Step 1: Remove normals because Dynamic Queue is already pretty much normals Step 2: Add Ranked Soloqueue Step ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°): Remove ranked ladder from Dynamic Queue
HombreIgnifugo10 votesOr maybe just add Solo Queue for normal and decent people, and leave DynaBoost for people who want a fake boosted ranking.
http://www.cinema52.com/2013/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/DerpNedry.png
Support Evelynn6 votesU RIGHT
OyddAWqJ5r5 votesOr just have em both be ranked. Dynamic is Ranked Teams and Solo is Solo.
That way current masochists that enjoy being placed into 4 man teams can continue to do so in Dynamic while Solo Queue will be the place for the solo/duo's. And ofcourse 3's/4's/5's can still Dynamic it up.
I'm sure there's even a way to balance it so you hold the same rank in both playlists since teamwork at higher levels becomes harder (the average team made of Plat Solo's was typically a Gold level team back in the old ranking system).
jaymc113026 votes[{quoted}](name=Sleeper Cell,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7wrnzfYV,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-06-06T13:02:06.012+0000)
Or just have em both be ranked. Dynamic is Ranked Teams and Solo is Solo.
That way current masochists that enjoy being placed into 4 man teams can continue to do so in Dynamic while Solo Queue will be the place for the solo/duo's. And ofcourse 3's/4's/5's can still Dynamic it up.
I'm sure there's even a way to balance it so you hold the same rank in both playlists since teamwork at higher levels becomes harder (the average team made of Plat Solo's was typically a Gold level team back in the old ranking system).
No, it can't work. Dynamic queue can only function if it has a steady stream of solo players to fill the remaining spots on premade teams. It HAD to have them. This is why Riot wouldn't implement both at the same time. Taking away the solo players would drive queue times for DQ up 300-1000% across all levels of play as most solo players would choose to play on the equal footing of solo queue. Those two things cannot coexist. As long as we have DQ we cannot ever have a solo queue. As long as DQ exists the ladder will never have any competitive integrity what so ever. The real best solution is exactly what is presented here. Make DQ normals, return the ladder to ranked solo and team 5s.
LatetotheRace3 votesNah, DQ could exist if it was only premades of 2s 3s and 5s. If the queues were incredibly long, so be it. It's unacceptable to cater to casuals and cheaters in the competitive version of the game.
jaymc11302 votesNah, DQ could exist if it was only premades of 2s 3s and 5s. If the queues were incredibly long, so be it. It's unacceptable to cater to casuals and cheaters in the competitive version of the game.
I proposed something similar myself on several occasions. But then we might as well just remove the whole Dynamic queue thing, bring back team 5s, bring back solo queue (as a solo only) and then also have a duo/trio queue as well. Which is mostly the same as what is proposed here in the op.
My only point was that in its current incarnation, Dynamic queue cannot exist with Solo queue because the solo players are required to keep queue times remotely appropriate for DQ. Its not particularly fun waiting 30+ minutes every time I queue up and is a large reason I play mostly on smurfs these days.
OyddAWqJ5r1 votesThat actually makes alot of sense. However should we want to implement solo and team ranked i think dynamic is the best way for non-5's teams.
jaymc11307 votes[{quoted}](name=Sleeper Cell,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7wrnzfYV,comment-id=000200000001,timestamp=2016-06-06T13:48:52.346+0000)
That actually makes alot of sense. However should we want to implement solo and team ranked i think dynamic is the best way for non-5's teams.
As long as its limited to a duo/trio queue I'd agree. It'd be just fine then. But we might as well return Team 5s, add true solo, and add trio/duo queue. Which is pretty much what is being recommended in the OP of this thread.
4 man premades should never be allowed for ranked. That is a terrible experience for solo players no matter what with the premade tending to gang up on the solo, mass flame/report them, and also refuse to work with them. Plus it REQUIRES solo players to queue in that queue. Premade 4s should simply never be allowed in ranked at all.
6KEMBE4ORBA2 votesThere is more than enough steady steam of any players currently playing normal (including solo players) which can fill the spots needed for DQ.
Riot can even leave DQ with a rank that would be optional --> display DQ's rank: on/off :D
This way we get fully a functional true SoloQ and DynamicQ ;)
AkabaneKun4 votesAlso don't forget to make soloQ truly solo not the shit we had before with "duo bot with x" min 5:00 0/5/0 bs.
jaymc11303 votesU RIGHT
Mojihito6663 votesBut i am bronze and i want my friends to boost me to platinum on their smurf accounts.
HombreIgnifugo4 votesYou need to get Lucille'd.
https://tribzap2it.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/jeffrey-dean-morgan-the-walking-dead-amc.jpg?w=769
Nimble Manta1 votesDoes everyone forget that this is something you always could of done regardless of dynamic que.
Xeruon1 votesDoes everyone always forget that it is actually legal if you do it in a certain way in DynTrash? And that that certain way is 100 times easier to pull off than the classical way?
Nimble Manta1 votesSmurfing isn't and never was legal. Simply playing with people of a higher rank doesn't boost you, the system is designed to avoid that. What am I missing here?
jaymc11301 votes[{quoted}](name=Nimble Manta,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7wrnzfYV,comment-id=0003000100000000,timestamp=2016-06-07T18:38:35.900+0000)
Smurfing isn't and never was legal. Simply playing with people of a higher rank doesn't boost you, the system is designed to avoid that. What am I missing here?
Smurfing has never been against the rules... Ever.
Playing with players that are higher ranked than you increases your team and the opposing teams collective MMR. This means winning such a match results in greater LP and MMR gains as you are playing tougher competition. So yes, in a technical sense it CAN boost you. Provided of course you can consistently beat competition that is ranked significantly higher than you are at the moment. The system isn't designed to avoid that... its designed to DO that.
I'm not sure what you were missing here... except an understanding of how the MMR and League Systems (two entirely separate systems btw) function and an understanding of the rules in the ToS.
Nimble Manta1 votesI was pretty certain using smurfs to boost someone was against the ToS, but I read through it and it isn't. Nonetheless that's an issue with riots ToS, not DQ.
Provided of course you can consistently beat competition that is ranked significantly higher than you are at the moment.
Uh, if you can beat them then you deserve to rank up, no? That's not boosting that's simply climbing the latter because your teams averaged skill level is higher than their averaged mmr. I'll concede that playing with groups of people distorts everyone in the groups rank towards the average, and such the lower ranked people in the group could might get slightly boosted and the higher ranked people suffer a bit. That effect however is no where near powerful enough to call ranks in DQ meaningless. People climbing from Silver V to Gold because of DQ being "uncompetitive" is bogus - they either got boosted by a smurf or they deserve it.
jaymc11301 votes[{quoted}](name=Nimble Manta,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7wrnzfYV,comment-id=000300010000000000000000,timestamp=2016-06-08T19:50:54.604+0000)
I was pretty certain using smurfs to boost someone was against the ToS, but I read through it and it isn't. Nonetheless that's an issue with riots ToS, not DQ.
Yep
Uh, if you can beat them then you deserve to rank up, no? That's not boosting that's simply climbing the latter
Yes, that was roughly my point. The point is that it "boosts" you up the ladder.
Nimble Manta1 votesBut if they can beat people ranked higher than them then they should be climbing regarless of solo or premade. Unless we're in agreement here?
jaymc11301 votes[{quoted}](name=Nimble Manta,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7wrnzfYV,comment-id=00030001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2016-06-09T05:44:20.461+0000)
But if they can beat people ranked higher than them then they should be climbing regarless of solo or premade. Unless we're in agreement here?
Correct.
The issue some players are having in relation to DQ is that not every member of a team contributes to winning the matches so with a premade group of say 4 there may be 2 players pulling almost all the weight every match, meaning the group consistently climbs. But what happens when the two less talented players play on their own?
As you can probably imagine its not likely to go as well because these players are not as talented as the skill range they regularly play in so when they play without the two who carry they tend to kill games. So while the system is designed to help "boost" you if you consistently beat superior talent it can also boost undeserving players as well with the institution of Dynamic queue.
This is really only one element of DQ's flaws. It has other elements.
6KEMBE4ORBA3 votesHahahah
Shitposting that is actually briliant in itself. And as funny and trolish as it is, step 3 actually makes total sense cause the current ranks in DQ's ladder mean nothing.
If Riot actually does what OP has "proposed", all the people in the formal normals would now play DynamicQ and their number is vastly superior to that of the solo players required for DQ. -->
Which means that we can get a true SoloQ without "cannibalizing" DQ. Riot can even still tackle and satisfy the DQ's crowd and have - both a DynamicQ Rank/ SoloQ rank on their own ladder. :D
Briliant, just briliant. Post it on reddit or I will!
mirAcIe1 votesHahahah
Shitposting that is actually briliant in itself. And as funny and trolish as it is, step 3 actually makes total sense cause the current ranks in DQ's ladder mean nothing.
If Riot actually does what OP has "proposed", all the people in the formal normals would now play DynamicQ and their number is vastly superior to that of the solo players required for DQ. -->
Which means that we can get a true SoloQ without "cannibalizing" DQ. Riot can even still tackle and satisfy the DQ's crowd and have - both a DynamicQ Rank/ SoloQ rank on their own ladder. :D
Briliant, just briliant. Post it on reddit or I will!
Do it, friend. I don't mind.
Oerba No Naja2 votesStep :^) : add team ranked 5v5
Brimaz The King1 votesWhat would people under level 30 play?
jaymc11302 votes[{quoted}](name=Brimaz The King,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7wrnzfYV,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2016-06-06T16:35:43.141+0000)
What would people under level 30 play?
Blind pick mostly. Wait times for any draft on sub 30s can be upwards of 20 minutes on a regular basis. I have a level 22 with about 2000 MMR... It takes 20 minutes for blind pick to pair me. Draft pick takes over an hour sometimes.
69982196_DEL1 votesThis account has see Q times over 30 minutes.
Blanchimont1 votesI absolutely hate Dynamic Queue, but there's no real solution to it without splitting the player base. Dynamic Queue sucks period because it doesn't solve the problem of having pre-made groups nor toxicity. It sounded great at first, but in practice, I feel like I can be matched up with anyone one whole tier above or below me and that's just ridiculous.
I feel once you have 3 players or more grouped together, you should only be able to be queued up for a team match and no solo players will be matched up with you.
Karn Bishop2 votesSplitting the player base? but according to all the statistics DQ supporters pull out "The majority of the player base just does not care either way" so how would it split them if they don't give 2 craps?
Blanchimont1 votesYou can say that the majority don't care about anything ever because that's always true. If you survey anyone a majority will say they don't care. You can twist it anyway you want by placing the majority that don't care on the side you want to win. I can place the side that says they don't care against Solo Queue and it suddenly turns the numbers against Dynamic Queue because that's what Dynamic Queue supporters are saying. What you have to address is the people who do care enough for them to quit playing Solo Queue or Ranked altogether.
20% support Dynamic Queue 15% support Solo Queue 65% don't care.
85% of people support Dynamic Queue. This is insane logic that a lot of people use.
The only thing good about Dynamic Queue so far is that matchmaking is faster, but the cost is at the equal chances of a team to win, which is not okay. You do not place players who are two tiers, not divisions TIERS, in the same game, ever. I should not be seeing Silver 1 and Platinum 5 players in the same game together.
jaymc11302 votesYou can say that the majority don't care about anything ever because that's always true. If you survey anyone a majority will say they don't care. You can twist it anyway you want by placing the majority that don't care on the side you want to win. I can place the side that says they don't care against Solo Queue and it suddenly turns the numbers against Dynamic Queue because that's what Dynamic Queue supporters are saying. What you have to address is the people who do care enough for them to quit playing Solo Queue or Ranked altogether.
20% support Dynamic Queue 15% support Solo Queue 65% don't care.
85% of people support Dynamic Queue. This is insane logic that a lot of people use.
The only thing good about Dynamic Queue so far is that matchmaking is faster, but the cost is at the equal chances of a team to win, which is not okay. You do not place players who are two tiers, not divisions TIERS, in the same game, ever. I should not be seeing Silver 1 and Platinum 5 players in the same game together.
The matchmaking is actually dramatically slower than in previous seasons. Dramatically. DQ has no redeeming qualities of any sort aside from allowing friends to play together. Which they already could do anyways.
Blanchimont1 votesThe matchmaking is actually dramatically slower than in previous seasons. Dramatically. DQ has no redeeming qualities of any sort aside from allowing friends to play together. Which they already could do anyways.
My queue times have been far lower this season. It is often under 30 seconds.
jaymc11301 votesMy queue times have been far lower this season. It is often under 30 seconds.
With the new lobby process the ROLE you select to play has something to do with this as well. Particularly if you play or main a role that is in high demand and low supply such as support or fill.
Try queuing as Mid/ADC and tell me if you still have those consistent less than 30 second queues.
Additionally, the most populous portion of the ladder sees much less of an increase in queue times because they are more heavily populated. The top 15% of the ladder (Plat+ basically) is seeing much much longer average queue times for high demand roles. It wasn't uncommon to wait 20-30 minutes in D1 and Master tier for me in the past. Now its absolutely certain. And can often be even longer than that. Challenger players can wait well over an hour. To me, this is unacceptable.
Blanchimont1 votesThe higher ranks always have less people because of how few of them there are, but even at the lower tiers, it is ridiculous that they prioritize queue time over a balanced game. I queue support on this account (almost instant), but the queues are just as imbalanced. At Gold though, I rarely have to wait more than 30 seconds if I queue as top/adc.
Lestat S461 votesDo what they are doing to the high tier players to everyone. Tri-Que only. If you want more than that start a ranked Team and 5 man that.
Trique will give the group a majority to carry the game when the solos do bad. The Solos wont be playing with or against 4-5 man premades. Better for everyone
jaymc11301 votes[{quoted}](name=Lestat S46,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7wrnzfYV,comment-id=0013,timestamp=2016-06-07T02:31:42.157+0000)
Do what they are doing to the high tier players to everyone. Tri-Que only. If you want more than that start a ranked Team and 5 man that.
Trique will give the group a majority to carry the game when the solos do bad. The Solos wont be playing with or against 4-5 man premades. Better for everyone
Team 5s was removed...
Not at all cool. My lil bro's challenger 5s team that was hoping to get a chance to play for an LCS spot? Boned. Completely out of luck.
Lestat S461 votesThen they can bring back ranked teams. Riot only took it away because you didnt need a team to play as 5 anymore so if dynamic went down to Trique theyd have to bring it back.
jaymc11301 votes[{quoted}](name=Lestat S46,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7wrnzfYV,comment-id=001300000000,timestamp=2016-06-08T00:44:38.965+0000)
Then they can bring back ranked teams. Riot only took it away because you didnt need a team to play as 5 anymore so if dynamic went down to Trique theyd have to bring it back.
You can't queue as 5 in high level play anymore. Its already been limited to a trio tops. There is NO way to practice high level team 5v5s any more at all. There is no way to PLAY competitive high level team 5v5s. And it was these teams that eventually earned a chance to possibly have a spot in the LCS. My little brother had a challenger 5s team. They wanted to try for the LCS this season. They got boned and he's quite upset about it. Barely plays ranked any more at all because of this.
Its not an issue every player has, but its an issue TWO members of my family have. I would like to play high level 5v5 matches again. So would he.
Lestat S461 votesDude, did you think you changed threads or something? My original comment you replied too "Do what they are doing to the high tier players to everyone. Tri-Que only." Yea i know high ranks can only Tri-que. Then you repeated your story about your little brother from your previous comment. Heard it the 1st time brother. Making it longer doesnt change the story.
jaymc11301 votes[{quoted}](name=Lestat S46,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7wrnzfYV,comment-id=00130000000000000000,timestamp=2016-06-08T21:44:11.192+0000)
Dude, did you think you changed threads or something? My original comment you replied too "Do what they are doing to the high tier players to everyone. Tri-Que only." Yea i know high ranks can only Tri-que. Then you repeated your story about your little brother from your previous comment. Heard it the 1st time brother. Making it longer doesnt change the story.
Probably. Lol. Happens.
WoonStruck1 votesIts....its perfect.
Ace Access 1 voteskeep normals
Alleo1 votesHow about teambuilder ranked and teambuilder normals?
Meanie401 votesI see what you did there ...
Lajinn51 votesThey should just separate teams and non-teams again. Have dynamic queue for non-teams allow at most groups of 3 (Groups of 4 should not be allowed due to issues such as surrender trolling), and then just have a normal queue for 5s play.
Zoeeee1 votesI with there was better in game client support for finding premades that arnt on your friends list. Maybe have a lobby of players who need people to party with who are in the same division and sever as you.
