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Can we please change the ranking system on how you rank up? PLEASE.

WinBoat··2 votes·867 views

So I haven't played rank yet on this account tho my MMR was placing me with golds and silvers before I went on a losing streak, and now just sorta with silvers and a gold here and there.

Anyhow... Just want to throw that out there before anyone says"you're unranked, you got no say". I also seen a thread similar to what I'm about to say get downvoted, and honestly, I'm gonna sorta repeat that thread.

I honestly feel your rank should be based on HOW WELL YOU PERFORM in terms of KDA, and NOT be based on winning or losing matches. I think it's stupid you can derank from losing even if you do good in the match I know this isn't the only game like this... Halo or the old Halo's like Halo 2 did that, no matter what, if you lose, you derank. I don't like this and will never like this. I want to see a new system that rewards you for doing well, not one that rewards you for winning which is what this entire game is based on. If you win, you get more champion XP, more IP, more LP, more everything. If you lose, you get less everything, and just derank.

Why is that? Why do I have to depend on 4 people to have a brain? Yeah it may be a team game, but I shouldn't be punished for my teammates failures to play smarter, to play better than the enemy team.

I always found shit like this stupid. It's like being in school where one person causes trouble and the entire class gets homework even if it's apparent you didn't say anything at all. Why can't we just start punishing those who need to be punished? Not those who actually play their hearts out to win but end up losing cause billy joe here thinks it's best to go split push by himself and get caught out which causes a 4v5 at the baron pit.

Please, change the ranking system or just throw me in challenger so I don't gotta deal with it.

I know I'll be downvoted and I don't get it really.

16 Comments

disregardable2 votes

Not needing to win means not needing to play as a team. It'd be the shittiest experience ever if your entire team competed with and refused to help you every game. It'd also pretty much kill tanks and supports, moreso than they already are killed. Tanks and supports are extremely reliant on their teams to do well for them to do well.

Alox2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Very Toxic Jinx,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7G6EdP9F,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-11-06T19:28:32.887+0000)

Not needing to win means not needing to play as a team.

Well thats pretty much Silver elo in a nutshell... no one cares about playing as a team down there, it's winning by picking the fastest DPS snowbally champ as possible and either go 18/0 or 0/18 trying to 1v1 anyone they see.

WinBoat2 votes

Exactly dude. It's silver, bronze, maybe even gold. So if we made a system where your rank is based on how well you do every game, and not by fucking winning, it would be so much better.

Why carry retards to silver, or gold with you? Do they deserve it? Do they really deserve it? You go 18-0, and got bob over here who goes 0-10? Yeah he's gonna rank a little thanks to you.

By the time you reach the ranks of reason, people will work as a team, and use smart pings anyways. Especially like master and challenger you know? If the game was going by your individual kda and performance, those rank tiers WOULD STILL WORK AS A TEAM and not be just out for themselves.

This new system would help you get out from the low elo hell and let the bads be bads.

Alox1 votes

I don't think a system that rewards you for loosing would be healthy, I mean just having a high KDA doesn't mean anything if you aren't helping your team win (ie: the 18/0 Tryndamere that just stays top lane farming and shoving like a large super minion while your team is 4v5 defending your nexus towers is not someone that deserves to be rewarded).

I would however like it if they lowered the penalties for loosing, or increase the rewards for winning if you are consistently trying your hardest and playing your best. Like earn more LP for winning for someone that racks up kills/assists and dies less in team fights, vs Someone that just never groups with the team and only farms jungle/split pushes. Like wise less LP lost if you tried your hardest to win, and loose more LP if you spent the game chasing people around the map and feeding the enemy lots of kills.

That would do a lot to help cut down on a lot of the feeders that think the only way to win is to only get kills and not help your team take objectives.

WinBoat1 votes

Um again.. In high tier ranks, that 18-0 Tryndamere WOULD BE HELPING HIS TEAM WIN. Do you understand that? Do you?

I propose a good system that would help people RANK OUT OF LOW ELO tier.. A TIER IN WHICH is bad at communicating to begin with. You already see 18-0 tryndamere's just split push and refuse to communicate, what would be new if we added a system in place? Oh but he ranks up and others don't? in that case it would be your fault for performing bad in terms of KDA. Might be his fault for the team losing sure cause he didn't help, but when you fucking suck at the game and go negative, that isn't helping either. Especially when you got one or two items and do baby damage to the enemy team anyways. it's already a 4v5 in those cases.

So mr Tryndamere will safely go onto a higher rank... AND GUESS WHAT? A rank that will work more and more as a team. if he doesn't work with his team guess what genius? THERE IS ALWAYS A REPORTABLE OPTION FOR THAT. He would be reported and punished regardless.

disregardable1 votes

Can confirm, 90% of my games are not like that. I need support and a frontline to be the bestest Jinx in silver iv, and you know what? I usually get it, for at least a couple minutes of the game.

Austinodood1 votes

The ranking system is this way because of the lack of a better system even being possible. You presented a system where your rank is based off of KDA and things like that, well the problem with that is there is no incentive to win. There is only incentive for kills and personal score, when in reality, winning is what ultimately matters. And in order to win, one must play in coordination with their teammates.

Remember, you are the one constant in all your matches. Always focus on your own mistakes and what you could have done to improve your team's chances of winning. If you do this, you will climb.

WinBoat2 votes

UM THE GAME REWARDS YOU FOR WINNING..... Based off KDA? barely. if the game didn't reward you for winning, then you wouldn't get greater rewards for winning, for ranking.

And it's entirely possible to create a better system for player performance to rank up. If they can code anything else, they can code that as well. It's 2015.

Also, you people will say "well, the player will be playing for himself, and less teamwork". That's not true at all. Especially if they made a system like the one I want, and you were in higher ranks. As you rank, players would still work as a team in high ranks no matter what and listen to smart pings. You're crazy as hell if you believe otherwise. Oh but a guy trying to get a good KDA score so he can rank in bronze, silver, and maybe gold? Still, when do these low elo's listen and work as a team anyways? They hardly. There would be no difference except the player who played his best gets ranked up as it should be and those who went negative and performed bad don't rank.

Why should you bring bad players with you in other tiers? It's true. Pick someone like Master Yi jungle and just crush the enemy team and they surrender cause you're so fed and 20-0 when your team is a bunch of noobs, and gets rewarded with you so they can go on and rank and ruin the experience of a higher tier?

Alox1 votes

{quoted} Remember, you are the one constant in all your matches. Always focus on your own mistakes and what you could have done to improve your team's chances of winning. If you do this, you will climb.

I don't think that statement works anymore especially in SIlver elo, the problem with Silver is that smurfs (1 drop in the bucket), feeders (1 drop in the bucket), duo queue (1 drop in the bucket),** boosters** (1 drop), trolls (1 drop), AFKers (1 drop), new players (1 drop). All these external factors maybe a small percentage on their own but all of them together add up into a significant amount of external factors in games that you cannot control.

The problem with you as the only constant is that a solo player cannot easily solo carry hard in a game, even if you could, just one person ONE PERSON has the power to ruin your game, a troll, a feeder, a AFK if they don't want to win or they give up and want to quit they have more influence then you do.

I mean what is the point in trying your hardest, putting in the effort to improve when the outcome of the game is not determined by how you perform, it's who is the first team to have a player give up and troll? What is the point in trying when no matter what you do how well/bad you play the troll or feeder determines who wins or looses the game for their team?

Korillo1 votes

The common denominator in any game is you. You may have "trolls" or people who lose you a game here or there, but in the long run the majority of games you play will be 5v5 games as they are meant to be played. One person might be able to bring you down now and then, but it doesn't happen consistently.

The worst my rank has ever been was 0 lp in bronze 4 with a warning that if I lost my next game I would be demoted 2 years ago. The best rank I have had is my current rank of plat 3. So I have gone through most of bronze all the way to plat 3 so far, and I think the system is pretty accurate in determining where you should be placed.

People who say they are being held down by other players are not being honest with themselves in my opinion. It's pretty common to think you are better than you actually are. I believe something like 60-65% of players who play this game are in bronze and silver, so you really have to be quite a bit above average to be a gold player or better, and I don't think people really understand this.

I have been in the position where I would blame others for the times I was losing, for the LP I would lose. But when I started to only consider my own play, and what I could be doing in every game I played, I started to see significant improvement and my results were much better. I can only control how I play and that's all I focus on.

UberAffe1 votes

Coding it isn't the problem, design is the real issue.

Coming up with a context based ranking system (that allows for different playstyles, like support) is extremely difficult.

Actually I would argue that it is practically impossible for a group of people to create a fair context based ranking system. The only way I can think of that one could be design would be this:

Setup a machine learning system that observes all matches. And pairing in-game actions with if the game was won. Over say the period of 1 season of league it could reasonably have a nearly perfect understanding of what in-game actions are favorable and it would be able give different values to each action. The more value you contribute towards a game the faster you climb.

While that kind of system would probably be ideal, implementing an algorithm to learn something this complex takes a lot of time and resources. Which in the short term(6 months - 1 year) would have almost no pay-off for all that effort. Even in the long run I don't think it would help their bottom line all that much. Which makes it very unlikely to happen.

PIMPSMOOTH1 votes

As a support main who has pretty damn good KDA's on my mains Braum Alistar Annie and would benefit greatly from a system like this, and as much as it pains me to find a competent group of people that are willing to work as a team to win games, I still think there's little place for being rewarded for losing.

I absolutely HATE the ranked experience in this elo (~1200) as much as the OP (probably more tbh), as the majority of my games I'm stuck with a champion select troll, a dc forcing 4v5 and 20 min ff, or a rage quit/afk player bc they got first blooded and gave up. And this doesn't "feel like the majority" of my games just bc they're miserable experiences, it's actually the majority.

If there were a system that promoted players via individual KDA's it would kill every game where a team fell behind early. Players would abandon any lane that struggled simply because they may die in doing so, and this would be detrimental to their beloved KDA.

That Blitzcrank Jinx bot lane might be rolling along 5-0 but why would they bother helping the 0-6 Malzahar mid or Riven top if dying would cut their KDA's in half in ding so?

This kind of system would promote less of a team mechanic than exists already, and that's saying a lot at this elo.

Spoofghoul1 votes

Nobody in their right mind would go to mid and help tha 0-6 malz, the best outcome would be that he becos less behind. But that is still behind and this means he will still be losing, now if he is 0/1/0 after 5 enemy jungle ganks that would be different. But if you go 0/6 in lane you are doing something wrong and no amount of my or someone else help with get him ahead and let him stay ahead its just fact.

In fact if i start losing my lane to the point where i would need significant attention and help and a kill or 2-3 to get even again i will tell my team to leave me be and try to snowball elsewhere whilst i try to keep my enemy in lane without dieying or giving up tower. This will benefit my team more as the enemy wont be able to use their lead effectively without losing something, tower for examplke if the dude goes out of lane.

Just saying that not helping the 0/6 malz or riven is probably the better then helping them, if you can gain an advantage somewhere else. When someoen is 0/6 all help is likely too late anyway.

PIMPSMOOTH1 votes

0-6 was extreme, but even if mid/top goes 0-1, they're behind.

In a system like this - which puts KDA above winning and everything else - there's zero reason to assist them.

Jungle or bot lane players who might be even/winning lane wouldn't risk their KDA's trying to help solo lanes who are losing if it cost them rank.

WinBoat1 votes

UM you do know in plat, master, and challenger, REGARDLESS, it's more so teamwork right? You do know that right? I don't think you do. You are convinced if they made a system based on awarding those who have good KDA, that even in top tier... there would be less teamwork. THAT IS FALSE. If there was a person all out for himself, he would be reported obviously.

This system is more so meant for helping people OUT OF LOW ELO tier. Tiers in which hardly anyone listens, tiers in which there are lots of bads, and bad teamwork. So the guy with good KDA moves out just as he should. If he refuses to communicate later tiers, that won't fly with those people and they'd be quick to report him. I'm pretty sure the positives clearly outweigh the negatives.

Also when someone feeds regardless, they make it pretty much a 4v5 game. Having a extra man that's underpowered don't cut it when he does shit damage and is probably bad assuming since he fed. I have had lots of games where there would be a feeder who feeds then afk's, and our team PLAYS MUCH BETTER WITHOUT THEM. So yeah.

PIMPSMOOTH1 votes

I never said anything about "top tier" so you're either very confused or just putting words in my mouth. Anyone in bronze, silver, gold won't experience and ounce of 'teamwork' or in a system that promotes individuality only, and it's easy to abuse.

Using myself and you as an example, I'm stuck in Silver 2 but my KDA for my main Braum is 6.97:1 in 80 ranked matches. Your best KDA is on Darius and it's 3.60:1 in 73 games.

Does that mean I'm twice as good at the game as you are since my KDA nearly doubles yours? Should I be promoted two or more divisions further ahead of you?

So yeah, your KDA ranking system isn't implemented for a variety of reasons.

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