Is it safe to say you may have overdone it with Nunu a little?

Eedat·Oct 15, 2016·44 votes·3,008 views

Gave it some time to get more data, but we're up to almost 17,000 games analyzed and here are the results

http://champion.gg/statistics/#?roleSort=Jungle&sortBy=general.winPercent&order=descend

So Nunu is the highest win rate jungler at 56% while simultaneously being the 4th lowest playerbase average games on him. Which translates to Nunu having the highest winrate even though players have no experience with him.

Might need to tune back some of those buffs just a little.

EDIT: For those who don't know, playerbase average games is the average numbers of games people have under their belt on the champion. A low playerbase average games means players have a lower number of games on him, I.E. less experience. It's a much more accurate statistic than the same old tired "but low pick rate means high experience!" argument.

46 Comments

SohleksOct 15, 201627 votes

Wait you mean 4200 hp at 2 items 20 mins in is overdone??? :D

Handin Out NapsOct 16, 20161 votes

The funniest part is hitting 4k hp with Cinderhulk, Titanic, and Trinity.

Mira Arya EntheOct 15, 201611 votes

Nunu is always a little overdone... when I cook him Shyvana Leona summoner 14 [slayer-jinx-wink]

CrazyBear1987Oct 15, 20163 votes

[slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

Mira Arya EntheOct 15, 20162 votes

I cannot help it. Always been a pyromaniac.

item 3751 summoner 14 item 3067 item 3068 Annie Kayle Leona Shyvana

VenedictosOct 15, 20166 votes

Doesn't 4th lowest playerbase average mean that only Nunu's dedicated mains are playing him? Which in turn, explains how his winrate has skyrocketed to 56% and isn't really a big thing to watch? If his winrate is determined by those who are extremely good at playing Nunu, then probably he isn't so extremely strong as people make him up to be. Next patch will shave some power off of him and he's gonna be k.

EDIT: Forgot to add that Nunu is a tank and tanks always sit at high winrates because they scale so well into the late game and are relatively safe picks.

EedatOct 15, 20165 votes

Doesn't 4th lowest playerbase average mean that only Nunu's dedicated mains are playing him?

Means literally the exact opposite......

VenedictosOct 18, 20161 votes

If we are talking Lowest "Playerbase Average Games Played" yeah, it "means literally the exact opposite", sure. But that's not what I read. :)

Auz the RipperOct 15, 20163 votes

If you go to nunu's champion.gg and scroll down to the chart titled "winrate % by games played" you'll see that people with only 1 to 5 games on him have a 56% winrate.

flibitydooOct 16, 20161 votes

Although to be fair, Nunu is a 450 ip champion

his kit is designed, like all other 450 ip champions to be easy to understand and easy to use as starters. Even new Ryze, who has so many combos and so much potential as we've seen from Worlds, is relatively easy to pick up and use (just E+Q combo is enough to get by).

The Yetii RiderOct 15, 20166 votes

Meddler has already stated his intention to tune it back a bit. He said on the boards he was considering completely reverting the AD buff and lowering the health gained per Consume stack to 2% from 3% (max health gained 10% from 15%).

The Consume nerf is on the PBE now.

KazekibaOct 15, 20164 votes

The problem with Nunu is there's no penalty for getting 6K HP and then dying. You lose at most 1 stack, and its the same one stack you'd lose for standing still for 45 seconds.

You dont have to constantly regenerate the stacks, just bite one thing every minute or two and you're fine. Thats the problem. Make the stacks all fall off simultaneously, maybe freeze the timer while dead but you lose 3 stacks etc. More like a less permanent Chogath ult

WoonStruckOct 15, 20164 votes

The Yetii Rider when PBE patch hit: THESE CHANGES WILL GUT HIM, YOU'RE WRONG.

Hate to say I told him so (no I don't), but I told him so.

The Yetii RiderOct 15, 20163 votes

{quoted}

The Yetii Rider when PBE patch hit: THESE CHANGES WILL GUT HIM, YOU'RE WRONG.

Hate to say I told him so (no I don't), but I told him so.

What? I said the exact opposite when it was on the PBE: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/T64E2BF4-nunu-the-titan-of-the-rift

I made my thread about Nunu when the patch notes were released. And I didn't say the changes would make him weak.

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/G47qqkqF-what-the-actual-hell-meddler

I said the changes were the wrong direction and don't address how weak counterjungling is.

I mean if you want to call me out specifically and say I said something completely different at the wrong time go ahead but I can easily disprove it.

WoonStruckOct 15, 20161 votes

The two you linked aren't even the thread I was referring to.

You were talking about how changing the MS to OOC would gut him.

The Yetii RiderOct 15, 20161 votes

{quoted}

The two you linked aren't even the thread I was referring to.

A single comment on another thread doesn't represent my voice as much as a thread I created myself. These are the two threads I made about Nunu. These are my opinions. I certainly never said he was gutted.

WoonStruckOct 15, 20161 votes

Edited for clarity.

The Yetii RiderOct 15, 20161 votes

I said it would make counterjungling harder, yes. People aren't winning by counterjungling. They're farming up their own jungle and becoming unkillable.

WoonStruckOct 15, 20161 votes

Fair enough, but that was already the case.

People usually set themselves back more than they set the enemy back by attempting to do any committed counterjungling.

The problem is the state of counterjungling, and the jungle meta as a whole, more than Nunu himself though.

The only way Riot could help Nunu in that regard without overbuffing or flipping the game on its head is by increasing what you get out of enemy jungle camps if you have smite.

It could be gold, could be EXP, could even be bonus consume stacks that go past the normal cap on a separate (shorter) timer. If you want a champ to do a specific thing, you have to highly encourage it. See: Yasuo

Not only that, but the counterjungling overlap with Nidalee needs to go. She needs to be gutted as far as jungle clear speed.

The Yetii RiderOct 15, 20161 votes

I agree with all of that. My point is, I never said the changes would gut Nunu. I knew he would be strong.

SpecterVonBarenOct 15, 20162 votes

People were saying that with the INITIAL changes where he got negatives if he didn't keep up with his consume where his mana costs would be DOUBLED and his movespeed would be slowed.

WoonStruckOct 15, 20161 votes

No, most people were ignoring that because nobody with a brain on nunu would ever get that debuff on accident.

SpecterVonBarenOct 16, 20161 votes

You started the game with it and it meant that if his team ever fell behind then he could be shut out of his own jungle and become worse than useless.

WoonStruckOct 16, 20161 votes

You start the game with it...and get a free spell to immediately invalidate it anyway. All it does is force Nunu to start Q, which was often what happened anyway.

If someone's shut out of their jungle that hard, you've lost the game anyway.

SpecterVonBarenOct 17, 20161 votes

............ The free spell was added later. They made the change to have him start the game with his passive up after the reverted the hunger mechanic.

Not always.

JDB8eoX8x0Oct 15, 20163 votes

The buffs were unnecessary, I said so from the beginning on. Nunu's issue isn't power, it's his kit in general. People think "WOW JUNGLER SO MUCH CC MUCH GANK POWER!" but Nunu doesn't work like that. He's an exceptional counter jungle that is strongest when he puts everything on map pressure with ZZ rot and Banner of Command.

It's the exact same case with any other Jungler that doesn't have the best tools to gank with. People think they suck but they don't acknowledge the total damage to structures and objectives that they do. I.E. Nunu, Yi, Xin, Shaco. Some of them fall off later on and try to fix their issue by pushing, but then there is Nunu who is absurdly good at sieging turrets thanks to his ability to give minions speed buffs. The enemy team would notice it way faster when a Nunu actively pushes a lane, but if he doesn't push at all and only buffs his promoted minion, he indirectly pushes all the turrets and barely anyone notices. That's how I won 80% of my Nunu Jungle games before he was buffed and I think Riot was absolutely fine by just buffing his ultimate alone. That buff itself was strong enough for him, the jungle buffs he was able to get from eating weren't a problem.

Lord BoltrixOct 15, 20163 votes

Let's get one thing straight.

Nunu is a midget riding a distant relative of Harambe.

In-game, his job is to make others relatively more useless than him.

There isn't much Riot can do for something like that.

...except maybe give him a 3-hit passive.

I'll be leaving now.

(INB4 3-hit passive to make enemy champions roar in frustration for 1-1.5 seconds from becoming even more useless)

NebuulOct 15, 20164 votes

Nunu has a 5-hit passive.

CrazyBear1987Oct 15, 20162 votes

[deleted]

DunkinNoobsOct 15, 201627 votes

{quoted}

High HP, damge+Slow, self sustain and Self buff.

Stop this. You sound like a moron every time you list everything in a champs kit to make them sound OP. We get it, Nunu is overtuned. But don't list everything his kit does as if his kit is overloaded and that's why he's too strong.

CrazyBear1987Oct 15, 20162 votes

Then what else? I'm just stating an opinion to his question. What yours? besides criticizing mine. jeez

DunkinNoobsOct 15, 20164 votes

You'd know what my opinion is if you actually read the whole thing.

WoonStruckOct 15, 201619 votes

You listing what his abilities do suggests that he's overloaded, not that he's over-tuned.

Nunu, objectively, is not overloaded.

His numbers are simply too high, thus over-tuned.

Ben SharpioOct 15, 20162 votes

what did they do to him that made him viable again

VenedictosOct 15, 20162 votes

Passive stacks up every time you base Saves you time and mana. You get to cast W in base, get your passive up again and then save mana for your next spell cast

Q has 1 second lower cooldown at all ranks Self-explanatory, faster clears, better control, healthier clears.

Q now provides a stacking buff that is irrelevant to the monster consumed. 3% Bonus HP and 10 out of combat MS per stack. This is so good. You now get your stats from any camp, you don't have to worry about your pathing, you get to roam, you get a lot of HP and it lasts for a very long time.

Base AD and AD per level increased. This works so well for Nunu, because as a tank he gets AS Reds and on top of that, he gets AS from his W.

R slow increases to 95% over time. Gives him a HUGE presence in the teamfights and allows him to effective peel or lock down targets.

Cinderhulk now stacks with Q buff. (bugfix) That's just more HP. But it is still good.

Just Blame JennyOct 15, 20162 votes

I ban him every game. Screw Nunu.

TwitchInMyPantsOct 15, 20162 votes

These sound like Rammus, Amumu and Skarner's stats, which they've had OP phases before but that winrate/playrate combo usually means "I shit on lower ranks REALLY hard but require coordination/synergy at higher levels so I'm barely picked". No one really gets to run around in the enemy jungle like Nunu so its likely hard on low ELO.

EedatOct 15, 20169 votes

Champion.gg only uses stats from Plat+ games. So your argument is completely invalid.

Resonance x LFTOct 15, 20162 votes

My brother is a Nunu main. He's played a ton of ranked games as Nunu, and had an 80% win rate out of 40+ games with him, prior to this patch. I think the Nunu buffs are very needed to keep him in the meta. Riot tried to compensate for what was a bad jungler, so you don't get Nidalee, Reksai, Elise, Gragas, Graves, and Hecarim every fucking game you ever play, but then the community has to bitch.

MonkeyMadnessOct 15, 20162 votes

Ya, when I see 56% on champion.gg I get suspicious. 54% is pushing it, but that can be simply due to a sudden meta shift. But when shit gets that high, smthns wrong.

HahahahyenaOct 15, 20161 votes

in my opinion hes not overpowered but overly annoying, they just need to tune his numbers slightly. ill give them an A for effort on trying to bump the yeti to viability

BlakiepugOct 15, 20161 votes

item 3070 Azir

IdrooldOct 15, 20161 votes

someone have to stop running after nunu and dying from his ULT IN BUSH

but why nunu, why are you not bothored abt mundo who is even more less playrate than nunu but with 54% win rate

RocketRelmOct 15, 20161 votes

I think part of the issue is that before, players used to have a lot of trouble actually maintaining max stacks, because of jungle timers, convenience of camps, losing your jungle, etc. However, in the new mechanic revamp, they "assumed" his base power level was "having easy access to all stacks". So they just homogenized them. But nunu rarely maintained 100% stacks all game long.

It's not that he's significantly more powerful than before, it's that he's able to maintain it, and he can MUCH easier maintain this power, especially when behind.

KilljoyXOct 15, 20161 votes

As a nunu main. Yes. The nerfs to his scaling HP irritate me though. The ult is a huge problem. It's simply too strong as is.

ZerenzaOct 16, 20161 votes

Eh yeah he may need some number adjustments but the other thing is that most people just don't know how to play against him. This is mainly the jungler's job because of how nunu works with his invading. If the jungler doesn't know how to tolerate that, then nunu is just going to make the enemy jungler useless and snowball his laners.

Even platinum player's and above have trouble with him just because of his play pattern. The slogan for him is literally "Make the enemy jungler more useless than you are." and now that he isn't useless anymore he's more effective at his job and no one can cope with it because they just don't know how to play around it.