Fiddle buffs won't make him viable

Cryptocurrency··52 votes·4,571 views

Fiddlesticks is such a unique champion that he is very prone to indirect nerf. The new jungle is exactly that, hell there was a 6000+ votes post on reddit which explained all his struggles. Current buffs on pbe won't do enough to compensate that.

Quote: Every single jungle change nerfs Fiddlesticks considerably. Fiddlesticks is no stranger to indirect nerfs (cough Runeglaive cough, cough fear changes cough), but this is absolutely ridiculous.

Buff monsters loses their minions:

  • Fiddlesticks no longer gets bounces with his Dark Wind. For an entire jungle clear this adds over 20 seconds of extra clearing time. This alone kills the champion.

  • For reference, Nocturne now clears the jungle almost a full MINUTE faster than Fiddlesticks. They had about equal clear time before.

Raptor buff having more small raptors:

  • Even though Fiddlesticks likes jungle camps to have more than one creep, it can easily become too much. Old raptor camp was already pushing it, and the new one is extremely inefficient with Fiddlesticks E.

New Krugs:

  • The new Krugs is a cool idea, but it completely fucks the way Fiddle clears the jungle. If you use your Dark Wind the krugs die fast, but you have it on cooldown as the smaller ones appear and you have to drain and auto them down individually. It just takes way too long.

  • This camp is almost never worth doing as Fiddlesticks. Krugs were his fastest camp before and now it's by far his weakest.

Removal of Raptor smite buff:

  • Fiddlesticks was the best user of the Raptor smite buff in the game. Period. He completely relied on it to get surprise ultimates off. With that gone every ultimate is a gamble unless you have a sweeper or control ward area, which takes time and setup.

  • Possibly the biggest indirect nerf to any champion in preseason 7 is this removal.

  • The addition of health on smite does NOTHING for Fiddlesticks since he has such a sustained clear, so he even gets no benefit from the tradeoff change.

PLANTS:

  • Vision plant can see Fiddle's ultimate locations even though he perfectly cleared vision of that area. Huge nerf.

  • Honeybloom is mostly useless for Fiddlesticks, but this isn't the biggest deal.

  • Explosive plant can stop channels and thus Fiddle can't duel anyone near them. It doesn't sound like the biggest deal, but it limits your options in quite a few scenarios. Also people can use it to get out of your drain even if you're not in it.

In total:

  • Fiddle is in the worst state he's probably ever been in and that's counting when he was the worst jungler in the game in season 5.

  • It's quite sad since Riot said multiple times that "Fiddlesticks was doing fine in playtests". It feels like a repeat of Runeglaive where Riot kept saying it'd be fine, but we all just sat and watched Fiddlesticks winrate drop 7%.

  • MAKE FIDDLESTICKS GREAT AGAIN

https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/5ckvg8/fiddlesticks_is_completely_unplayable_in_the_new/

37 Comments

alfavhunter24 votes

how to buff fiddle

  1. drain will now finish its cast on the nearest enemy if its target dies during the channel (requires nearby enemy in range)
  2. his crows can now bounce off of himself is there is no other enemy nearby other than his target, this consumes a bounce still but each time fiddle is hit by his own crow it restores 1% of his missing mana
  3. add to his crows if it only hits fiddle and nearby monsters its CD is reduced by 30%
GinkoG1 votes

Wasn't their a patch that was going to let his crows bounce off of him?

Sexy Jack Rabbit9 votes

There was and it was extremely strong and had to be reverted.

GinkoG1 votes

Ah, I see.

Only Play Darius2 votes

They could make it bounce only off him against monsters

novac37211 votes

somebody made a thread with that idea. Sad it'll probably be ignored.

Leetri6 votes

Someone made a really good comment why that isn't a good idea. It becomes super unclear how the ability works as soon as an enemy champion walks within range and you'd have to write a short story explaining it.

RocketRelm1 votes

Alternately for less confusion on that last one…

3.2: Whenever a Fiddlesticks crow hits a jungle monster, its cool down is reduced by 1. This effect can occur up to 3 time per cast.

Woodakoodashooda9 votes

I don't even play Fiddle and this is the most solid argument I've read for or against a champion in a long, LONG time!

With all of the points listed here, it seems like RIot needs to revisit Middlesticks and make it a viable option again.

FireDrizzle1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Chocolate Frost,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7jHEz9KU,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-03-11T18:51:21.496+0000) With all of the points listed here, it seems like RIot needs to revisit Middlesticks and make it a viable option again.

Its virtually impossible to cs with Fid. They made Anivia easy to cs with but even before they changed her she was easier.

Fondling Gems3 votes

You really have that much issue with him? His aa animation is meh but his projectiles are actually fairly decent. Definitely not the easiest champ to cs on but I don't find it horrible. Although I used to play old Swain quite a bit so I am pretty used to trash aa's.

SilverSlayer4251 votes

old Vladimir , Sona , Swain , Karthus

Aeszarck1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Fondling Gems,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7jHEz9KU,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2017-03-11T23:37:25.437+0000)

You really have that much issue with him? His aa animation is meh but his projectiles are actually fairly decent. Definitely not the easiest champ to cs on but I don't find it horrible. Although I used to play old Swain quite a bit so I am pretty used to trash aa's.

I know Fiddlesticks is a good counter to some Champions too, like Katarina.

Fondling Gems1 votes

He actually has some pretty strong lane buffs to middlesticks/support fid. Extra fear range and more damage to creeps on E.

xScarfy3 votes

And if he fails to become a viable midlaner he can join all the other dumpstered mages who are going support now... :/

ForeverLaxx4 votes

Fiddle Support was already sort of a thing before this, though. Dark Wind against two targets is mean and an instant fear to save your carry is helpful. The only problem is that Fiddle is really squishy and on a tight budget he won't be likely to get the items built he needs to leverage his full kit effectively.

CircleKat14 votes

OP outlined Fiddle's weaknesses clearing the jungle; however, it should be noted that pre-6, fiddle's ganks are also subpar, unless you walk up behind them.

Then again, maybe we're all just playing him wrong. It may be time to break open lethality Fiddles...

New Tool Album4 votes

or we could just bring the old jungle back, i miss it

A Vel Koz Main3 votes

Start with his W, thank me later, his W does a ton of damage, has sustain and is literally on a 2-3 second cooldown if it lasts the entire duration

PureSilvrr17 votes

that isn't the problem......... [zombie-brand-facepalm]

yingwhy5 votes

[{quoted}](name=A Vel Koz Main,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7jHEz9KU,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-03-11T18:48:53.054+0000)

Start with his W, thank me later, his W does a ton of damage, has sustain and is literally on a 2-3 second cooldown if it lasts the entire duration

What else would you start with?

morris16 votes

His ultimate, since it does much more damage obviously.

LeonLye4 votes

You start e? Why would you start w on fiddlesticks? You're just asking to lose here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHNr8onXfQY

yingwhy1 votes

You only start E if you aren't going for blue...

Goatfish3 votes

[deleted]

SweedishGunner1 votes

I'd agree with this. When he's good, he's too good offering little counter play. When he's trash, he simply doesn't work.

SpaghettiVase2 votes

Its sad how far in the dust fiddlesticks is because he was one of the first junglers i've used and i love his concept, kit, and aesthetic. I hope that they turn fiddlesticks into a great jgler again and don't dump him into the support role

Troll for Trump2 votes

He needs a rework.

He's a squishy mage who needs AP to do any dmg. But if he builds AP, he'll be squishy. His ways of using the aforementioned AP involve him getting in people's faces. Squishy+rushing in people's faces = bad. Especially if you don't have much burst. See AP Ekko vs Tank Ekko in the past.

He also has utility in addition to the AP. Besides maybe dark wind, his kit synergizes well. The utility(fear/silence, 2 of the strongest ccs in the game) probably gimps a lot of his power.

He's locked behind his ult as well. Rather than being a champ who's abilities are improved or made more effective with an ultimate, it's more like his other abilities being dependent on his ultimate. This is really similar to pre-rework WW, and, to a lesser extent, pre-rework Galio.

HIs entire kit being based around a squishy AP mage suicide bombing into the enemy team, which is locked behind an ultimate makes him pretty awkward.

Karthus does a better job of suicide bombing than Fid. MUCH better

A Basic Island2 votes

rito probably playtests vs bots or has someone like phreak playtest against their bronze developers/balance team

Yara02 votes

Actually guess who has the 3rd highest support wr right now. yup fiddle yet another old as fuck ap champ showing up in bot

woodvsmurph1 votes

what if they nerfed his ult a bit, but added more engage range with it (not zac level, but better than it is now) and made his drain apply as an aoe to jungle camps -- allowing him to clear raptors, wolves and krugs without spending 8 yrs doing 1 camp? Seems like a great fix to me.

Matake1 votes

they just need to make W lower the CD of his other abilities every second he drains like xin's Q

problem SOLVED

Illâoi Evê Siôn1 votes

That was 3 months ago and they only tried out one of the suggestions made in that thread (bounce on Fiddle), which they then deemed too powerful.

[zombie-brand-mindblown]

Sire Hippington1 votes

As a jungler he won't get viable that easily, yes, but i really wouldn't be supprised if he sees succesfull play as support or midlaner after the buffs.

LeonLye1 votes

Why do this keep coming up? You probably don't even play fiddle. Yet, you complain.

Wolves(Lv 2) -> Blue & Gromp(Lv 3) -> Red (Smite here)(Drink refillable pot) -> Raptors -> Krugs. (Lv 4)

You take 1 exp rune so you can hit level 2 from wolves. Then you do Blue and Gromp at the same time to hit level 3. Use smite on Red since it's the hardest camp to take as fiddle. You won't die to raptors with full health and 2 skills on w or e, or you can just kite for cooldowns. For krugs, you can skip clearing the mini krugs if you want, since they don't actually give good exp 1st spawn and will despawn anyway.

Actually, you complaining about Krugs and Raptors is unnecessary. It's one thing to complain about solo camps. Yet, you complain about everything. You're not the only champion who plays in the jungle.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHNr8onXfQY

You can hit level 3 on fiddlesticks in 40 seconds. How is that slow? Mind that this was before the recent fiddle buff.

YoungSirJ0ey1 votes

Yknow, it's really easy to check whether or not people play a champion, and he quite obviously does.

Bobovich1 votes

More Suggestions :

1). If a unit that Fiddle is draining dies within the period of his drain, Fiddlesticks has a window of time, say 1.5 seconds, to redirect the remaining portion of his drain to another enemy unit by recasting the his W.

2). Lower the base damage on fiddle's E, but compensate by adding splash damage around targets hits with his E.

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