@riot I was appalled to see the Brand nerf, may I ask why?

Voidac·Nov 27, 2015·4 votes·1,953 views

I understand people think that the fact his passive procs DFT means it's op, but that can be changed. I want to understand why after so many years you're deciding to nerf this immobile, squishy champion, combo-based champion by increasing his mana costs. Him being literally my favorite champion, I'd like to know why this was added. Because the problem I have with is is that the spell provides no utility outside of damage.

Brand isn't Lux. Or Vel'Koz. His W doesn't provide a slow or knockup. Hell, he has no slows or knockups. Just one skillshot stun. Which is why I like playin Brand. High risk, high reward with the downside being that if someone catches you and you missed/waste your stun, you're gonna have a bad time.

Please, I'd like to understand why the changes were made. If you feel it's for the best, then alright I'll just deal with it. But I do care for this champion.

25 Comments

SaltyKrackaNov 27, 20155 votes

Because he's been sleeper OP for a long time.

MarthianNov 27, 20153 votes

no he's been op for awhile. He used to be sleeper op, then Riot posted about Brand support.

Angelofchaos16xNov 27, 20154 votes

Because Riot fucked up (Again) and made DeathFire Touch, that since the moment I saw it , I said it would be OP on Dot champions. Now Riot will proceed to Nerf Dot Champions and DeathFire Touch, ruining game balance. Brand and Swain have always been good and always had massive win rates, but now , they are OP and Riot can't let that pass .

StreetonNov 27, 20153 votes

cause brand has been dominating and has even at some points been silent op

The Sword SaintNov 27, 20153 votes

He has a massive stun on a low cooldown, that's more than '0' utility.

His ult also punishes teams for being grouped, which is pretty annoying at mid-low elo.

VoidacNov 27, 20154 votes

massive stun... you mean his Q skillshot that requires you to land an ability beforehand? yeah...

The Sword SaintNov 27, 20154 votes

Yeah? And? It's a 2 second stun on a ~6 second cooldown. It's not asking too much that you put a tiny amount of effort into setting it up. Doesn't change the fact that it's a low cooldown long duration stun, which does no qualify as '0 utility'.

Also, lol at 'you have to land an ability first' when you can point and click 2 of brands abilities and the other one is an aoe that requires a flash or equivalent to escape if aimed on target.

VoidacNov 27, 20153 votes

Most people don't stand there waiting to get stunned. Not sure about you, now.

The Sword SaintNov 27, 20153 votes

Ok, there's no value in talking to you obviously if you're going to say dumb shit like this. By your logic, 'most people don't stand there waiting' to get hit by any skillshot from a malphite ult to an ahri charm to a leesin q. Clearly any amount of power is justified on a skillshot in your eyes and it's irrelevant how much power budget should be assigned to the ability.

ValexforNov 27, 20152 votes

Brand's stun is extremely situational and easily dodged (bot q and w are easy to dodge so even if you ignite with e, unless the enemy is stupid, it's hard landing q), it HAS to be strong or it would be totally useless. Like I said, it is strong, but it's no stronger than annie's or taric's or any other point and click stun/hard cc since it's hard to land. And yes, it is a nerf, but should build either item 3165 item 3174 or item 3027 anyway in his build, so it actually doesn't nerf him too much, you just gotta rush them one item before you normally would, so even though I don't like the nerf, it's not like it gutted him like most people are complaining (I mean, I can play brand and I'm not too good, so someone who mains him won't see any difference outside maybe the first 10 minutes where he will still be able to 100-0 almost anyone if he lands a combo).

The Sword SaintNov 27, 20152 votes

I'm not even asking for nerfs, I'm just pointing out that it's asanine to try and say he doesn't have both massive damage and long cc on a short cooldown. Brand buys a ryleis early and clicks e on you, and suddenly you're slowed for a million years and gives brand forever to set up a w on a slowed target while threatening a stun q at any time. So don't pretend landing a brand stun is some super hard thing that you have to be a tier above your opponent to do, because it's not.

I'd prefer they fix the damn particle and hitbox of the q and the w to match up over anything honestly.

ValexforNov 27, 20151 votes

If you have bought rylai early enough to make the stun easy to land, you are really good (since with a pair of tier 1 boots stun is dodgeable even with rylai on), and alos: minions block brand's q, and brand has to overextend to do his thing (and with no mobility, you take high risks overextending) that said he does have a strong stun, but he has 0 utility other than that. And yes, they should fix the damn particles... they don't match with hitbox and that is frustrating usually (for both brand and his opponent).

PoskeNov 27, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Brand's stun is extremely situational and easily dodged (bot q and w are easy to dodge so even if you ignite with e, unless the enemy is stupid, it's hard landing q), it HAS to be strong or it would be totally useless. Like I said, it is strong, but it's no stronger than annie's or taric's or any other point and click stun/hard cc since it's hard to land. And yes, it is a nerf, but should build either or anyway in his build, so it actually doesn't nerf him too much, you just gotta rush them one item before you normally would, so even though I don't like the nerf, it's not like it gutted him like most people are complaining (I mean, I can play brand and I'm not too good, so someone who mains him won't see any difference outside maybe the first 10 minutes where he will still be able to 100-0 almost anyone if he lands a combo).

No you should build spellthief rylai lyandr rabadon (Yes in midlane ) Or 2 dorans rylai lyandri rabadon. This build wont be as good as above build once the nerf comes

Nomicon/athene suck for brand mainly because rylai passive and lyandri passive are ultra important

Rod of ages is absolute trash for brand

Sadly cooldown reduction is also important on brand but thats why I run 20% cdr per level

ValexforNov 27, 20151 votes

Do you realize I am talking about mid brand and not support brand? You don't buy spellthief in mid. That said RoA is good on Brand since (unless you buy morello/athene) it gives enough mana to do your full combo more than once, health (that's good since you will be building bot Rylai and Liandry) and gives a fair amount of ap (never bad to have some on mages you know?). Morello is good since by combining his passive with rylai and lyandri you will most likely kill a target just with DoT by cutting theyr sustain so that they won't just sustain through the damage. Athene just gives stats that go well with any mage really, it's always good to buy one if you are in a mage vs mage setup (unless he's ryze/vlad, better morello with thoshe two). Saying RoA is bad on brand is like saying: item 3065 is bad on Vlad.

PoskeNov 27, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Do you realize I am talking about mid brand and not support brand? You don't buy spellthief in mid. That said RoA is good on Brand since (unless you buy morello/athene) it gives enough mana to do your full combo more than once, health (that's good since you will be building bot Rylai and Liandry) and gives a fair amount of ap (never bad to have some on mages you know?). Morello is good since by combining his passive with rylai and lyandri you will most likely kill a target just with DoT by cutting theyr sustain so that they won't just sustain through the damage. Athene just gives stats that go well with any mage really, it's always good to buy one if you are in a mage vs mage setup (unless he's ryze/vlad, better morello with thoshe two). Saying RoA is bad on brand is like saying: is bad on Vlad.

Oh but i do build it on brand mid. I am suggesting to everyone who doesnt to do it to since its the best

As someone who is high elo and has 200 games on brand Rod of ages is trash on brand Athene is less trash but still trash Nomicon is not good enough (It can work as situational item vs team full of sustain)

Spellthief rylai lyandri rabadon is the best build

Most of people dont know for that build So double doran rylai lyandri.. is how they build which is good to

Now Yeah brand is a mage and sure all ap items arent as bad as ad items on him. However rylai and lyandri effect is to important on him so he cant afford to build any other item before .... except spellthief which pays for itself (well half the price ussualy in my games)

ValexforNov 27, 20151 votes

I would never buy spellthief on mid Brand, ir doesn't make sense to build it + rylai since slows don't stack, I am in no way saying it's not good on brand, but at this point I'll go item 3041 instead and try to snowball and become some kind of burning apocalypse. That said, I never said you have to buy them early (well RoA is kind of mandatory to build early), but as 3rd items they can be good (morellogainst an heavy sustain team can do wonders as 3rd item, also that sweet 20% cdr works wonders with his poke), unless you are doing incredibly good and can buy them even later (something like 3/0 plus some creeps or maybe even better). When I will play him again in normals I will try about spellthief.

P.s. when I played Brand I actually liked RoA a lot, since I could just stay in lane forever, bully the enemy (i wasn't too good so I overextended too much usually) and still have a lot of sustain during lane phase/mid-game (and good tankyness late). Guess they are just different playstiles, but RoA can definitely be good on him if you can manage to build it early.

PoskeNov 28, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I would never buy spellthief on mid Brand, ir doesn't make sense to build it + rylai since slows don't stack, I am in no way saying it's not good on brand, but at this point I'll go instead and try to snowball and become some kind of burning apocalypse. That said, I never said you have to buy them early (well RoA is kind of mandatory to build early), but as 3rd items they can be good (morellogainst an heavy sustain team can do wonders as 3rd item, also that sweet 20% cdr works wonders with his poke), unless you are doing incredibly good and can buy them even later (something like 3/0 plus some creeps or maybe even better). When I will play him again in normals I will try about spellthief.

P.s. when I played Brand I actually liked RoA a lot, since I could just stay in lane forever, bully the enemy (i wasn't too good so I overextended too much usually) and still have a lot of sustain during lane phase/mid-game (and good tankyness late). Guess they are just different playstiles, but RoA can definitely be good on him if you can manage to build it early.

Just try out spellthief you can even copy paste my specific brand runes (He requires specific runes imo) though careful early game with those...

I tested all those items for brand multiple times Rylai lyandri tier 0 (absolute must regardless of game else you shouldnt play him) Spellthief tier is 0.5 - it outclasses nomicon so hard on brand . The fact that you can earn 1700 gold from it per game is insane. 50 ap 10cdr no more mana issues and actually suprisinly to good ghost passive fit him sooooo well

To the point where i wouldnt even swap spellthief for nomicon lategame. Seriously ghosts are just so good

at that point you should get rabadon because you already have 3 ability power items Last item is whathever,, game should be over before you get it ... but Ludens/zhonya/voidstaff/abysall would work

Cdr is really important on brand (Because of the abilities special effect hence why i Run 20cdr per level) so rod of ages is just trash. Rylai + lyandri gives you enough hp

Brand is overall a bad champ. Its the item/mastery interactions with his passive which make him strong

I am abusing brand in Diamond3 with this style and it works ...just try it

ps: It doesnt matter that rylai and ghost slows dont stack you ll see they dont overlap...

ValexforNov 28, 20151 votes

Gotta try that out, thanks for the tip.

lolipopevelynnNov 27, 20153 votes

brand nerf was long over due. how he went 2 seasons without nerfs ill never know.

VoidacNov 27, 20152 votes

You can't be serious.

t0ad5Nov 27, 20152 votes

They are too busy playing Yasuo and laughing into the face of people who liked to play Mordekaiser to know why they are doing anything.

ErockandrollNov 27, 20152 votes

If your asking why their targeting Brand and not DFT. (though really their targeting both) DFT sets the base line for all DoT mages. If DFT Makes every other DoT mage dominating, then it's likely it's too strong. But if Brand simply stands out, over his counter parts like Cass, Teemo, or anyone with DoT, then it's probably Brand, and not the mastery.

All said and done. Riot probably has no reason to support DoT. Since DoT is pretty fire and forget. Casting one spell, then running while your taking damage over time, is Completely uninteractive and unfun.

VoidacNov 27, 20153 votes

By that logic, you could argue that taking damage in general is unfun.