Does Cinderhulk needs buffs?

You can't compare the jungler items. To Dr. Mundo...its the best item. To Ekko, its pretty bad.

Honestly in my opinion i would rate it

Runics>warrior>Dev>Cinderhulk

The reason why I rate dev so low is because it is a risk item, if ur team get's behind, good luck getting any stacks, when warrior simply guarantees you good easy flat stats.

But on subject

Why are people feeling cinderhulk is so bad right now?

Simple answer really, who builds cinderhulk? Tanks and bruisers

Tanks like

Bruisers like

Juggernauts like

but oh wait...these six champions are very meta picks, most tanks do Ap damage.. even udyr..does ap damage...cinderhulk is also very nerfed..

so almost every tank will much rather build for damage and movement speed, to then go into full tank, cause now they do lots of damage, and lots tanking, it is also proven, that for the early game, that damage+movement speed is the better stat for ganks, it increases kill pressure for you can now chase easier and kill faster

People like Lee sin much rather build For this gives them 60 extra damage, very good easy flat stats, and CDR to allow them to clear faster and spam better, improves ganks, improves clear, easy good cheap item to get, then after that if need be, you have all the damage stats you need and can go full tank

Then we have the very hated Attack speed focused junglers who build into which will eventually turn into , IDK if anyone knows this if they are gold or lower, but the real reason why shyvana and master yi highly value attack speed is for the both of them, get CDR based off of how many auto attacks they are doing. So if they build into attack speed, they are doing tons of damage of autos, and can now spam more skills off of the constant cdr they are getting off of autos, if need be they can build into off tank items like or

In all three of the scenarios I explained, you can start a damage focused jungle item, then build path into tanky items or off tank items which will make you just as tanky as a person who built cinderhulk

ONTO CINDERHULK

Stats +400 health +15% bonus health

UNIQUE – IMMOLATE: Deals 15.6 - 25.8 (based on level) magic damage per second to nearby enemies. Deals 100% more damage against monsters (400 range).

Note-Can not combo with sunfire cape

Pros-Super cheap, ok stats Cons-400 health in total is only 4 auto attacks and in the late game only protects you from about 2 auto attacks from a adc sometimes only 1 (take into accounts crits and champion played)

Fact-If you do the math 15% bonus is actually not that much...

Fun fact about top laners

Unless the situation is super in die of need of what I like to call a mega tank, almost every top laner will build ONE damage item, then go pure tank, so because of this, because many people have won with this build strategy, we now know, that their is nothing wrong, with a tank jungler building a single damage item, then going into pure tank. For if top laners can do it, why can't junglers?

TLDR

-Almost every jungler in the game has a primary damage source -Every jungler in the game can greatly bennifit from building a jungle item that gives them a single source of damage -Cinderhulk with the current nerfs, unless the tank jungler is SUPER DESPERATE for tank stats just is not a good item when you compare to the other three

I was thinking of a possible way to get cinderhulk to scale a little better and I came up with that instead of the damage scaling off of your champ level, give it something like 1 damage per every 100 max hp that you have, that way the damage is at least a little better lategame and might have a bit more of an effect

Depends what jungler you use. Cinderhulk is great on Tahm, Malphite, Zac and I'm sure a few others. Wouldn't say it needs a buff.

How is Runic Echoes better than Warrior?

It just let AP junglers do their job better and let more AP jglrs come back into the meta. It should have always been like that.

My main issue with cinderhulk is it is a poor man's sunfire. It does nowhere near the damage sunfire does, plus it need the new sunfire passive of doing bonus damage to monsters.

It has delicious HP, so Lee Sin or Elise still loves it. But because of its secondary effects getting so nerfed it doesn't do much to bring in the kind of tank it should be designed for to encourage diversity. Part of that problem though is everyone and their mom's get easy Magic Resist in this meta and sustained dmg characters are so strong.

That is why and co. is under the boots of this meta. Oh and + needlessly getting buffed so it's the "standard" 3rd item (mercurial getting buffed with that attractive lifesteal so building qss isn't a dmg setback nor is mercurial lifesteal denial) doesn't help

It's not bad, but maybe it should be considered.

The thing is, I can't come up with anything that wouldn't help fighters more than tanks. Sunfire is probably the best effect. CC like gauntlet on a jungle item.... melee damage would LOVE that as they [should] have less CC. And same deal with CDR (maybe?). Maybe CDR is good.