PokladnicaZla1 votes

He can be Urgot tier for what everyone cares,but he would be still annoying to deal with.

DunkinNoobs3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Don Cingulum,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=82aiBiya,comment-id=000e,timestamp=2017-01-17T11:54:33.245+0000)

people keep saying that, and yet Yasuo has one of the worst <20min winrates and a clear weak early, strong lategame powercurve in terms of winrate.

Yasuo's "strong early game" is one of the biggest myths of all time. Yasuo has a strong lvl 1 against melee champs and a strong lvl 2 against most champs. His levels 3-13 are garbage and his lvl 6 is especially bad against real duelists; his first back is also among the weakest of all solo laners. Don't get dumpstered in the first 5 minutes and you'll start beating Yasuo with most champs. And if you get ahead of Yasuo, you're going to stay ahead on most champs unless you get massively outplayed.

YumScrumptious961 votes

Its extremely hard to change the boards hivemind perspective. They could say Nasus has a strong early game and fully believe it. If any champion is annoying to deal with, they find problems with the champion where there are none.

UnoGetGoldELO2 votes

im sorry but did you just imply that yasuo has early dominance? 200k mastery here and he is far far away from dominating anyone except those that cant dodge nados. there are 10 champions far stronger than yasuo in mid and toplane right now.

Akali is SO HOT1 votes

Nerfing his passive crit chance will result in him going back to a Bruiser build.

WoonStruck1 votes

Not if he just needs 3 items to cap it.

You can nerf the bruiser build if it rises up because of this by changing his attackspeed scaling or base attack speed again.

This means IE+Shiv+PD becomes the go-to build.

DeusVult2 votes

If Yasuos starting building bruiser because of the lack of free crit from his passive, his damage would drop dramatically. Which would be terrible for him. He needs the crit burst so that he can stick to and kill targets in teamfights that dont happen in lane around a minion wave, and his ultimate loses the armor pen component.

So bruiser yas, who doesnt build crit. So, we're looking at item 3071 item 3022 item 3078?? Other than TF, which is questionable on him because of his lack of mana and low base AD, his damage would be laughable.

Even if his crit passive was hit, I still think that yas would build crit, because its the only way that he can deal the damage that he needs to in order to fill the role that he has

DunkinNoobs2 votes

Yasuo has already built on hit multiple times since his release, even with his passive as is. Nerfing his passive guarantees Yasuo becomes an on-hit bruiser.

TyroneWatermelon1 votes

While these very good suggestion they existed since his release,I would trade all of these for one thing: Yasuo can't chain up his Last Breath with ally Airborne effects

Calabok1 votes

make it so he can only slide twice

WoonStruck1 votes

E->Q no longer knocks up until rank 5 E or Q, but instead significantly slows. Lowers cheese potential.

Q duration scales with Q rank. Laning less oppressive.

Crit chance decresed to 50% or 75% bonus, so he needs 3 crit items to reach max. This makes it so bruiser builds with IE+PD aren't how he's played. Instead bruiser builds with IE+PD+Shiv are what's played. :^)

Gives him more of a hypercarry power-curve, rather than massive lane bully that hyperscales.

ThatHaleState1 votes

one main issue i have is that Yasuo's shield is always 100, but blocks any ability, even if it does over 100 dmg by defualt

Joseraph1 votes

I think the crit scaling should be something like 1-14, or scale up on ult levels because games barely last till level 18 now

48983507DEL11 votes

I'd love for his windwall to be changed from "ADCs are useless for 3 seconds" to something that's actually skillful and interactive to use.

Maybe if it was more like a giant Spellshield that blocks the first projectile it hits up into the air.

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